Big Ears

Wow! That was quick, TH. Mine might be a bit late. I agree with your comments, so I do not think mine will be much different.

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My Journal: Rabbiting On

Trollheart

Yeah well the thing is, I didn't even have to spin the album. I know it so well I could do it all from memory, and after all, I've had about thirty years to digest it, so is the review really that quick after all?

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Big Ears

Well, when you put it like that . . .

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My Journal: Rabbiting On

Trollheart

One thing I find about SEBTP is that lyrically it's terribly dated. I mean, puns that were clever in 1973 are not so now. Who today knows what Green Shield Stamps were? Or what a Wimpy is/was? It's kind of like looking at an old sitcom whose jokes are rooted in the phraseology of the time.

Example: The Young Ones. Mike opens a paper, a load of fruit and stuff falls out. He watches it fall in his lap, looks up at the camera and says "I never knew there was so much in it!" Big laugh, because back then the slogan for the "TV Times" was exactly that. Today, nobody who has not lived through that era will get that.

On the other hand, lyrics in "Trick of the tail" and even "Trespass" still work today, and are still relevant. I'm not saying ALL of "Selling England" is out of date lyrically but a lot of it is.

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Unknown Soldier

This is the problem when a band centres itself around a local colloquial lingo for their lyrics, especially if those lyrics are an important aspect to the band. For that reason the band becomes a product of their time and that is exactly what Genesis under Peter Gabriel were. Hell even I had problems remembering what Green Shield Stamps were.

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Big Ears

Apparently, American journalists criticised Selling England by the Pound for being too British, which is a bit like criticising The Beach Boys for being too Californian. I like all those little references to supermarkets, in the same way I liked Alice Cooper's references to Kresges and Woolworths, even though we don't have Kresges in the UK. I do remember being a bit perplexed when I Know What I Like became a hit single, without being typical of the band or overtly commercial. People who bought the single were confused by the album, but for progressive rock fans the album was an intricate and detailed piece of work. In a way, this unpredictability was typical of Genesis at the time. Later they released The Carpet Crawlers, amidst plenty of hype, but its curious vocal arrangement was not for the single-buying public.

Something that puzzles me is how the band split after the next album and continued with more straightforward lyrics and vocals. Yet, Peter Gabriel never again used the device of singing in the role of various characters as on The Battle of Epping Forest. His solo style was initially more akin to the single version of I Know What I Like. Either way, I did not care for Genesis without Gabriel, or, for that matter, Gabriel without Genesis (despite the presence of Larry Fast and Tony Levin).

They made some strange decisions in their time. They would not recruit Chester Thompson during the Ray Wilson era, so he never worked for them again.

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My Journal: Rabbiting On

Unknown Soldier

1. What were your VERY FIRST impressions on listening to the album, say from the first five minutes in?

"Dancing with the Moonlit Knight" is one of the most archetypal progressive rock tracks from the prog era, the song is multi-dimensional in that everything that the band stood for is displayed on this song for a glorious 8 minutes.

2. What did you think of the opening tracks?

Already mentioned "Dancing with the Moonlit Knight" and then the second track "I Know What I Like" really does heighten the listening experience.

3. What did you think of the later tracks?

The later part of the album is not as strong as the opening part of the album and "The Cinema Show" is the strongest track here.

4. Did you like the vocalist? Hate him/her? Any impressions?

What can you say, Peter Gabriel is probably the most influential prog vocalist ever, full of clever puns and idiosyncrasies and I suppose Phil Collins did ok for one song.

5. Did the music (only) generally appeal to you, or not?

Genesis are not a band I often put on for some reason but under Gabriel they were probably the most essential prog band around and the band provide that nostalgic English feel of a bygone time.

6. Did the album get better or worse as you listened to it (first time)?

It was an album that took me a number of years to get into back in the 1990s and then everything clicked.

7. What did you think of the lyrical content?

The whole album is based around puns and humour all told in a kind of storybook format.

8. Did you like the instrumental tracks?

It's hard not to like the band's instrumentals and as said only one track is a true instrumental.

9. What did you think of the production?

Crisp and polished with everything highlighted as it should be.

10. How well do you already know the band/artist?

Like most on here very well and also Peter Gabriel's later solo work.

11. What sub-genre, if any, would you assign this music to?

Progressive rock without a doubt.

12. On repeated listens, did you find you liked the album more, or less?

Listened to it again for this review and I like "Firth of Fifth" more than ever.

13. What would you class as your favourite track, if you have one?

"Dancing with the Moonlit Knight" "Firth of Fifth" and "The Cinema Show".

14. And the one you liked least?

Might have to agree with Trollheart here and go with "The Battle of Epping Forest" even though I don't dislike the song.

15. Did the fact that this album is a debut allow it, in your mind, any leeway, and if so, was that decision justified or vindicated?

