Tony Iommi or Jimmy Page?

Dr_Rez · 03-25-2012, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milano

Well like I said, I was keeping a mutual opinion, though in this case I do agree with you and find that very easy to believe.

At the end of the day I think its impossible to tell. I mean ultimately Sabbath is the beginning of metal, and LZ is a blues/rock band. Sure each has songs in whatever category but thats what the two are known for, and I doubt the bands themselves would dissagree.

Key · 03-25-2012, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RezZ

At the end of the day I think its impossible to tell. I mean ultimately Sabbath is the beginning of metal, and LZ is a blues/rock band. Sure each has songs in whatever category but thats what the two are known for, and I doubt the bands themselves would dissagree.

Oh I'm not disagreeing with you on anything, I would name Sabbath higher than Zep any day, and at any moment the question was asked.

blastingas10 · 03-25-2012, 10:31 PM

****, album sales don't mean that much. U make it sound like a hell of a lot of people didn't pick up a guitar because of iommi. I'd say it's actually the other way around. Iommi was way more innovative and completely pioneered a new type of music, something that can't be said for page.

Page isn't even first in his category, he's second to Hendrix. Dont get me wrong, I can't deny how great page is, but to say he's way better than iommi is completely wrong. Iommi had a more classical sound in his style, and he was pretty jazzy when he wanted to be. He was great, in no way is page "way better".

SATCHMO · 03-25-2012, 11:01 PM

I think that after you dial back the gain on his amplifier, there's not anything that Iommi did that was especially innovative. He was responsible for creating some of the most badass guitar riffs in rock/metal history, but then again, so was Page. The difference is that Page drew attention to his talent even after the genre that had already seen some greats. Sabbath influence was more densely focused on the metal genre, but I don't think Iommi as a guitar player was more influential than Page as a whole.

Notwithstanding the fact that Iommi was handicapped by having half of his fretboard fingertips missing, a lot of what Iommi is known for are riffs that were fairly basic and mechanical. The guitar riff from Sweet Leaf is pretty stellar, but I don't think it can hold a candle to Page's bowed string riff from Kashmir. I don't think much of Iommi's playing really hold up to anything that Page has done. Iommi and Sabbath's influence were so great because they were pioneers of the metal genre, not because Iommi's skill or creativity were anything superlative compared to any of the better rock guitarists of his age. I think Page has it over Iommi easily.

blastingas10 · 03-25-2012, 11:32 PM

Turn Down the gain on pages guitar and he Didnt really do anything innovative, oh yeah, even with the gain up he didn't really do anything innovative. Page wasn't even the first to use a bow on a guitar, although he gets credited like he was. Iommi was one of the first to tune his guitar down and really pioneered the creepy and eerie guitar sound. He single handedly pioneered the guitar playing of a new type of music. Page Didnt do that. Page did have some heavy riffs but they were nothing compared to iommi. Page was more influential on blues-rock guitarists. But like I said, he isn't even the most influential blues rock guitarist.

Zeppelin gets so much credit as a pioneer of hard rock, in reality there were already some bands making hard rock. Sabbath was the more creative and innovative band. Iommi wasn't innovative? Ya right.

They both played some really simple stuff, but at least iommis simple stuff helped pioneer a new style of music. They both also played some more complex stuff. Iommi has some pretty good classically based stuff. The way he could mix classical with his heavy style resulted in a totally unique style overall. Iommi could even go acoustic and play some really unique sounding stuff, and some classically styled stuff.

Dr_Rez · 03-25-2012, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SATCHMO

I think that after you dial back the gain on his amplifier, there's not anything that Iommi did that was especially innovative.

I have to strongly dissagree with that. Every metal band in existance has at one point or still does downtune way below the Eb sometimes D standard tuning that many blues guitarists like Hendrix used. Iommi was the one who because of his injury downtuned his strings incredibly low for the time and as a result got an even heavier sound bringing the sound we know as heavy metal. Sure the first 2 albums are in standard tuning but live shows usually were not and every album after that was tuned way down.

He also popularized chugging. Sure bands had done some here and there, but that heavy 6th string chugging was pretty much his creation when artist look for inspiration in that genre.

Also you said it lightly that he had good riffs. He brought riffs of which noone had heard anything like every before. Their is a reason every metal band cites him as the main reference. just like every blues guitarist talks about BB King or Albert King etc. Have him play 2 notes and you know its him. Sure he wasnt fast and doesnt shred circles around other guitar prodigies but surely you can acknowledge noone was playing anyhting that sounded remotely like him at the time.

blastingas10 · 03-25-2012, 11:53 PM

He's not the fastest but he was pretty fast. In no way was he "not fast", especially for his time. He has plenty of solos that are every bit as fast as page solos. Page was probably faster but not that much.

I don't know anyone who did palm muted riffing before iommi, and that became a staple of heavy metal.

Zosofancmr1 · 03-26-2012, 12:02 AM

I think if you want to think about it purely in terms of who caused more people to pick up a guitar, then that would be Jimmy Page. His music has a broader base of appeal. When Led Zeppelin reformed in 2007, how many millions of people registered just to get the chance to get a ticket? How many rock legends were in the audience that night. I think also to say that Page was second in the blues rock category is also unfair as that boils down to a question of taste. Also, if you don't think Page didn't do acoustic, listen to Led Zeppelin III, almost all of there albums have some acoustic music, and after 1972, they did an acoustic set every night. Jimmy Page could play circles around Tony Iommi, he was just a more talented guitarist, that isn't opinion, that is just fact.

blastingas10 · 03-26-2012, 12:07 AM

O I know page could do acoustic. He did it a lot, and that has something to do with iommi being the more influential metal guitarist.

