sleepy jack

What are you talking about? Lets first get onto the subject of who were talking about, Nirvana. The bands who influence rock music could've done without, we have them to partly thank for all the Nickelbacks and post-grunge crap of the world. Nirvana weren't even the first grunge band, they weren't even the first to do it well. Their was nothing special about their sound. They were all average musicians and Kurt Cobain was not a good lyricist or singer. People can fool themselves into thinking he was some genius but he really wasn't. They can fool themselves into thinking Nevermind was the greatest album of the 90s but it wasn't. In the words of Wayne Coyne "If you think you're going to hear an utterly original, powerful and freaky record when you put on Nevermind, as a young kid might, Christ you're going to be disappointed. You're going to think, "Who is this band that sounds just like Nickelback? What are these drug addicts going on about?""

Saying its better than the Beach Boys? Who are widely considered one of the most influential pop bands ever? Who's influence stretches from Panda Bear to Kevin Barnes to Elliott Smith to Billy Corgan to Elton John? Pet Sounds influence alone makes it better than anything Nirvana released. They did pop better than Nirvana ever did, they did something timeless and have you looked at the musicians who hold it in such high esteem?

"His music (Brian Wilson's) definitely affected mine — the harmonies. Of course I never played in a band that could sing like that."
- Neil Young

"I've always been into harmonies, so I was inspired by that part of what they (the Beach Boys) were doing. It definetely influenced a generation of kids."
- Stevie Wonder

"I think I would put him up there with any composer — especially Pet Sounds. I don't think there is anything better that that, necessarily. I don't think you'd be out of line comparing him to Beethovan — to any composer. The word genius is used a lot with Brian. I don't know if he's a genius or not, but I know that music is probably as good as any music you can make."
- Tom Petty

"If there is one person that I have to select as a living genius of pop music, I would choose Brian Wilson. Without Pet Sounds, Sgt. Pepper wouldn't have happened... Pepper was an attempt to equal Pet Sounds."
- George Martin

"It was Pet Sounds that blew me out of the water. I love the album so much. ... I figure no one is educated musically 'til they've heard that album ... I love the orchestra, the arrangements ... it may be going overboard to say it's the classic of the century ... but to me, it certainly is a total, classic record that is unbeatable in many ways ... I've often played Pet Sounds and cried. ... "God Only Knows" is a big favorite of mine ... very emotional, always a bit of a choker for me, that one. On "You Still Believe In Me", I love that melody — that kills me ... that's my favorite, I think ... it's so beautiful right at the end ... comes surging back in these multi-colored harmonies ... sends shivers up my spine."
- Paul McCartney

"Pet Sounds is a landmark album. For me to say that I was enthralled would be an understatement. I had never heard such magical sounds, so amazingly recorded. It undoubtedly changed the way that I, and countless others, approached recording. It is a timeless and amazing recording of incredible genius and beauty."
- Elton John

"Pet Sounds became an instant classic when it first appeared. Listening to it today, it is, perhaps, easier to see why it was one of the defining moments of its time, along with the music of the Beatles, Pink Floyd and the Greatful Dead ... its willingness to abandon formula in favor of structural innovation, the introduction of classical elements in the arrangements, production concepts in terms of overall 'sound' which were novel at the time, all these elements give Pet Sounds a freshness that, thirty years later, is immediately there for the listener."
- Phillip Glass

"The first time I heard Pet Sounds, I have to admit that I did a little bit of knee-jerk in the same way probably the record company and some other people did because it wasn't as accessible as Brian's songwriting approach had been up to that time. I'm not sure I fully appreciated that until years later, I started making records myself."
- Lindsey Buckingham

"Jesus, that ear. He should donate it to The Smithsonian."
- Bob Dylan (On Brian Wilson)

"He was the most highly regarded pop musician in America, hands down. Everybody by that time had figured out who was writing and arranging it all. "In My Room" was the defining point for me. When I heard it, I thought "I give up — I can't do that — I'll never be able to do that.""
- David Crosby

"Pet Sounds is an unbelievable record. It's like classical music. Wonderful compositions, beautiful singing. I think the compositions stand up to any kind of interpretation. I've heard "Put Your Head On My Shoulder" played on the cello and it sounds like a piece music that's been with us for hundreds and hundreds of years. It sounds like it's always been there. And I think maybe in a hundred years' time people will be playing their songs on the piano trying to work out where they came from."
- Elvis Costello

"I consider Pet Sounds to be one of the greatest pop LPs to ever be released. It encompasses everthing that's ever knocked me out and rolled it all into one. Brian Wilson is, without a doubt, a pop genius."
- Eric Clapton

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Son of JayJamJah

When I seen Proggys comment, I thought poor Crowquill is gonna flip out and sure enough, Insanely long (but essential) response to a one sentence post. I'll read it later I promise, too tired tonight.

