Micshazam's album and song picks

Trollheart · 04-08-2018, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

There are similar sounds used for MMM, but it's too diverse throughout the album for me to call it repetitious. And it's not abrasive you pansy.

I think that both theories are true: they were ideas that Reed wanted to try out and his label also would hate it. Win win win.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MicShazam

There was a certain droning noise that appears on so much of the album that I had a hard time getting around it. I even got a bit angry when the second track started with that noise again, because I really hoped that would be the end of it. I'm not saying there's no change at all on the album, but I really wanted it to take a more dynamic and varied approach than it does. I think that, intentionally or not, Lou Reed has crafted one of the least welcoming noise albums ever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Sounds like you missed the variety tbh. It's a subtle variety but no two moments on the record are the same apart from the closing loop.

That's adorable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MicShazam

Like I said, it's not very accessible to plebs who don't appreciate the genre.

Seriously. Any other crazy ass, abrasive, mentally taxing noise project I've listened to felt less like actually sticking my head in a tumble drier full of screws.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Does that category include more than 10 albums? Because that's--and I don't mean this as an insult--hella ignorant.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

It really isn't. It's actually oddly lush and euphoric, like the aural equivalent of the instant of brain death followed by seeing god. It took me a few times listening to it but eventually I got over the hump and it's now pretty fantastic and I don't even listen to noise.

Look, all you need to know is that I listened to it and I ****ING LOVED IT! Me, the noise hater! Me, who was forced to listen to Merzbow (yeah I know but still) - now if you want pointless, abrasive, let-me-out-of-my-brain noise, he's your man. Hell, listen to him and you'll go back to Lou thinking, how relaxing. Seriously. These guys above know what they're talking about.

~~MicShazam~~ · 04-09-2018, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Go on, I'll do one. You pick. Maybe I'll do more than one. Maybe not.

My two top picks would be that Belakor album: https://open.spotify.com/album/7L4x2kIuTY5CnDOQ0PzeWh

And the Tori Amos album: https://open.spotify.com/album/77Aoown5BoLvQJnZJBICPO

Then the question is simply whether you feel more like listening to metal or something more mellow. I can't vouch for the quality of the Be'Lakor album, but I've loved all of the albums that came after this one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Look, all you need to know is that I listened to it and I ****ING LOVED IT! Me, the noise hater! Me, who was forced to listen to Merzbow (yeah I know but still) - now if you want pointless, abrasive, let-me-out-of-my-brain noise, he's your man. Hell, listen to him and you'll go back to Lou thinking, how relaxing. Seriously. These guys above know what they're talking about.

It's not going to get a 2nd chance any time soon, but let's say I won't refuse to listen to it again.

~~MicShazam~~ · 04-09-2018, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Start fresh with Blackout. Good idea. Her early albums are definitely uneven affairs, and her debut is straight trash, but I still enjoy a lot of the songs even if I don't come back to them as much as her later work.

In The Zone is where I started seeing that it maybe wouldn't continue to be so underwhelming to go through her albums, but it didn't exactly blow me away. I'm giving the next few a go soon enough.

Trollheart · 04-09-2018, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MicShazam

My two top picks would be that Belakor album: https://open.spotify.com/album/7L4x2kIuTY5CnDOQ0PzeWh

And the Tori Amos album: https://open.spotify.com/album/77Aoown5BoLvQJnZJBICPO

Then the question is simply whether you feel more like listening to metal or something more mellow. I can't vouch for the quality of the Be'Lakor album, but I've loved all of the albums that came after this one.

I'll give the Bekalor one a shot, but I should warn you, melodic death metal has had a bad track record with me so far. We'll see though.

The Batlord · 04-09-2018, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

I'll give the Bekalor one a shot, but I should warn you, melodic death metal has had a bad track record with me so far. We'll see though.

Nah they're one of the few quality bands, even if they're no In Flames.

