Schememusic

For the content that they both seem to be on Prince EA comes at it harder in my opinion, I like his bars from sumer video on youtube

VEGANGELICA

Oh, it makes complete sense, matious. For example, take that "Beef and Broccoli" song. He uses quite a few high-brow words, ones even *I* don't regularly use in speech , such as, "Bereft, proliferate, castigate, illogicality." Then he turns around and uses the lowest of the lowbrow, "mother****ing," approximately 36 times.

Immortal Technique sounds to me like he is showing off in two ways. First, he is trying to show how clever he is; second, he is trying to show how dismissive of others he can be.

The veggie options you have look pretty good to me!

I missed your comments, Captain Awesome! Human children do not need dairy products from other species in order to survive and flourish. And that IS an actual fact. Many children throughout the world eat no milk at all, other than their mother's. Breast milk should be a baby's sole food and liquid through 6 months of age and also provides important nutrients and closeness up to the time when children's urge to suckle fades away around 5 years of age. There is no human biological need for the milk from any other species.

You are right that some uninformed vegans have made horrendous errors with their children's diets...but this is an exception and far from the rule and unfortunately reflects the fact that most people, whether omnivorous or vegan, appear to lack important nutrition information. A dangerous situation is when people are so uninformed that they don't realize they are uninformed. I doubt many parents want to watch their children die.

The importance I place on people informing themselves is the reason Immortal Technique's "Beef and Broccoli" song bothers me so much: since he is famous, he has a chance to inform others and to broaden his own mind in the process, but he fails to do either.

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Captain Awesome

And where are you getting this FALSE information from? It's a typical closed minded vegan thing to say. The information I have is from doctors and people who have studied biology and medicine. Articles in science magazines, true fact. You're probably getting your information from Vegan weekly or some other brainwashing bull**** magazine.

Children NEED milk. They NEED vitamin D. And idiotic closed minded vegans who force their children into their way of life are destroying them, killing them.

The recommended intake of calcium PER DAY for 9 - 18 year olds is 1,300 milligrams. Milk and Cheese are the best sources for this (followed by yoghurt..another dairy product). You can also use other items such as Orange Juice and Broccoli. But you would need to take in almost nine times the amount of broccoli to get the same amount of calcium you would get from just over 200millilitres of milk (that's one glass of milk). So one glass of milk is equal to just over one litre of broccoli. So unless you're feeding your kid a litre of broccoli each day you are risking your childs health, they would become drastically more susceptible to hypocalcemia, rickets, Osteomalacia, liver failure and various other serious health problems.

Eating meat does not harm your health. The key to being healthy is not to rule out an entire food group but to eat everything in moderation. To much of any one thing is bad for you.

Vegans who force their children into eating like them are killing their own flesh and blood. Simple as that.

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"If we're all merely players in a play on this great stage,
the problem is the script writers ain't on the same page,
I echo through the mountain when I'm singing in the air,
from my lab a lad with lavish lyrics living in his lair."


"Wake up and listen, hear what's not for the public's ears
Pinocchio poets played by profiting puppeteers"

VEGANGELICA

Captain Awesome, I get my nutrition information from a variety of non-vegan, scholarly sources, which state clearly that humans do not need the milk of other species:

Harvard School of Public Health:
Calcium and Milk - What Should You Eat? - The Nutrition Source - Harvard School of Public Health

American Dietetic Association:
Position Paper on Vegetarian Diets
Vegetarian Diets

You are very correct that humans need vitamin D and must take vitamin D supplements if they do not get enough sunlight. I am wondering if you realize dairy products are usually supplemented with synthetic vitamin D?

Well, Immortal Technique's "Beef and Broccoli" song has inspired us to learn about where we each get our information. So, that's something nice about the song!

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Captain Awesome

Supplements are not enough. You can't exhange the real thing for some pill or an alternative, that's just foolish. Like I already said, you would need to consume an incredible amount.

Closed minded vegans like yourself are forcing their children into their way of life and killing them. It's child abuse and I will NEVER condone it.

