The Official World Cup 2010 Thread

Bulldog · 07-01-2010, 07:15 PM

I think if anyone's gonna get the best out of Smalling, it's Fergie. As I'm sure we all already know, his track record as far as fleshing talented youngsters out into fully-developed and at least international-class footballers is nothing short of incredible (Giggsy, Becks, Gary Neville, Scholesy, Rooney, Ronaldo etc). By the sounds of it though (I know next to nothing about the chap), it may take more than the next season before Smalling properly emerges as a player.

By the time Brazil 2014 comes around it'll be obvious to anyone, even whoever's in charge that the likes of Gerrard, Lampard, Joe Cole and John Terry just won't be able to hack it anymore at international level. It'll be less obvious in time for Euro 2012 though, which is why I think at least most of that abomination of a squad of ours may very well still be regulars by then. I really do hope there'll be big changes in the England setup by then, but it's so much more plausible that there will be by 2014 though.

As for Wigan, barring an absolute disaster of an injury to him next season, I fully expect Victor Moses to impress again. He probably won't get a call-up, but I reckon he'll be on the England manager's radar by 2011 though. Ben Watson may take a season or two longer. Either way, both of them are among Wigan's most promising youngsters, and I think they'll definitely both get call-ups sometime over the next years, whether they're at Wigan or we haven't been robbed of them by some bigger lot

TheCunningStunt · 07-01-2010, 07:30 PM

Fergie's tactics are sometimes a little off, and when we get a late goal or we pull off a come back it isn't because of his tactics, but because of the attitude he instils into the players. A winning mentality, not because he changed things round a bit. His attitude and ethic are two of his biggest traits, but his biggest of all is his man management. Displayed perfectly in the 90s when he came round and took Giggs and Lee Sharpe away from a house party like an embarrassing father, not only that but the way he deals with players and looks after them.

I agree, I think by 2012 everyone will still be saying well, they are at the peak of their careers. The same shit we heard this year about how they should succeed but let's face it, Lampard, Ferdinand, Terry really should take a step back by then. Gerrard can stay for 2012.. but by 2014 whoever is in charge really needs to shake things up. I hope an Englishman is in charge by 2012/2014, I've never really fully been behind Capello. I believe an Englishman should take charge - Redknapp perhaps? But we'll see.

I remember seeing Moses when he was playing for Palice, I was on holiday with a city fan and we were watching the game. Palice vs City, and Moses impressed. I said hmm I wonder why a smaller premier league club hasn't picked him up? But I just can't see players outside the top 7 getting an England call up, but I hope I'm wrong.. and I'm sure you'll pull a name or two out the hat that have had call ups and been out the top 7. Maybe Gary Cahill would've been one this year if it wasn't for an unfortunate injury.

The best player to never play for England? My voice goes to Bruce.

Bulldog · 07-01-2010, 07:56 PM

The trouble is though that we've tried the whole 'English manager for an English team' thing pretty recently, and Steve McClaren turned out to be the worst England manager of all time according to the statistics. Harry Redknapp's has as many trophies McClaren had, but I see where his fans are coming from, as what he's done at Spurs in particular since taking charge of a relegation-threatened side was nothing short of spectacular. I don't like him on a personal level though - he's a bit too much like a dodgy estate agent for my liking

I think we should stick with Capello 'til 2012, as I doubt there's much more anyone else would do in his place in that time. Plus it'll give any potential candidates more time to add to their CVs - people like O'Neill, Redknapp or Hodgson to win an FA Cup or two, something like that.

I can see how it's hard to see any club outside the usual suspects having anyone called up for England, as you say, but it's still a possibility, especially if we can get a bunch of friendlies organised against some nice, easy teams (although, given our performances of late, that'll take some doing). As much as I hate to admit it, I can see Moses and Watson getting snapped up by bigger teams over the next season or two, and if truth be told that'll probably be the only way they'll get into any England squad. That said though, Chris Kirkland got a call-up when he was at Wigan (I forget when it was exactly), and Emile Heskey re-emerged onto the international scene as a latic too (just at the start of 2006-7).

Jimmy Bullard's probably my pick for one of the best England players that never were, at least from a Wigan standpoint anyway. He's well past it now, but in Wigan's debut Premiership season (ie before he went to Fulham and did his knee in) he was an absolutely mesmerisng presence in midfield, and really deserved some recognition from Sven. Going back a long, long way (early 70s) we had a midfielder by the name of Geoff Davies who was immensely talented (scored a ridiculous amount of goals per season, and went on to play with the likes of George Best, Johann Cryuff and Pele in the NASL too) but never got his chance with a big club as well. Matt le Tisser springs to mind too - alright, he had a few caps to his name, but his form going into it really should have got him into our France '98 squad.