~~MicShazam~~ · 04-09-2018, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

I'll give the Bekalor one a shot, but I should warn you, melodic death metal has had a bad track record with me so far. We'll see though.

Cool

Can't promise you'll like them, but Batty is spot on in pointing out that they're one of the few real quality bands in the genre.

EDIT: Although it's worth noting that the album you'll be checking out is their debut and as such a tad more rough edged than their other 3 albums.

Trollheart · 04-09-2018, 12:43 PM

Re: Terrible Music Challenge. If I was you I might change it to the Terrible Music Initiative, as then the acronym is TMI... Just an idea, feel free to disregard.

~~MicShazam~~ · 04-10-2018, 02:41 AM

I could also go with Binging on Unbearable Music (B.U.M.)

I think i'll stick with the current name. I didn't even want to name it something, but after a few posts I realized that I'd like to make it clear when I'm listening to something questionable, and when I'm listening to something I'm 100% serious about. I realize the difference might be hard to spot with my tastes...

Trollheart · 04-10-2018, 10:58 AM

The Frail Tide – B'elakor - 2007
Genre: Melodic Death/Doom Metal (yeah)

Do I have to rethink my attitude towards Melodic Death Metal? Up to now, anything I've heard has been, to me, anything but melodic. I'm no fan of DM, though I can listen to it, and it's always slightly amused me that there is a subgenre that calls itself Melodic Death Metal, but I'm hungry now, and it may very well be time to eat my words, because this album is ****ing amazing. From the moment it started I knew I was listening to something different, something special, and yeah, hell, even when the expected growly vocals kicked in, they weren't so bad and I could mostly understand what the guy was singing. The vocals are almost an aside though, as it's really the music we need to concentrate on here.

Can someone tell me why, aside from those vocals, this is seen as any sort of Death Metal? Now, by all means correct me if I have it wrong here, but I always thought DM was fast, loud, blurry shredding and drums that sound like they're trying to outdistance a speeding Japanese train, but this is nothing like that. Hell, there's even the most beautiful piano instrumental in “Paths”. If I had to categorise this music I'd be more leaning towards the progressive metal side of things. I don't just say that because it's one of my favourite metal genres, but the music really does seem to me to be very intricate, varied and quite epic in its construction and flow, and I tend to associate that more with prog metal bands than any other type. Does not the use of keyboard and piano here make this less of a Death Metal record? I kind of always assumed those confined themselves to the traditional guitar/bass/vocals/drums model, but of course I don't know enough about the genre to confirm that.

Mind you, I see Discogs has the album as both Death and Doom Metal: I certainly don't hear any of the latter here (other than the vox). Nevertheless, there isn't anything here I don't love. I've been grooving along with the album (this is my third listen as I write) and there aren't many, if any, Death Metal (Melodic or otherwise) albums I can say that about. The playing is amazing, the melodies catchy and at times gorgeous, and yeah, I can even appreciate the vocals, Cookie Monster though they may be. Overall, ****ing superb. Top marks.

Track Listing

Neither Shape Nor Shadow
The Desolation of Ares
Tre'aste
A Natural Apostasy
Paths
Sanguinary

~~MicShazam~~ · 04-10-2018, 12:34 PM

Thanks for a thoughtful, well written review

I did think there would be a decent chance that you would like the album, but I didn't expect this positive of a reaction, so that's great!

I'll attempt to give my thoughts on why this should indeed be classified as melodic death metal and what, in my eyes, makes that sub-genre what it is.

From a compositional and 'music theory' sort of standpoint, there's a lot this has in common with regular 'ol death metal.