Ask ANY doctor. They will tell you that nothing is a substitute for dairy when it comes to your childs intake of calcium.

The article you posted from the Harvard School of Public Health suggests alternatives such as bok choy, soy milk and baked beans. What they don't tell you is that a ten year old would need to eat 1.9 litres of bok choy or a litre of baked beans to get the daily recommendation of calcium in comparison to just under 3 glasses of milk.

These "alternatives" are not good enough. Unless of course you're feeding them a litre of baked beans or 1.9 litres of bok choy per day which I highly doubt vegan parents do.

The vegan diet (when forced upon children) is unhealthy and extremely dangerous. Unless your kid is lactose intolerant you better be feeding them some ****ing dairy.

__________________

"If we're all merely players in a play on this great stage,
the problem is the script writers ain't on the same page,
I echo through the mountain when I'm singing in the air,
from my lab a lad with lavish lyrics living in his lair."


"Wake up and listen, hear what's not for the public's ears
Pinocchio poets played by profiting puppeteers"

VEGANGELICA

Captain Awesome, since our discussion is straying farther and farther from Immortal Technique's song, "Beef and Broccoli," would you like to continue our debate down in the lounge section in the "Is Meat Really Murder?" thread? http://www.musicbanter.com/822106-post1.html (Just so you know, I didn't start that thread! )

In answer to your first comment above, though, I would say that supplements, far from being foolish, are often a prudent way for anyone to ensure sufficient vitamin and mineral intake. As I wrote earlier, the U.S. fortifies cow's milk (and cereals) with vitamin D as a way to combat rickets, and the synthetic vitamin D does the job (albeit with some overdose risks).

In answer to your second comment, you can indeed find doctors, such as Dr. Neal Bernard of the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine, who state that milk products are not the best source of calcium in the diet. Dr. Bernard, M.D., is a nutrition researcher and an adjunct associate professor of medicine at the George Washington University School of Medicine and the head of the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine, which writes that:

So, if you want to discuss dairy, meats, and veganism some more with me, I'll see you down in the lounge!

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Captain Awesome

Of course dairy can be harmful. Everything can be harmful. As I already said to much of any one thing can damage your health. You need to eat a variety of things. Ruling out an entire food group or concentrating yourself on only one is both idiotic and harmful to your health. Orange Juice is the closest thing to a "good alternative" to dairy. But it still isn't good enough.

As for that "doctor" I'm sure his opinion has nothing to do with the people paying his wage Notice how all the scientists rant about how much better organic food is for you and it's about twenty times as expensive. Notice that when the sales of dark chocolate were falling scientists suddenly proved that it was good for your heart and the sales went back up again. Meh...

We haven't strayed off topic at all as this is exactly what Immortal Technique was rapping about. Closed minded vegans who push their lifestyle onto others.

I just hope your stupidity doesn't result in the death or ill health of your children.

__________________

"If we're all merely players in a play on this great stage,
the problem is the script writers ain't on the same page,
I echo through the mountain when I'm singing in the air,
from my lab a lad with lavish lyrics living in his lair."


"Wake up and listen, hear what's not for the public's ears
Pinocchio poets played by profiting puppeteers"

VEGANGELICA

Well, if a mod says it's okay to keep discussing vegetarian issues in Immortal Technique's thread, I'll continue to...but until we know for sure, Captain Awesome, may I have your permission to copy your most recent post (above) and reply to it down in the "Is Meat Really Murder" thread, since that looks like the main vegetarian issues thread in the lounge section?

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Sparky

I don't think the mods are on the rap forums all that often.

My mom is vegan, and my dad is vegetarian. My aunt is also vegan. None of them have "pushed" their lifestyle onto me in anyway.
Sounds like Captain Awesome could use a little more real world expireance, and less time cooped up getting his info from diss raps.

clutnuckle

He's talking about the song's topic (ie. Closed-minded Vegans/Vegetarians). I doubt him/her ever said that ALL vegans were closed-minded, but congratulations for knowing some who aren't; However, that doesn't make it everyone so lucky.