Led Zeppelin is the greatest band ever

The Batlord · 10-17-2017, 08:35 PM

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Originally Posted by Trollheart

I don't think that necessarily has anything to do with my lack of time for free jazz. How do the bands make money, though, if it's free?

Trollheart · 10-17-2017, 08:46 PM

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Originally Posted by MicShazam

You can have both broad and niche tastes, though. A wide variety of genres, spanning both niche and more above ground artists and styles.

I guess, given the premise of this whole discussion over the last several pages, that I'd say I respect broad tastes more than anything specific like a taste for avant garde. If someone has broad tastes, they would seem able to give a variety of things a shot and grow to like them. That's really all I need to take someone seriously. If a hypothetical other person knew everything about avant garde and jazz, but didn't really listen to anything else, I'd rather listen to the musical opinions of the person with very broad tastes.

So basically I respect the musical opinions of everyone on MB. No one in here seems musically closed minded to me. I don't think so at least. I don't have a good grasp of the tastes of every single member.

You're not grasping my member!

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Originally Posted by Frownland

Nah, people with ultra-niche tastes commonly hold those because they're unwilling to explore outside of that niche. After a certain point, they're basically the same as people who only listen to the radio to me.

This I would agree with. Nobody would ever call me adventurous, but recently I have, if not stepped outside, at least opened the door and looked nervously out towards the borders of my comfort zone.

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Originally Posted by Qwertyy

honestly i can't take you seriously until you've given black metal a serious attempt. idgaf about the other subgenres, you can hate them all you want, but no one is allowed to dismiss the trvest metal.

I agree one hundred percent. Black metal can blow your ****ing mind man!

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Originally Posted by MicShazam

There.

Where?

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Originally Posted by Qwertyy

batlord spent quite a while trying to get me into power metal but it just sucks. it's corny and stupid and i don't like it.

Other than that though, it's good, yeah?

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Originally Posted by Frownland

I'd check out The Fall but I don't think I could stand to listen to a band full of people with mohawks.

Mohawks than who?

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Originally Posted by Qwertyy

if you can pick out any lyrics in a Darkthrone song i'll give you $500

don't get me wrong, there are some cringe black metal lyrics, but you can't make out the vocalist well enough to understand much of it.

There are such things as lyrics websites you know.

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Originally Posted by The Batlord

I'm just gonna assume Elph hasn't even listened to any actual weirdo black metal like Burzum or Blut Aus Nord.

They are the ****, yes.

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Originally Posted by The Batlord

Not sure I'd put any country up there yet as I haven't been listening to it for long but I can see Dolly up there eventually. And honestly when I'm into ICP I don't listen to much else, but there can be months when I don't listen to them at all cause I'll burn myself out in a two-week binge. I won't argue though.

No Slayer. Worthless. And I barely even listen to Arkangel anymore tbh. I burned myself the **** out on Dead Man Walking. Surprised no one said Britney Spears too.

Nobody cares.

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Originally Posted by The Batlord

As for my top three? Anyone? Come on dudes, it's totally not hard!

The Batlord · 10-17-2017, 08:53 PM

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Originally Posted by Trollheart

As for my top three? Anyone? Come on dudes, it's totally not hard!

Your favs are generally pretty flaccid, but...

Genesis
Marillion
Iron Maiden
Rory Gallagher

Trollheart · 10-17-2017, 08:56 PM

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Originally Posted by The Batlord

Your favs are generally pretty flaccid, but...

Genesis
Marillion
Iron Maiden
Rory Gallagher

Very close, but I think Waits would beat out Gallagher, though I do love him.
Otherwise, spot on.

(Looking forward to Exo's; though there is now a thread for this, isn't there?)

The Batlord · 10-17-2017, 09:40 PM

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Originally Posted by elphenor

there was a time where I liked some Genesis it could be worse

Neapolitan · 10-18-2017, 12:51 AM

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Originally Posted by Anteater

All roads lead to Rhodes...and Michael McDonald.

