The Unfan

I've determined that good black metal is black metal that isn't all that black metal sounding. Bathory were fairly thrashy, Ludicra takes a lot from crust, Old Man's Child is heavily influenced by death metal, and early Rotting Christ had a lot of gothicness to their sound. When black metal does deviate from being just black metal I do think its capable of being both crushing and beautiful at the same time. I have no doubt that well written black metal can be leagues ahead of death metal.

On the other hand, even the most generic garbage death metal bands find a way of being entertaining to some degree. I don't know why it is, but death metal just is "that sound" for me.

Janszoon

I know what you're saying. I think it's because death metal bands seem to not take themselves as seriously. It sounds strange to say by I think there's a bit more playfulness in the music.

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jackhammer

Death Metal to me seemed to concentrate on riffs and tempo whereas Black Metal (eventually) evolved into creating a certain ambience that is usualy ruined completely by terrible vocals.

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Janszoon

I could see that. I also think in black metal there's much more of an emphasis on image than in death metal and it's a silly image that's impossible to take seriously even though, apparently, it's not intended as a joke.

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A Night in the Life of the Invisible Man

Time & Place

25 Albums You Should Hear Before the Moon Crashes into the Earth and We All Die

last.fm

Mojo

This is exactly, word for word the reasons behind me being more than fussy when it comes to Black Metal.

Embracethedeath

I don't think black metal "that doesn't sound black metally" doesn't determine good bm. Old Man's Child, tbh, kinda sucks, and Bathory can be lumped in their with a lot of first wave bands which aren't completely true bm as we know it today. What about Emperor, Nagelfar, Nokturnal Mortum, Countess, Burzum, Limbonic Art, Darkthrone? Mostly pure bm but all insanely awesome. Black metal's focus on ambience rather than aggression and extremity makes it a harder subgenre to get into. I don't think that the vocals are terrible by any means, and that if you really give bm a shot its fairly accessible.

Mojo

To some people maybe, if you like that kind of thing. I listen to a lot of metal and i've given black metal a try but i think its far from accessible.

jackhammer

Where do you guys stand on Agalloch? I think The Mantle is absolutely stunning but there are a lot of haters too. I think you should give that a chance mojopinuk although there are only hints of Black Metal.

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Mojo

I always have an ear open for Black Metal I might genuinely be able to get into, so maybe I will.

The only Black Metal I have heard that I like, and please keep in mind some of thse are artists that are NOT strictly Black Metal and may have just dabbled in it in places are Darkthrone, Celtic Frost, Bathory, Burzum, Enslaved....I'm already struggling.

Voice_of_the_Soul12,13,01

1349
Anaal Nathrakh
Arcturus
Astriaal
Carpathian Forest
Chthonic
Dark Funeral
Darkthrone
Dimmu Borgir
Emperor
Immortal
Kovenant (In Times Before Light)
Mayhem
Old Man's Child
Satyricon
Troll
Venom

My favorites out of Black Metal.

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I don't mean to dwell
But I can't help myself
When I feel the vibe
And taste a memory
Of a time in life
When years seemed to stand still