N/A

16. Are you now looking forward to hearing other albums by the band/artist?

Know them all very well.

17. Did you get, thematically, the idea behind the album if there was one?

Seems to be about short stories and fables told in an eccentric way.

18. Did the album end well?

Yes and I liked "Aisle of Plenty" which kind of played like a reprise of "Dancing with the Moonlit Knight"

19. Do you see any way the album could have been improved?

Not really, it's always hard to improve on a classic album.

20. Do you think the album hung together well, ie was a fully cohesive unit, or was it a bit hit-and-miss?

Yes and regardless of the subject matter, the album played like a diverse storybook that still had a main gist and feel that gelled the whole thing together.

Overall Album Rating: 9.0 out of 10.

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Anteater

1.What were your VERY FIRST impressions on listening to the album, say from the first five minutes in?

All that great sweep picking on 'Dancing With The Moonlit Knight', coupled with Gabriel's strident delivery..well, it made a pretty good impression on me as a middle school student, that's for sure!

2. What did you think of the opening tracks?

Some of it was immediate, some of it not, especially on the instrumental side of things. 'Dancing...' is still my favorite from Side A, but it took me a couple run throughs to warm up to 'I Know What You Like...'. Not because it's a bad song, but simply because it seemed a little too twee. 'More Fool Me', though....always liked this one: very CSN&Y-ish despite the fact this is Genesis and not an American westcoast band.

3. What did you think of the later tracks?

'The Battle of Epping Forest' has some cool synthwork through, but never really liked it that much as a song. 'The Cinema Show' and 'Aisle Of Plenty' are nice though: love Hackett's guitar work in particular.

4. Did you like the vocalist? Hate him/her? Any impressions?

I was fairly familiar with Peter Gabriel even before SEBTP and always liked his voice and creative delivery, so it wasn't hard to appreciate him here either.


5. Did the music (only) generally appeal to you, or not?

As expected of one of the great classic proggles, it did pretty much everything right as far as what I look for.


6. Did the album get better or worse as you listened to it (first time)?

Better I'd say. Even all the years later though, some cuts still haven't grown on me as much as I would have liked.

7. What did you think of the lyrical content?

One of those albums that you really have to study up on if you weren't living in the U.K. in the early 70's: I liked it, but I consider the lyrical content here to be one of the album's biggest weaknesses in a weird sense too.

8. Did you like the instrumental parts?

You betcha. This is a Mellotronner among Mellotrons, not to mention all the glorious interplay. I may not like every song here, but on the instrumental side of things this was definitely Genesis at their peak.

9. What did you think of the production?

Warm, concise and full of depth.

10. How well do you already know the band/artist?

My experiences with Trespass and Foxtrot initially brought me to SEBTP, but I was familiar with the later work too at the time I first heard it.

11. What sub-genre, if any, would you assign this music to?

Proto-Brit-pop?

12. On repeated listens, did you find you liked the album more, or less?

Neither. I like it for what it is, but my general impression neither improved nor disproved with repeated listens.

13. What would you class as your favourite track, if you have one?

'The Cinema Show'.


14. And the one you liked least?

A tie between 'The Battle Of Epping Forest' and 'I Know What I Like...'. xD


15. Did the fact that this album is a debut allow it, in your mind, any leeway, and if so, was question or put "n/a")

N/A.

16. Are you now looking forward to hearing other albums by the band/artist?

None left to hear at this point I'm afraid.


17. Did you get, thematically, the idea behind the album if there was one?

Isn't it all about Scotland? Or wait, maybe it's about Whimpy Burgers or what have you...I just can't decide! xD

18. Did the album end well?

A cacophony of voices, fading out....yeah, me likey'd back then!

19. Do you see any way the album could have been improved?

Not really. If it had been changed in any way, it wouldn't be SEBTP: it'd be something else entirely.

20. Do you think the album hung together well, ie was a fully cohesive unit, or was it a bit hit-and-miss?

In the same way some people are puzzled over why Close To The Edge by Yes is a masterpiece, SEBTP is one of two Genesis albums (the other being The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway) that I've never been particularly enamored with beyond a few key tracks. That being said, a classic is a classic, and it is a status that this sucka certainly deserved upon release.

Overall Album Rating: 8.5 out of 10.

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Trollheart

Don't mean to push you BE but can you get your review up in the next few days if possible? We're way over the two-week time limit and it's time to move on to the next album, which is I think Unknown Soldier's choice.

US, if you want to suggest yours (if it's your turn; I think it is) then we can start listening while waiting for the large-lobed one to get his review of Selling England sorted.

Don't want to rush anyone but we've sort of done Genesis to death now and we do I think need to move on.

Thanks.

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Unknown Soldier

In that case I choose the one and only album by supergroup Armageddon, surprisingly entitled Armageddon.

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