TheCunningStunt · 07-01-2010, 08:04 PM

He's a knock off Nigel, he brought Pompy to their knees and fucked off just after he knew they were about to sink, but he's a great manager. Even if it's not him who takes charge, I'm just throwing his name out there. I just support the English manager for the England job thing. Even if it doesn't come off like McClarren.. Although I think McClarren really lacked the experience. He was Sir Alex's number 2 and then got Middlesbrough 7th place.. hardly spectacular. Though, it can be said for Capello that he doesn't lack passion despite being English but I think it just means more if you're English and you have that job. I agree, give Capello another tournament.

Yeah, I suppose there have been a few. But I don't just mean call ups and playing in a friendly or two, I mean players playing a major part in the team. Players that do play a part in the England set up are usually from big clubs, I feel people like Wigan lads would only get the recognition on an international stage if they move on. It's sad but true, it shouldn't be like that.

Jimmy Bullard is great. I want Fergie to sign him, he'd be worth the 2m just to boost team moral.

Tisser did have caps though I agree, he should've player more of a part. Staggering that Steve Bruce had 0 international caps to his name.

**Scarlett O'Hara** · 07-02-2010, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bulldog

^ The plot thickens!

I won't believe it 'til I see a good source report it either (although that could just be a matter of time) but, yeah, it'd explain a lot to say the least.

I agree with the bolded bit, but I can think of USA-Slovenia, Italy-New Zealand, Switzerland-Spain and Denmark-Cameroon off the top of my head which have been great to watch as a neutral besides the Slovakia game. Some potential classics like Brazil-Portugal and Portugal-Spain were disappointing, and so far as a whole the tournament hasn't been as entertaining as Euro 2008, but at the same time nowhere near as dire as world cup 2006. I've still got high hopes for a good end to the tournament too.

Yip I third that notion. Damn ref's games I tells ya!

But what I'm interested now is who is going to take the title. Go Deutchland!

Unknown Soldier · 07-02-2010, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla

Yip I third that notion. Damn ref's games I tells ya!

But what I'm interested now is who is going to take the title. Go Deutchland!

You trench digging Hun.

**Scarlett O'Hara** · 07-02-2010, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

You trench digging Hun.

If it's a war they want, it's a war they'll get!

Unknown Soldier · 07-02-2010, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla

If it's a war they want, it's a war they'll get!

If it were a war against the Argies the Bosche would win hands down, but in a game of football without home trench advantage......surely not.

**Scarlett O'Hara** · 07-02-2010, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

If it were a war against the Argies the Bosche would win hands down, but in a game of football without home trench advantage......surely not.

Gosh I hope so

They have to get through to the semi's, they just have to!

Unknown Soldier · 07-02-2010, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla

Gosh I hope so

They have to get through to the semi's, they just have to!

I think that the match will also just how good Germany really are, because in Argentina they are playing against a really good team.

07-01-2010, 07:30 PM	#1082 (permalink)
TheCunningStunt love will tear you apart Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 5,107	Fergie's tactics are sometimes a little off, and when we get a late goal or we pull off a come back it isn't because of his tactics, but because of the attitude he instils into the players. A winning mentality, not because he changed things round a bit. His attitude and ethic are two of his biggest traits, but his biggest of all is his man management. Displayed perfectly in the 90s when he came round and took Giggs and Lee Sharpe away from a house party like an embarrassing father, not only that but the way he deals with players and looks after them. I agree, I think by 2012 everyone will still be saying well, they are at the peak of their careers. The same shit we heard this year about how they should succeed but let's face it, Lampard, Ferdinand, Terry really should take a step back by then. Gerrard can stay for 2012.. but by 2014 whoever is in charge really needs to shake things up. I hope an Englishman is in charge by 2012/2014, I've never really fully been behind Capello. I believe an Englishman should take charge - Redknapp perhaps? But we'll see. I remember seeing Moses when he was playing for Palice, I was on holiday with a city fan and we were watching the game. Palice vs City, and Moses impressed. I said hmm I wonder why a smaller premier league club hasn't picked him up? But I just can't see players outside the top 7 getting an England call up, but I hope I'm wrong.. and I'm sure you'll pull a name or two out the hat that have had call ups and been out the top 7. Maybe Gary Cahill would've been one this year if it wasn't for an unfortunate injury. The best player to never play for England? My voice goes to Bruce. __________________ I don't feel and I feel great. Last FM

