Is Progressive Punk really an oxymoron?

The Batlord · 08-13-2016, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

I'm not sure this is even true, but what people care about isn't important

People who are properly into Punk understand it started in the U.S.

There was a time where I thought post punk was a UK phenomenon but then I got into Pere Ubu and The Contortions and such

I mean, I fkin love UK punk don't get me wrong here

Yeah I listen to those bands too, and Pere Ubu are one of, like what, two bands to come out of that scene with any amount of notice? Them and Devo? And no, I don't count the Dead Boys because they're garbage.

And the Contortions were part of a scene nobody probably had any idea about before the internet cause it was so short-lived and unpalatable to pretty much everybody.

Nobody cared about Pere Ubu or the Contortions or Lydia Lunch or whoever, except for a small handful of arty music fans. They launched no movements. The Sex Pistols did. So you can take your No True Scotsman fallacy and cram it. "Properly into punk" is the kind of elitist bull**** that punk either despises or reveres, I'm not sure which.

P.S. You forgot Australia. Can't be a proper snob without name dropping the Saints and Radio Birdman.

The Batlord · 08-13-2016, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

I made a statement of historical fact

You then say "the public didn't know about it though"

My response: who cares?

If I'm gonna talk about Australia I'm repping Birthday Party and don't even get me started on New Zealand

But that's the point. Punk didn't really start anywhere. It was a series of tenuously, at best, connected scenes that were all jiving on Iggy Pop and Velvet Underground. If an American scene had the first band then that's really just a technicality, cause the whole **** show that was the punk movement started in Britain.

William_the_Bloody · 08-13-2016, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

But that's the point. Punk didn't really start anywhere. It was a series of tenuously, at best, connected scenes that were all jiving on Iggy Pop and Velvet Underground. If an American scene had the first band then that's really just a technicality, cause the whole **** show that was the punk movement started in Britain.

Lol, your wasting your time with elphenor Batlord, she's not the brightest light in the tool shed. You could argue with her all night and she'll just keep changing the goal posts.

The New York scene would have been confined to the historic dustbins of obscurity if it wasn't for the London punk explosion, and the term punk was not widely used to describe music until Caroline Coon applied it to the British punk scene, and the media ran with it.

Punk is dead and I'm happy it is, because when musical genres stick around to long they begin to suck!!!

I'd jump back into this argument, but I've got better things to do than argue with someone who romanticizes a 40 year old musical genre in 2016. life is short.

Blank. · 08-14-2016, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

The vast majority of punk is obscure

The vast majority of bands in almost every genre are obscure.

Quote:

Punk was being used to describe American bands well before the UK scene
(All you have to do is run a Google search to find this out like good god guys)

No one is arguing against this. Punk Rock and it's attitude has to have roots somewhere. It doesn't just pop up out of nowhere.

Quote:

And there's no evidence to suggest that Sex Pistols made Ramones and Television more popular than they were

Point is?

Quote:

We better tell all the Crustpunks to pack it up and go home seeing as William has declared punk already dead.

Punk is dead. It's Alive in small pockets, like every music scene, but mostly dead.

William_the_Bloody · 08-14-2016, 01:19 AM

Ok elphenor we'll let you live in your own little reality.

Anyone who wants to read my argument can just scroll back.

Blank. · 08-14-2016, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

yes they were

That's literally what the last page is about

No. People were denying that CBGB was punk. They weren't denying that punk had roots in CBGB.

William_the_Bloody · 08-14-2016, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

didnt you already say you weren't going to argue anymore

Looks like you came back for more punishment

you're a pro at contradicting yourself

People can go back and read my argument we will let you live in your own little world.

The Batlord · 08-14-2016, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

yes they were

That's literally what the last page is about

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1blankmind

No. People were denying that CBGB was punk. They weren't denying that punk had roots in CBGB.

No, I was arguing that without the British scene all the other scenes would have fizzled out due to the lack of audience that only existed because of it. Whether or not those bands went platinum is another matter.

Dylstew · 08-14-2016, 01:50 PM

I still can't believe elphenor believes punk doesn't have a sound.

Blank. · 08-14-2016, 01:51 PM

It's becoming a pointless argument.

08-14-2016, 01:19 AM	#95 (permalink)
William_the_Bloody Music Addict Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Sunnydale Cemetary Posts: 2,093	Ok elphenor we'll let you live in your own little reality. Anyone who wants to read my argument can just scroll back.

08-14-2016, 01:50 PM	#99 (permalink)
Dylstew Music Addict Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 1,366	I still can't believe elphenor believes punk doesn't have a sound.

08-14-2016, 01:51 PM	#100 (permalink)
Blank. Jacob Sartorius Join Date: May 2016 Location: Dank memes Posts: 4,033	It's becoming a pointless argument.