Stuck in the middle!

Will-O'-The-Wisp · 02-22-2013, 12:39 AM

I don't know if anyone knows the danish death metal band: Illdisposed?

Well, long story short - the lead singer, Bo Summer, is a raging nazi, and was the founder of an organisation for football fans, called White Pride.

When I tell people that I'm a big Illdisposed fan (cause I am - I think there music blows my mind), they always get offended or mad at me because they think I share the same ideology!

- I can't say it clear enough: I don't sympathize with there political opinion! Not at all! ...But I do like the music, and I can easily separate those things.

What's your opinion? Is okay to listen to a band who makes great music, even though the lead singer is a nazi?

misspoptart · 02-22-2013, 05:47 AM

Yes. Music is music. Nazis are nazis. I thought Nazis didn't listen to or make music. But hey, you learn something new every day.

Lisnaholic · 02-22-2013, 08:36 AM

I`m not so sure it`s that cut-and-dried, tbh.

In war-torn Europe, Einstein hoped that scientists would constitute an apolitical brotherhood irrespective of their national or political affiliations. Although there were some notable successes,(e.g. his famous collaboration with Eddington,) a lot of scientists got embroiled in political squabbles. One problem was that Nazi scientists would either steal, or fail to recognise the contributions of scientists they considered racially suspect.

Of course, science is not music. Science is a logical system in which every genuine contribution has to be given its due for the system to function and evolve. Music, on the other hand, however much we love it, is just an optional passing pleasure.

I`m not absolutely sure, but I think, with so much other music available, I wouldn`t give any encouragement to Bo Summer. If he is, as you say, "a raging nazi", he is presumably drawing a line himself, saying,"These musicians are acceptable to me, these are not." If he is adopting an intolerant attitude like that, based on considerations other than musical merit, I would much rather look elsewhere for my musical pleasure, to show solidarity with musicians who have an underlying humanitarian respect for other people.

I`ve put in a couple of "if"s because all I know about this guy and his music is what you`ve just posted, but my gut tells me that if he does negate the musical merit of other people for political reasons, then why should I respect his musical merit, giving him a benefit that he denies to others ?

Trollheart · 02-23-2013, 02:25 PM

I would have to agree with Lisnaholic. I had a situation recently where I was looking at music by an artiste who called himself Babylon Mystery Orchestra, I think, basically one guy. But when I looked into his details he was a bigot, a racist, a creationist and homophobic. Now of course I wasn't a fan of his --- I listened to his music and it was okay, nothing special --- but had to decide did I do a feature on him and thereby give his ideas/opinions/existence the oxygen of publicity, however minor, or did I just ignore him? In the end I went with the latter, because no matter how good (or bad) his music was, I felt I couldn't in conscience recommend or praise it, knowing what underpinned it.

As far as this band goes, I'd add to what Lis has said that every time you buy one of their albums you could (could) be contributing to some hate fund or campaign: you don't know where the money made is going, and if he's a raging Nazi, then it could be going places you'd prefer it didn't and being used for purposes that you would never yourself condone.

Of course you have to separate music from beliefs, to some extent, but even so there's a line to be drawn, and I personally would never feel comfortable listening to music I knew was made by someone who had those views.

Hip Hop Bunny Hop will no doubt be along shortly to tell you I'm full of ****...

Lisnaholic · 02-23-2013, 07:15 PM

^ Turns out that I`m here before HHBH, to say thanks, Trollheart. It`s re-assuring to know that you and I are on the same page.
This bit, particularly, is x 2 :

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Of course you have to separate music from beliefs, to some extent, but even so there's a line to be drawn, and I personally would never feel comfortable listening to music I knew was made by someone who had those views.

02-22-2013, 12:39 AM	#1 (permalink)
Will-O'-The-Wisp Groupie Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 15	Stuck in the middle! I don't know if anyone knows the danish death metal band: Illdisposed? Well, long story short - the lead singer, Bo Summer, is a raging nazi, and was the founder of an organisation for football fans, called White Pride. When I tell people that I'm a big Illdisposed fan (cause I am - I think there music blows my mind), they always get offended or mad at me because they think I share the same ideology! - I can't say it clear enough: I don't sympathize with there political opinion! Not at all! ...But I do like the music, and I can easily separate those things. What's your opinion? Is okay to listen to a band who makes great music, even though the lead singer is a nazi?

02-22-2013, 08:36 AM	#3 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	I`m not so sure it`s that cut-and-dried, tbh. In war-torn Europe, Einstein hoped that scientists would constitute an apolitical brotherhood irrespective of their national or political affiliations. Although there were some notable successes,(e.g. his famous collaboration with Eddington,) a lot of scientists got embroiled in political squabbles. One problem was that Nazi scientists would either steal, or fail to recognise the contributions of scientists they considered racially suspect. Of course, science is not music. Science is a logical system in which every genuine contribution has to be given its due for the system to function and evolve. Music, on the other hand, however much we love it, is just an optional passing pleasure. I`m not absolutely sure, but I think, with so much other music available, I wouldn`t give any encouragement to Bo Summer. If he is, as you say, "a raging nazi", he is presumably drawing a line himself, saying,"These musicians are acceptable to me, these are not." If he is adopting an intolerant attitude like that, based on considerations other than musical merit, I would much rather look elsewhere for my musical pleasure, to show solidarity with musicians who have an underlying humanitarian respect for other people. I`ve put in a couple of "if"s because all I know about this guy and his music is what you`ve just posted, but my gut tells me that if he does negate the musical merit of other people for political reasons, then why should I respect his musical merit, giving him a benefit that he denies to others ? __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953

02-23-2013, 02:25 PM	#4 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	I would have to agree with Lisnaholic. I had a situation recently where I was looking at music by an artiste who called himself Babylon Mystery Orchestra, I think, basically one guy. But when I looked into his details he was a bigot, a racist, a creationist and homophobic. Now of course I wasn't a fan of his --- I listened to his music and it was okay, nothing special --- but had to decide did I do a feature on him and thereby give his ideas/opinions/existence the oxygen of publicity, however minor, or did I just ignore him? In the end I went with the latter, because no matter how good (or bad) his music was, I felt I couldn't in conscience recommend or praise it, knowing what underpinned it. As far as this band goes, I'd add to what Lis has said that every time you buy one of their albums you could (could) be contributing to some hate fund or campaign: you don't know where the money made is going, and if he's a raging Nazi, then it could be going places you'd prefer it didn't and being used for purposes that you would never yourself condone. Of course you have to separate music from beliefs, to some extent, but even so there's a line to be drawn, and I personally would never feel comfortable listening to music I knew was made by someone who had those views. Hip Hop Bunny Hop will no doubt be along shortly to tell you I'm full of ***... __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018*

02-22-2013, 05:47 AM	#2 (permalink)
misspoptart gimme gimme Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: istanbul Posts: 897	Yes. Music is music. Nazis are nazis. I thought Nazis didn't listen to or make music. But hey, you learn something new every day.