And really, that's a fact? It's a fact that it's not a fact. I'd say it's a fact that page is second to Hendrix when it comes to blues rock, but that's just me.

Key · 03-26-2012, 12:08 AM

Difference is, Black Sabbath are heavy metal and pack a punch.

Led Zeppelin are not heavy metal, never have been, and are good when the mood strikes.

View Poll Results: Tony Iommi or Jimmy Page?
Tony Iommi	50	40.98%
Jimmy Page	72	59.02%
Voters: 122. You may not vote on this poll

03-25-2012, 10:31 PM	#93 (permalink)
blastingas10 Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,126	***, album sales don't mean that much. U make it sound like a hell of a lot of people didn't pick up a guitar because of iommi. I'd say it's actually the other way around. Iommi was way more innovative and completely pioneered a new type of music, something that can't be said for page. Page isn't even first in his category, he's second to Hendrix. Dont get me wrong, I can't deny how great page is, but to say he's way better than iommi is completely wrong. Iommi had a more classical sound in his style, and he was pretty jazzy when he wanted to be. He was great, in no way is page "way better". Last edited by blastingas10; 03-25-2012 at 10:49 PM.*

03-25-2012, 11:32 PM	#95 (permalink)
blastingas10 Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,126	Turn Down the gain on pages guitar and he Didnt really do anything innovative, oh yeah, even with the gain up he didn't really do anything innovative. Page wasn't even the first to use a bow on a guitar, although he gets credited like he was. Iommi was one of the first to tune his guitar down and really pioneered the creepy and eerie guitar sound. He single handedly pioneered the guitar playing of a new type of music. Page Didnt do that. Page did have some heavy riffs but they were nothing compared to iommi. Page was more influential on blues-rock guitarists. But like I said, he isn't even the most influential blues rock guitarist. Zeppelin gets so much credit as a pioneer of hard rock, in reality there were already some bands making hard rock. Sabbath was the more creative and innovative band. Iommi wasn't innovative? Ya right. They both played some really simple stuff, but at least iommis simple stuff helped pioneer a new style of music. They both also played some more complex stuff. Iommi has some pretty good classically based stuff. The way he could mix classical with his heavy style resulted in a totally unique style overall. Iommi could even go acoustic and play some really unique sounding stuff, and some classically styled stuff. Last edited by blastingas10; 03-25-2012 at 11:43 PM.

03-26-2012, 12:02 AM	#98 (permalink)
Zosofancmr1 Groupie Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Puyallup, WA Posts: 26	I think if you want to think about it purely in terms of who caused more people to pick up a guitar, then that would be Jimmy Page. His music has a broader base of appeal. When Led Zeppelin reformed in 2007, how many millions of people registered just to get the chance to get a ticket? How many rock legends were in the audience that night. I think also to say that Page was second in the blues rock category is also unfair as that boils down to a question of taste. Also, if you don't think Page didn't do acoustic, listen to Led Zeppelin III, almost all of there albums have some acoustic music, and after 1972, they did an acoustic set every night. Jimmy Page could play circles around Tony Iommi, he was just a more talented guitarist, that isn't opinion, that is just fact. __________________ [Signature removed. No advertising please]

03-25-2012, 11:01 PM	#94 (permalink)
SATCHMO Al Dente Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 4,708	I think that after you dial back the gain on his amplifier, there's not anything that Iommi did that was especially innovative. He was responsible for creating some of the most badass guitar riffs in rock/metal history, but then again, so was Page. The difference is that Page drew attention to his talent even after the genre that had already seen some greats. Sabbath influence was more densely focused on the metal genre, but I don't think Iommi as a guitar player was more influential than Page as a whole. Notwithstanding the fact that Iommi was handicapped by having half of his fretboard fingertips missing, a lot of what Iommi is known for are riffs that were fairly basic and mechanical. The guitar riff from Sweet Leaf is pretty stellar, but I don't think it can hold a candle to Page's bowed string riff from Kashmir. I don't think much of Iommi's playing really hold up to anything that Page has done. Iommi and Sabbath's influence were so great because they were pioneers of the metal genre, not because Iommi's skill or creativity were anything superlative compared to any of the better rock guitarists of his age. I think Page has it over Iommi easily.

03-25-2012, 11:53 PM	#97 (permalink)
blastingas10 Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,126	He's not the fastest but he was pretty fast. In no way was he "not fast", especially for his time. He has plenty of solos that are every bit as fast as page solos. Page was probably faster but not that much. I don't know anyone who did palm muted riffing before iommi, and that became a staple of heavy metal.

03-26-2012, 12:07 AM	#99 (permalink)
blastingas10 Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,126	O I know page could do acoustic. He did it a lot, and that has something to do with iommi being the more influential metal guitarist. And really, that's a fact? It's a fact that it's not a fact. I'd say it's a fact that page is second to Hendrix when it comes to blues rock, but that's just me.

03-26-2012, 12:08 AM	#100 (permalink)
Key . Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 13,153	Difference is, Black Sabbath are heavy metal and pack a punch. Led Zeppelin are not heavy metal, never have been, and are good when the mood strikes.