well in all honesty black metal and electronic border on the fringes of indie: black metal is a bit of a stretch but one of my favorite albums of the year, Wind's Poem, by Mount Eerie is a black metal album (sorta) and Mount Eerie is a decidedly indie/ lo-fi artist. i mean i know there are some indie-ish rappers like superbobby! and mc chris (to an extent) i guess rap still just seems out of place. also, in regards to pitchfork, i generally respect their reviews, they are pretentious douches about it but still i respect them, even the rap stuff. i just wish they would separate lists yknow? how do you say raekwon's newest album is better than grizzly bear's when they are so so drastically different? not really on topic anymore, but i hope i have made my point :]

I don't even see why people are bothering to argue. It's impossible to argue with someone who feels the need to post outlandish opinions for attention.

I don't dig this troll.Listen to the following before dismissing hip-hop
OutKast-Stankonia and Aquemini
Nas-Illmatic
Public Enemy-It Takes A Nation Of Millions To Hold Us Back,Fear Of A Black Planet
Tricky-Maxinquaye
Wu-Tang Clan-Enter The 36 Chambers
A Tribe Called Quest-The Low End Theory,Midnight Marauders
GZA-Liquid Swords
Dr Dre-The Chronic
Jay Z-The Blueprint
Notorious BIG-Ready To Die
Dizzee Rascal-Boy In Da Corner
Common-Be

I think it goes beyond wanting attention. A lot of kids who are just getting into music usually start through rock and hold this weird grudge against hip-hop because it supposedly "stole the spotlight" away. I used to think like that. Then I grew up. Luckily no internet forums had to suffer.

in all honesty i never liked it because of the main stream hip hop. i thought it was garbage, it was garbage, but gave a bad name to the good hip hop out there. it wasn't until listening to madvillain, aesop rock, a tribe called quest, deltron 3030 and jurassic 5 that i gained any appreciation for the genre.

The ones I highlighted are albums filled with your typical ,violence, sex, drug warefare. How can this be good for the soul, its destructive music. Not to mention the excessive swearing that is not need.

Though I will admit A tribe called quest,Common, Outkast are small glimmers of light.

smh.
Try some...

Atmosphere
P.O.S.
Eyedea
The Grouch
Eligh
XV
2Mex
Murs
Blu

etc.

Those albums speak of a lifestyle, either you get it or you don't. Some of them may be crass but it's more a reflection of inner city life then just being nasty to be nasty. If you find it all in bad taste then why the hell start a thread to complain about it? Discuss music you enjoy, rather than music you don't.

EDIT: And besides, not all hip-hop is like that. Get into Alternative Hip-Hop if you want to avoid it.

OK then check out this list before dismissing hip hop:

Blackalicious - Blazing Arrow
Aesop Rock - Labor Days
Random - Mega Ran 9
Audible Mainframe - Framework
Amyas - State of Mind
CunninLynguists - A Piece of Strange
G Band Free - Backwards Crown
The Herd - Sun That Never Sets
Dan Le Sac Vs Scroobius Pip - Angles
Sweatshop Union - Water Street

Just a few that lean away from the stereotypes you so blatantly believe is incorporated with all hip hop

Most of them I have links for in case you don't believe that illegally downloading music is bad for the soul.

You don't have to be involved with those kinds of things to find stories about them interesting.