Pop, is it corporate garbage or does it have it's merits? (singer, dance)

zekethefreak · 09-10-2008, 05:06 PM

There is very LITTLE, in the way of current Pop music, that merits any kind of attention. It is 99% corporate swill. So much of it is contrived in the corporate music world, and manipulated in the corporate music world. That is why the Indie singer/songwriters, and established singer/songwriters... SONGWRITERS, being the operative word... are the way to go. Truly artistic music.

Minstrel · 09-10-2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zekethefreak

That is why the Indie singer/songwriters, and established singer/songwriters... SONGWRITERS, being the operative word... are the way to go. Truly artistic music.

Yeah, that is one sort of great, current pop music.

~~RockGuitar101~~ · 09-25-2008, 05:41 PM

some real great guitarist and keyboard players in pop music, they are very skilled also in Jazz and classical music even though they don't perform it much.
So yes there are great ones in pop music today.

Whatsitoosit · 10-03-2008, 01:22 PM

that's like saying there are some healthy items in fast food joints therefor it's not all bad. Why would I go to McDonald's for the salad? I go there for the crap.

Brad Stengel · 10-08-2008, 05:12 PM

It really depends on how you define pop, and it seems there's two schools of thought on this:

1. Basically the wikipedia definition, where its mostly limited to the "swill" we hear on the radio. The fact is, whether or not its "corporate garbage", "banal", or "shallow", alot of those songs that we think are awful, mean alot to some people, which is the most honest thing a song can do. There are stupid little girls out there that relate to Avril Lavigne's music better than anyone else, and for that reason alone it shouldn't be dismissed. Something doesn't have to be original to move you, it can be something as insignificant as a chord change from B to B-minor, whether its played behind a corporate mannequin's digitally altered singing, or behind an underappreciated cult icon's grating voice.

2. If we are to take it to mean anything catchy, hooky, etc. (which is the school of thought I attend), then that's absurd! Pop has provided us with the Magnetic Fields, Jesus & Mary Chain, Beatles, Ramones, The Cure, and so many more. And to me, anything with any sort of melody to it, has a 'pop' feel to it.

I'd like to also state why I believe the second definition is more accurate. For an example let's take Pavement's "Slanted and Enchanted" album compared to their follow up, "Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain". If someone owned S&E and wanted to know how CRCR sounded in comparison, almost everyone would describe "poppier". Neither of them are pop albums according to the first definition, which makes it pretty difficult to describe when a band is taking a more melodic, cleaner, more accessible approach.

Bulldog · 10-13-2008, 04:47 PM

I'd like to think it is, but there is some horribly commercial stuff I listen to sometimes, so I guess it has its merits

Raust · 10-18-2008, 11:21 PM

Pop is somthing that'll never die, but change with time.

dac · 10-20-2008, 05:03 PM

the beauty of pop lies in the melodies, for me

Brad Stengel · 10-20-2008, 06:17 PM

Someone was saying that they were going to refer to mainstream disposable pop as 'commercial' instead, which will hopefully catch on, seeing as any real 'argument' against pop in this thread has been towards 'commercial' music rather than 'pop'.

Astronomer · 10-27-2008, 07:27 PM

All, or most genres of music that involve parties other than the musicians themselves, contain elements of commercialization. While the musician's goals may be artistic, the managers/ record labels/ etc are usually only concerned with potential audiences and prospective markets. This is why labels who can afford it employ promotions teams and PR consultants. In my opinion, this kind of activity is evident in most genres of music (not included smaller indie artists) and not just pop.

However, it is true that popular music is not doubt the most lucrative when it comes to commercialization and profit-making. But this is only one facet of pop, and even though the music is driven to increase profits it does not know that there is also merit to the music. It's impossible to say whether pop music is one or the other, because it is most often than not both, and anyway most music genres are intermingled with commercial and profit-making avenues.