90125 has its moments, mostly in regards to 'Changes' and the closer 'Hearts'. Big Generator has a few good cuts as well. If you took the best material from those two albums (and possibly Union) and put them together you've have one of the best prog/pop crossover record of all time.

No. I feel that Chris Squire slunked out of being at the helm of Yes when he hired Trevor to write that gaudy Pop album. Just cause Yes had the history of being Prog, it doesn't make that shlock by Trevor Rabin anything close to Prog, nor is it a great example of Prog/Pop crossover. If you want the best Prog crossover album ever than that distinction should rightfully go to Saga for Worlds Apart.

~~MicShazam~~ · 10-18-2017, 02:39 AM

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Originally Posted by Trollheart

Where?

Not sure if you're just dad-joking or if you really missed that I edited Qwerty's original comment.

Anteater · 10-18-2017, 07:37 AM

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Originally Posted by Neapolitan

No. I feel that Chris Squire slunked out of being at the helm of Yes when he hired Trevor to write that gaudy Pop album. Just cause Yes had the history of being Prog, it doesn't make that shlock by Trevor Rabin anything close to Prog, nor is it a great example of Prog/Pop crossover. If you want the best Prog crossover album ever than that distinction should rightfully go to Saga for Worlds Apart.

I gave you examples from 90125 of stuff that is most definitely prog-pop. Others would include 'It Can Happen' and maybe that instrumental 'Cinema" as well. So that's what, four tracks out of nine? 'Leave It' and 'Owner Of A Lonely Heart' are both a little off the beaten path as well, even if neither is in 9/8 time or 20 minutes long lol...

You can hate their output from that period if you want (which is fine: I think they were hit n' miss), but that doesn't mean you can write them off as Duran Duran either, because you'd be wrong. Go look at the genre tags on RYM and other places too. I'm just stating facts.

But to be clear, I do think 90125 has a few problems. 'Hold On', 'City Of Love' (which has a cool second half to be fair) and 'Our Song' all seem average to me and hold the album back. It's a mixed bag, which is why my ideal 80's Yes album would have cherrypicked the best stuff from that writing period up til '89 and cut out the least proggy stuff.

And in regards to Squire, he's specifically got songwriting credits on seven out of the nine songs. If he wasn't doing lyrics (which I'm assuming was Anderson or Rabin depending on the song), then that means he was involved in a compositional sense or maybe he contributed to the melodies. Either way, seven out of nine is a lot for someone who "slunk" out.

Worlds Apart is a great album, no question about that.

Neapolitan · 10-19-2017, 12:03 AM

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Originally Posted by Anteater

I gave you examples from 90125 of stuff that is most definitely prog-pop. Others would include 'It Can Happen' and maybe that instrumental 'Cinema" as well. So that's what, four tracks out of nine? 'Leave It' and 'Owner Of A Lonely Heart' are both a little off the beaten path as well, even if neither is in 9/8 time or 20 minutes long lol...

You can hate their output from that period if you want (which is fine: I think they were hit n' miss), but that doesn't mean you can write them off as Duran Duran either, because you'd be wrong. Go look at the genre tags on RYM and other places too. I'm just stating facts.

But to be clear, I do think 90125 has a few problems. 'Hold On', 'City Of Love' (which has a cool second half to be fair) and 'Our Song' all seem average to me and hold the album back. It's a mixed bag, which is why my ideal 80's Yes album would have cherrypicked the best stuff from that writing period up til '89 and cut out the least proggy stuff.

And in regards to Squire, he's specifically got songwriting credits on seven out of the nine songs. If he wasn't doing lyrics (which I'm assuming was Anderson or Rabin depending on the song), then that means he was involved in a compositional sense or maybe he contributed to the melodies. Either way, seven out of nine is a lot for someone who "slunk" out.

Worlds Apart is a great album, no question about that.