Pet Sounds is actually better then anything Nirvana ever did although it's also vastly superior to anything else the Beach Boys ever did, although "Smiley Smile" is another personal favorite.

sleepy jack

I wouldn't say Pet Sounds is vastly superior. If you consider Smile (Brian Wilson) part of the Beach Boys discography i'd say that comes close to Pet Sounds, if not ties it and while not many people ever discuss it, Love You is a fantastic album. Its usually only hailed as their weirdest (and for good reason) but the arrangements rival Pet Sounds, just in a different way. They're certainly strange arrangements, with all the organs and synths and off the wall lyrics but they're beautiful nonetheless.

Not to mention its extremely consistent, as is Pet Sounds but while I love everything by the Beach Boys i've heard they can put out some weak songs this album isn't like that all. Brains voice while fucked up by drugs, worked well surprisingly and I don't think in his old days he could've pulled Love You off. I also think Love You is just as significant in the fact its the greatest album they did in the 70s.

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ProggyMan

I really don't care what they think. And I just think Pet Sounds is crap. I think Brian Wilson is an good songwriter, but not a good lyricst, and the vocals annoy the crap out of them.

sleepy jack

Kurt Cobain's voice is terrible and he can't write good lyrics either. Brian Wilson is an actual strong vocalist and a good musician, producer, and arranger. Cobain has nothing going for him other then devout fan boys and girls who spend more time contemplating their angst then listening to his music.

Pet Sounds is better than Nevermind, and Pet Sounds is more important. Theres really no arguing it, you can't even argue it since you really didn't reply to my post at all or try and back up your ridiculous statement.

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sleepy jack

Side question, I have mostly everything the Beach Boys have ever done would anybody be interested in me reviewing their discography (with the exception of their live albums, I don't have those) once I finish my top 100 albums?

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ProggyMan

No, Pet Sunds is a bunch of boring, safe, overly melodic pop songs. Wilson is pretty terrible lyricist as well, as highlighted in my sig. Wilson's voice is also annoying as hell. The production sounds dated and the songs all have a repetitive, sparkling quality.

sleepy jack

And of all bands to praise over them, you praise Nirvana? What is Nirvana but a dated cliche grunge band? Everything about them screams 90s, and once again Kurt Cobain is a terrible lyricist who isn't a good singer. All untruth aside in your argument to hail Nirvana over the Beach Boys when the same argument could be applied to Nirvana is ridiculous and hypocritical.

Pet Sounds* is a great album, the melodies are beautiful and its one of the most influential albums ever. Vocal annoyances is completely a preference thing, I love his voice and if you're going to bitch about vocals you can at least point out Love, who does a good deal of the singing too. The vocal melodies were complex and innovative and have been repeated in pop ever since and bitching about the recording? Brian Wilson is an amazing producer and the recording techniques he used here were genius. Pet Sounds altered the face of music, Nirvana kick-started a trend.

You're really not arguing your point, your recycling the same crap and not backing up your original statement which was "Pet Sounds is worse than anything by Nirvana." which I have proven wrong several times already. So please if you're going to reply don't just go "uh, whats something about it I can bitch about? oh! the vocals yeah those suck and uh the production AWFUL and yeah blah blah" because the stuff you're saying isn't just ignorant, its flat out wrong.

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ProggyMan

That was an exaggeration for to start an arguement. In Utero>Pet Sounds. Everything else by Nirvana is total crap. The production does sound dated, the lyrics are better than their earlier work, but still pretty bad, and the vocals are annoying(Is there something beyond personal reference in this debate), I never said that Pet Sounds wasn't great. I think the melodies are boring, and frankly the arrangements sound the same after repeated listens. The melodies start soundng the same to.

sleepy jack

Of course the melodies and arrangements would sound the same with repeated listens, the album isn't magical it doesn't change with each listen. In Utero isn't any better than any other Nirvana album or much different, fanboys can argue its so mind blowingly better and different all they want, its still unoriginal typical 90s grunge.

Also you original statement is "Pet Sounds is worse than anything by Nirvana" and now you're saying "Everything else by Nirvana is total crap." and "I never said that Pet Sounds wasn't great." (and earlier you'd said "I just think Pet Sounds is crap.") maybe before going into an argument you should learn to quit tripping over your own feet.

And I repeat (because you seem to be unable to do anything other then pull incorrect arguments out of your ass). So please if you're going to reply don't just go "uh, whats something about it I can bitch about? oh! the vocals yeah those suck and uh the production AWFUL and yeah blah blah" because the stuff you're saying isn't just ignorant, its flat out wrong.

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