The English Football Thread

[Face]

Spoiler manu liverpool game.

Good showing against man-u. Sturridge looks good.

Allen continuing to be mediocre at best. His ONE plus is passing and he wasn't even doing that well today. Would've kept lucas ahead of him even with the yellow card. Gerrard top assists in the league and regaining form. Sure, a loss, but not a bad one.

As for lampard chelsea saga. If they let him go him they'll regret it. He's once again become the cornerstone of the team.

[Goofle]

Allen is a very good player in my opinion. Gerrard was garbage most of the match.

[Face]

Goofle, you're just anti-gerrard backlash.

Did you even watch the game, the amount of bad passes from allen was dissapointing to say the least, especially given that's his entire role. His defensive presence in negligible, he has no assists and isn't a goal threat.

Lucas is a good player, and is the player allen is aspiring to be, but is nowhere near yet. Rogers is seeing that too I think, increasingly using him as a sub.

[Trollheart]

Agree Allen was terrible, though in fairness Liverpool as a team were awful until the second half, when they started to play. Suarez quiet though: you'd have to say that one-on-one between him and RVP, there'd only be one winner.

Good to see Man City win too: keeps the title race exciting and the smug look off Ferguson's face for another week anyway.

Villa going down, down, deeper and down. And they deserve it. Shocking display, even if they tried near the end. Too late by then. Bring your shooting boots and don't leave them in the dressing room, have to go retrieve them at half time!

Kompany's sending off was a joke, sure to be rescinded.

[Goofle]

Kompany was rightfully sent off. It was a dangerous challenge that ended up being two footed. Winning the ball is irrelevant in those cases.

As for Allen, I never said he played well. He was just decent. Played a few bad passes but overall kept the game ticking for Liverpool - which is his role. He isn't there to win five tackles a game (even though he regularly comes close) or score/assist, his job is to make those short passes quickly around the pitch.

The consequence of this will be a few mistakes, but its a whole lot better than having some lump of a midfielder giving the ball away all the time.

[Face]

Originally Posted by Goofle11

As for Allen, I never said he played well. He was just decent. Played a few bad passes but overall kept the game ticking for Liverpool - which is his role. He isn't there to win five tackles a game (even though he regularly comes close) or score/assist, his job is to make those short passes quickly around the pitch.

The consequence of this will be a few mistakes, but its a whole lot better than having some lump of a midfielder giving the ball away all the time.

So according to you .... Allen "is a very good player" who "played decently", and gerrard is over the hill who "was garbage most of the match".

-----------------------gerrard -----------allen(off80)--------lucas (off45)
shots on target----------1-----------------0
passing accuracy--------86----------------87---------84
touches-----------------83----------------50---------39
dispossessed-------------1-----------------2
key passes---------------1----------------0
dribbles------------------1-----------------0
tackles------------------3------------------4----------5
effective clearances------2-----------------0-----------2
shots blocked------------1-----------------0
total passes-------------64----------------38---------31
accurate long balls-------8------------------1----------3

all here: Manchester United-Liverpool - Live Statistics

Compared to gerrard , allen got one more interception and tackle. Lost the ball more despite taking less touches, made over a third less passes.

Lucas played ONE half, made almost the same number of passes and touches, and made 5 tackles compared to allens 4 in the entire 80 minutes despite liverpool perking up in the second half.

Allen is usually within 3% of the accuracy of passing of lucas and gerrard (above or below) , makes far less passes in total, and is worse than both lucas and gerrard in almost every other aspect of his game either defensively or offensively. So, other players do his only job better than him, while also performing better almost everywhere else.

He has potential to be a great all rounder, but unfortunately at the moment he's just not. Lucas should be played ahead of him for the big games as he develops.

Bit long winded, but you constantly praising allen (especially when saying liverpool would be better off without gerrard and saying he was rubbish most of the match) is just ridiculous and completely unfounded. It just reeks of "controversial football opinion".

[Goofle]

It's only controversial because players who just play quick and often simple passes around the pitch aren't appreciated by most football fans. Whereas players like Gerrard - who has been World Class in the past - is praised for "having a go" at some ridiculous passes/shots which is completely selfish play. This is something that is frowned upon in possession based styles of play, which you would assume Rodgers is going for.

I think I have stuck up for Allen around three times as well. Hardly anything to get annoyed about, I just rate him. I was also somebody who rated Lucas from the moment he joined Liverpool because I appreciated what he brought to the team, even if the vast majority of people took three years to finally grasp it.

[Face]

The stats, ratings and pundits say differently. Rogers is playing allen less and it would be even less if he hadn't signed him.

Gerrard has the highest number of assists in the league and continually passes around or better than allen in terms of number, accuracy and distance.

And yet you praise allen while berating gerrard, that's what irks me. Look at those performances. "Gerrard was rubbish most of the match, allen was decent", come on. You're praising allen for doing everything worse than gerrard at the same time you call gerrard rubbish!

Point out allen's good points, fine. But your opinions on each player are more against public opinion than based on anything substantial.

[Goofle]

Stats - That's fine, although I compare them to a bikini. You can fill in that joke yourself.

Ratings - Not sure what you mean by that.

Pundits - Their opinion is no more valid than your own, especially when it comes from an ex-pro or a hack.

[Cuthbert]

Goofle what you said about Gerrard and in particular his passing is exactly what I was saying to you about Rooney the other week when we were discussing his passing.

Don't suppose you caught the Swansea game like two days after where thr commentators were almost laughing because his passing was that bad. He was that crap he got taken off.