The Batlord

It took me awhile to care about The Germs but now that I do they're just a the weirdest little punk band who sound like the most punk band ever but don't actually conform to any of the stereotypes of the sound of punk. Darby Crash is the most punk singer ever but he just makes the weirdest noises that don't make any sense, the music is simplistic punk but has a chaotic idiosyncraticness that both defines punk but also defies its stereotypes to become the wildest version of it possible. The Germs are just wild and unique and perfect.

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Ayn Marx

Great stuff but it’s too in tune and skilled in execution to be called punk.

Marie Monday

Ayn Marx, who professes a hatred for punk so probably has barely listened to it: the gatekeeping punk authority

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Ayn Marx

I don’t ‘hate’ punk, It bores me to tears and like any joke, told once it’s funny, (God Save The Queen she Ain’t no Human Being) after that it’s all just boring to me with overtones of ‘Lets lock the bedroom door, turn up the volume and drive mumsy & daddy mad. If it makes you happy go for it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ajq4Ek-jChA

jadis

That’s the whole point: defining oneself as a “snob” means “I am a simpleton who doesn’t know much but want to clumsily adopt what I perceive to be the tastes of those in the know to appear superior to others...”

[Yes, on a certain level everyone who agrees that Beefheart is better than Imagine Dragons introduces an element of condescension into their musical preferences but we don't make an entire identity out of it and it's a big difference imo]

For the longest time the etymology of snob was thought to be an abbreviation of the Latin sine nobilitate (“sans nobilité”) and while it’s most likely wrong, it tells you everything about the general perception of those who so defined themselves.

If, in 2022, you think that music must be “in tune” and that listening to the disgusting kitsch of Hauser signifies good taste, you might be a snob!

rubber soul

Actually, I don't see Sandinista as a true punk album either. I always think of punk as basically great three chord rock. The British perfected it (Sex Pistols, Damned, early Clash, etc.) and I'd put the Ramones in that category too. By the time the Clash came to record London Calling, they began to delve into different genres, notably reggae, and I think they lost some of their punk edge in the process.

Still, a great band though.

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jadis

No one here's saying it is. I doubt you'll find anyone who has ever claimed that one of the great postpunk albums is a distillation of 1977 punk. Marie was talking about something else.

Marie Monday

Yes it's that Ayn is prejudiced against punk while being ignorant about it. But also, even though it's not 'true' punk in the classic sense, punk is a broad umbrella term that imo includes a lot of music which is quite different from that classic stuff. In any case, being unskilled and out of tune are not essential characteristics of even the classic punk music.

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rubber soul

I won't go into Ayn's snobbery (maybe he and Elph should get a room), but of course many of the punk musicians were quite skilled. I don't think anyone would argue with a straight face that the Clash or John Lydon were untalented for example. I was looking at punk from the narrow 1977 perspective. It doesn't take away the musical contributions all these bands made from the early punk bands to the California scenes later and beyond.

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Marie Monday

of course, I know

I actually love the similarities between Ayn's opinion on punk and elph's opinion on metal

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