07-01-2010, 08:04 PM	#1084 (permalink)
TheCunningStunt love will tear you apart Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 5,107	He's a knock off Nigel, he brought Pompy to their knees and fucked off just after he knew they were about to sink, but he's a great manager. Even if it's not him who takes charge, I'm just throwing his name out there. I just support the English manager for the England job thing. Even if it doesn't come off like McClarren.. Although I think McClarren really lacked the experience. He was Sir Alex's number 2 and then got Middlesbrough 7th place.. hardly spectacular. Though, it can be said for Capello that he doesn't lack passion despite being English but I think it just means more if you're English and you have that job. I agree, give Capello another tournament. Yeah, I suppose there have been a few. But I don't just mean call ups and playing in a friendly or two, I mean players playing a major part in the team. Players that do play a part in the England set up are usually from big clubs, I feel people like Wigan lads would only get the recognition on an international stage if they move on. It's sad but true, it shouldn't be like that. Jimmy Bullard is great. I want Fergie to sign him, he'd be worth the 2m just to boost team moral. Tisser did have caps though I agree, he should've player more of a part. Staggering that Steve Bruce had 0 international caps to his name. __________________ I don't feel and I feel great. Last FM

07-01-2010, 07:15 PM	#1081 (permalink)
Bulldog why bother? Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: UK Posts: 4,840	I think if anyone's gonna get the best out of Smalling, it's Fergie. As I'm sure we all already know, his track record as far as fleshing talented youngsters out into fully-developed and at least international-class footballers is nothing short of incredible (Giggsy, Becks, Gary Neville, Scholesy, Rooney, Ronaldo etc). By the sounds of it though (I know next to nothing about the chap), it may take more than the next season before Smalling properly emerges as a player. By the time Brazil 2014 comes around it'll be obvious to anyone, even whoever's in charge that the likes of Gerrard, Lampard, Joe Cole and John Terry just won't be able to hack it anymore at international level. It'll be less obvious in time for Euro 2012 though, which is why I think at least most of that abomination of a squad of ours may very well still be regulars by then. I really do hope there'll be big changes in the England setup by then, but it's so much more plausible that there will be by 2014 though. As for Wigan, barring an absolute disaster of an injury to him next season, I fully expect Victor Moses to impress again. He probably won't get a call-up, but I reckon he'll be on the England manager's radar by 2011 though. Ben Watson may take a season or two longer. Either way, both of them are among Wigan's most promising youngsters, and I think they'll definitely both get call-ups sometime over the next years, whether they're at Wigan or we haven't been robbed of them by some bigger lot

07-01-2010, 07:56 PM	#1083 (permalink)
Bulldog why bother? Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: UK Posts: 4,840	The trouble is though that we've tried the whole 'English manager for an English team' thing pretty recently, and Steve McClaren turned out to be the worst England manager of all time according to the statistics. Harry Redknapp's has as many trophies McClaren had, but I see where his fans are coming from, as what he's done at Spurs in particular since taking charge of a relegation-threatened side was nothing short of spectacular. I don't like him on a personal level though - he's a bit too much like a dodgy estate agent for my liking I think we should stick with Capello 'til 2012, as I doubt there's much more anyone else would do in his place in that time. Plus it'll give any potential candidates more time to add to their CVs - people like O'Neill, Redknapp or Hodgson to win an FA Cup or two, something like that. I can see how it's hard to see any club outside the usual suspects having anyone called up for England, as you say, but it's still a possibility, especially if we can get a bunch of friendlies organised against some nice, easy teams (although, given our performances of late, that'll take some doing). As much as I hate to admit it, I can see Moses and Watson getting snapped up by bigger teams over the next season or two, and if truth be told that'll probably be the only way they'll get into any England squad. That said though, Chris Kirkland got a call-up when he was at Wigan (I forget when it was exactly), and Emile Heskey re-emerged onto the international scene as a latic too (just at the start of 2006-7). Jimmy Bullard's probably my pick for one of the best England players that never were, at least from a Wigan standpoint anyway. He's well past it now, but in Wigan's debut Premiership season (ie before he went to Fulham and did his knee in) he was an absolutely mesmerisng presence in midfield, and really deserved some recognition from Sven. Going back a long, long way (early 70s) we had a midfielder by the name of Geoff Davies who was immensely talented (scored a ridiculous amount of goals per season, and went on to play with the likes of George Best, Johann Cryuff and Pele in the NASL too) but never got his chance with a big club as well. Matt le Tisser springs to mind too - alright, he had a few caps to his name, but his form going into it really should have got him into our France '98 squad.