Duran Duran is a band full of exceptional musicians and had a lot of great songs. If you can cherry pick the Trevor Rabin era Yes, then the same can be done for Duran Duran. The best of Duran Duran would totally wreck the best of TREY.

I hardly ever use RYM, and I don't find it necessary to check how they tag things. The point being made was that just because Yes had a history of Prog Rock, doesn't mean that 90125 is a Prog album, and that it wasn't so Proggy that it should considered an example of Prog-Pop hybrid album.

That line of thinking that once a banded in labeled than all their output should be carry that label is kinda like saying Sgt Pepper is Beat music cause The Beatles were known as Beat band, or In Between the Buttons is a Blues album cause the Stones were known as a Blues band. 90125 is just an 80s Pop album, plain and simple. I am not saying that TREY is totally devoid of Prog. Maybe their are some elements of it in the music. But it I don't see how TREY is "progressive" or even pushing the envelope music-wise if they are just following other 80s bands, and at the same time not really creating music that is as good as those other bands. In Through the Out Door has more going for it to be considered a Prog-Pop album, and the songs are better over all than stuff by TREY.

Anteater · 10-19-2017, 12:25 AM

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Originally Posted by Neapolitan

Duran Duran is a band full of exceptional musicians and had a lot of great songs. If you can cherry pick the Trevor Rabin era Yes, then the same can be done for Duran Duran. The best of Duran Duran would totally wreck the best of TREY.

I hardly ever use RYM, and I don't find it necessary to check how they tag things. The point being made was that just because Yes had a history of Prog Rock, doesn't mean that 90125 is a Prog album, and that it wasn't so Proggy that it should considered an example of Prog-Pop hybrid album.

That line of thinking that once a banded in labeled than all their output should be carry that label is kinda like saying Sgt Pepper is Beat music cause The Beatles were known as Beat band, or In Between the Buttons is a Blues album cause the Stones were known as a Blues band. 90125 is just an 80s Pop album, plain and simple. I am not saying that TREY is totally devoid of Prog. Maybe their are some elements of it in the music. But it I don't see how TREY is "progressive" or even pushing the envelope music-wise if they are just following other 80s bands, and at the same time not really creating music that is as good as those other bands. In Through the Out Door has more going for it to be considered a Prog-Pop album, and the songs are better over all than stuff by TREY.

Bleh, we can argue semantics all day. To these ears, 90125 doesn't really sound like other pop albums of the early 80's (least if we're talking '82 through '83), and that's due to the inherent progginess behind Squire and White as they polished Rabin's initial ideas. Duran Duran are a good band, but you'd never get a song like 'Hearts' or 'Leave It' or 'Changes' on Rio or their debut. Plus, if you really look at Yes overall, you can see the clear progression of ideas from Going For The One to Tormato and then Drama through 90125 despite the differing lineups. Trevor Rabin merely served as a catalyst for the Drama "sound" to manifest in a more commercial setting and gave Anderson an excuse to come back.

Also, I think you are missing the forest a little through the trees here. You keep focusing on Rabin's songwriting like he doesn't measure up somehow, but Trevor Horn was coming into his own as a producer at the time and had a massive impact on the sound of 90125. He somehow took Jon Anderson's distinctive harmonies and melodies and applied them to AOR-inspired cuts that would work on radio, yet obviously went to some lengths to preserve the adventurous spirit at the root of the "idea" of Yes. He essentially pulled a Lazarus and brought them back from the dead for a younger audience to discover, which is something that hasn't happened that often in the history of the music industry.

So if anything, the work he did on there ended up influencing everyone else to some degree in 80s music as the middle of the decade because Horn was instrumental in creating the sound of that album...and then he became one of the biggest names in music production right after it came out. So take that for what you will.

If you can accept King Crimson's Discipline or Genesis's Duke as prog/pop records because they tried to synthesize aspects of both worlds and succeeded to various degrees, then it should be obvious why 90125 is often regarded positively in a similar sense.