Frownland

The technology has and continues to advance so much that maybe 20 years ago WTB would have a valid point, but the argument against sampling doesn't hold much water these days.

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

William_the_Bloody

I disagree, I still know people who work in the industry and the technology hasn't advanced that much.

You could splice individual notes and rearrange it when I worked in the business to, but unless you have a software program that can take the snipits and rearrange them into timed notes of your choosing as well as changing the tone, and the sound bank, then your still limited. You also need a program that will be able to time the percussion instruments (Drums) perfectly.

I'm not opposed to sampling because your borrowing other people's work, I'm opposed to it because as the technology stands it is still confined, which is why songs like Rihanna's S.O.S suck $hit. It could never have the creativity of Soft Cell's Tainted Love or the original version.

One day electronic music will rule all! but as it stands now its still largely run by dj's who sample a beat and build around it, instead of creating their own choruses and bridges.

Frownland

This is such a small part of electronic music though.

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

William_the_Bloody

I would argue that DJ's are the biggest part of electronic culture, particularly the ones pulling in million dollar salaries, Skrillex,Calvin Harris ect)

The electronic underground will always be filled with good artists, the problem happens when you get artists without musical talent (Rihanna) relying on some producer to sample a beat for her, because she is incapable of composing her own work. Otherwise I wouldn't have a problem with the process.

Anyways I made my point. I don't hate electronic music, I love it, but I hate it when samples are applied to manufactured pop artists who can't produce their own music, because it makes for very, very, bad pop music.

Frownland

My point was that the great underground artists can use that same method that Rihanna uses to create some brilliant music. I don't think that it's the creation method itself that makes bad music, it's just that very palatable music (as far as the general public goes) using those methods can create bad music. Do you think that if Rihanna (or her songwriters) switched to non-electronic methods of composition, the music would become better? I really don't see that happening tbh.

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

William_the_Bloody

I personally do, although both Michael Jackson and Donna Summer are miles ahead of Rihanna in the talent department, the latter two had people compose their music for them and it came out a lot better. Record companies rarely hire session musicians anymore because its cheaper to hire a producer who will sample a beat.

Sampling is an art and a talent, and when you get artists like Massive Attack doing it its brilliant, but underground artists often have a deep passion for music and knowledge on how to compose music in a certain key. Rihanna is just a t and a dancing puppet with some half ass Dj making her music.

Anyways I'm not taking aim at the music you like because its cool, cheers.

Frownland

Now how is Rihanna different apart from the change in technology? I think that if electronics were outright banned in pop music, then we'd still get the same bland crap but on non-electronic instruments since it sells so easily. The music that's easy to cater to the masses is rarely something that you'd hear Massive Attack or Burial doing. I think you have more of a problem with the style of music that you're used to hearing sampling/electronics in these days than with sampling or electronics themselves.

It's not even that I like the music, although there are some artists who definitely use sampling and electronics that I enjoy, it's the blanket statement nature of how you regard modern music. To expound on my earlier point, the argument you're coming out with is like saying that you don't like the saxophone because it's in all of those jazz pieces that you hate (not you personally, just an analogy), even though it's used in a variety of other genres outside of jazz.

Anyway, Goofle's rec thread reminded me of this. I wish this type of thing was more popular. Got any similar artists, Goof?

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

William_the_Bloody

I see what your saying, but I listen to a lot of disco from the 70's and I just find that the compositions are musically superior because you had bad ensembles composing whole pieces of music.

I think the sampler is great when it is used by underground artists who know what there doing, but because of its current limitations (which may change) I don't feel it has the creative freedom that an instrument has.

I can't change the fact that there is going to crappy pop stars out there who care more about fame and fortune than they do making good music, but as a consumer at least I can demand that they have some measure of talent. Unfortunately anyone over 20 doesn't seem to matter.

Neat song by the way.

Anyways I'm kind of feeling that I have hijacked Janzoon's thread, so I think it would be best to have someone get it back on track.

Frownland

Guess what? That song was made using electronics...

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Goofle

I've not heard anything quite like CC unfortunately.

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