09-10-2008, 05:06 PM	#321 (permalink)
zekethefreak Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah USA Posts: 122	There is very LITTLE, in the way of current Pop music, that merits any kind of attention. It is 99% corporate swill. So much of it is contrived in the corporate music world, and manipulated in the corporate music world. That is why the Indie singer/songwriters, and established singer/songwriters... SONGWRITERS, being the operative word... are the way to go. Truly artistic music. __________________ http://unclezekesmusicemporium.blogspot.com http://seandahl.blogspot.com http://www.myspace.com/nomanfan

10-03-2008, 01:22 PM	#324 (permalink)
Whatsitoosit Bringer of Carrots Join Date: May 2008 Location: New York, NY Posts: 648	that's like saying there are some healthy items in fast food joints therefor it's not all bad. Why would I go to McDonald's for the salad? I go there for the crap. __________________ "It takes 43 muscles to frown and 17 to smile, but it doesn't take any to just sit there with a dumb look on your face."

10-08-2008, 05:12 PM	#325 (permalink)
Brad Stengel This Space for Rent Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 815	It really depends on how you define pop, and it seems there's two schools of thought on this: 1. Basically the wikipedia definition, where its mostly limited to the "swill" we hear on the radio. The fact is, whether or not its "corporate garbage", "banal", or "shallow", alot of those songs that we think are awful, mean alot to some people, which is the most honest thing a song can do. There are stupid little girls out there that relate to Avril Lavigne's music better than anyone else, and for that reason alone it shouldn't be dismissed. Something doesn't have to be original to move you, it can be something as insignificant as a chord change from B to B-minor, whether its played behind a corporate mannequin's digitally altered singing, or behind an underappreciated cult icon's grating voice. 2. If we are to take it to mean anything catchy, hooky, etc. (which is the school of thought I attend), then that's absurd! Pop has provided us with the Magnetic Fields, Jesus & Mary Chain, Beatles, Ramones, The Cure, and so many more. And to me, anything with any sort of melody to it, has a 'pop' feel to it. I'd like to also state why I believe the second definition is more accurate. For an example let's take Pavement's "Slanted and Enchanted" album compared to their follow up, "Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain". If someone owned S&E and wanted to know how CRCR sounded in comparison, almost everyone would describe "poppier". Neither of them are pop albums according to the first definition, which makes it pretty difficult to describe when a band is taking a more melodic, cleaner, more accessible approach. __________________ These is the musics I own: http://rateyourmusic.com/collection/BradStengel/oo

10-20-2008, 05:03 PM	#328 (permalink)
dac MB's Biggest Fanboy Join Date: May 2008 Location: Cloud Cuckoo Land Posts: 2,852	the beauty of pop lies in the melodies, for me __________________

10-20-2008, 06:17 PM	#329 (permalink)
Brad Stengel This Space for Rent Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 815	Someone was saying that they were going to refer to mainstream disposable pop as 'commercial' instead, which will hopefully catch on, seeing as any real 'argument' against pop in this thread has been towards 'commercial' music rather than 'pop'. __________________ These is the musics I own: http://rateyourmusic.com/collection/BradStengel/oo

09-25-2008, 05:41 PM	#323 (permalink)
~~RockGuitar101~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Seattle Posts: 180	some real great guitarist and keyboard players in pop music, they are very skilled also in Jazz and classical music even though they don't perform it much. So yes there are great ones in pop music today.

10-13-2008, 04:47 PM	#326 (permalink)
Bulldog why bother? Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: UK Posts: 4,840	I'd like to think it is, but there is some horribly commercial stuff I listen to sometimes, so I guess it has its merits

10-18-2008, 11:21 PM	#327 (permalink)
Raust Music Addict Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,411	Pop is somthing that'll never die, but change with time.

10-27-2008, 07:27 PM	#330 (permalink)
Astronomer we are stardust Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Australia Posts: 2,894	All, or most genres of music that involve parties other than the musicians themselves, contain elements of commercialization. While the musician's goals may be artistic, the managers/ record labels/ etc are usually only concerned with potential audiences and prospective markets. This is why labels who can afford it employ promotions teams and PR consultants. In my opinion, this kind of activity is evident in most genres of music (not included smaller indie artists) and not just pop. However, it is true that popular music is not doubt the most lucrative when it comes to commercialization and profit-making. But this is only one facet of pop, and even though the music is driven to increase profits it does not know that there is also merit to the music. It's impossible to say whether pop music is one or the other, because it is most often than not both, and anyway most music genres are intermingled with commercial and profit-making avenues. __________________