1) Heavy reliance on down tuned guitars and palm muted "chugging".
2) Death metal style growled vocals.
3) "Dark" lyrical themes about death and other ominous stuff. Although usually with a more sincere angle and less of an intent to be extreme (although a lot of regular and progressive death metal these days has more thoughtful lyrics than in the early years of the genre).
4) Like regular death metal, riffs are usually tied together and repeated in clusters. Could be something along the lines of; play riff A 4 times, then play riff B 4 times, play riff C 2 times, repeat A and B, but do a variation, then transition and play a new section of the song with new riffs and a similar "chunky" structure. The trick is to make it seem fluid and like a logical progression, but it's really quite simple from a song writing standpoint.
5) Double kick drum patterns and generally powerful sounding, propulsive drumming.
6) Lots of changes of rhythmic patterns.

The tendency to have more lead guitar lines is one of the things that separates "melodeath" from just death metal. On top of that, instead of going for this Schöenbergian atonal feel of regular death metal, melodeath tends to rely more on minor chords, similar to how, say, ballads or "sad" movie scores do. This lends the sub-genre a melancholic feel (especially a band like Be'Lakor, who rides this approach for all it's worth), but if you simply shifted the chords and note-scales around a bit, it would sound a lot like normal, scary sounding death metal.

These are the main things that make melodic death metal/melodeath what it is, I'd say. For the record, I'm not sure why this album is labelled as doom. That's a bit weird.

Spoiler for slightly nerdier observation I'm probably not explaining too well:

04-09-2018, 12:43 PM	#147 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,994	Re: Terrible Music Challenge. If I was you I might change it to the Terrible Music Initiative, as then the acronym is TMI... Just an idea, feel free to disregard. __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

04-10-2018, 10:58 AM	#149 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,994	The Frail Tide – B'elakor - 2007 Genre: Melodic Death/Doom Metal (yeah) Do I have to rethink my attitude towards Melodic Death Metal? Up to now, anything I've heard has been, to me, anything but melodic. I'm no fan of DM, though I can listen to it, and it's always slightly amused me that there is a subgenre that calls itself Melodic Death Metal, but I'm hungry now, and it may very well be time to eat my words, because this album is **ing amazing. From the moment it started I knew I was listening to something different, something special, and yeah, hell, even when the expected growly vocals kicked in, they weren't so bad and I could mostly understand what the guy was singing. The vocals are almost an aside though, as it's really the music we need to concentrate on here. Can someone tell me why, aside from those vocals, this is seen as any sort of Death Metal? Now, by all means correct me if I have it wrong here, but I always thought DM was fast, loud, blurry shredding and drums that sound like they're trying to outdistance a speeding Japanese train, but this is nothing like that. Hell, there's even the most beautiful piano instrumental in “Paths”. If I had to categorise this music I'd be more leaning towards the progressive metal side of things. I don't just say that because it's one of my favourite metal genres, but the music really does seem to me to be very intricate, varied and quite epic in its construction and flow, and I tend to associate that more with prog metal bands than any other type. Does not the use of keyboard and piano here make this less of a Death Metal record? I kind of always assumed those confined themselves to the traditional guitar/bass/vocals/drums model, but of course I don't know enough about the genre to confirm that. Mind you, I see Discogs has the album as both Death and Doom Metal: I certainly don't hear any of the latter here (other than the vox). Nevertheless, there isn't anything here I don't love. I've been grooving along with the album (this is my third listen as I write) and there aren't many, if any, Death Metal (Melodic or otherwise) albums I can say that about. The playing is amazing, the melodies catchy and at times gorgeous, and yeah, I can even appreciate the vocals, Cookie Monster though they may be. Overall, ing superb. Top marks. Track Listing** Neither Shape Nor Shadow The Desolation of Ares Tre'aste A Natural Apostasy Paths Sanguinary __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

04-10-2018, 12:34 PM	#150 (permalink)
~~MicShazam~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Aalborg Posts: 7,634	Thanks for a thoughtful, well written review I did think there would be a decent chance that you would like the album, but I didn't expect this positive of a reaction, so that's great! I'll attempt to give my thoughts on why this should indeed be classified as melodic death metal and what, in my eyes, makes that sub-genre what it is. From a compositional and 'music theory' sort of standpoint, there's a lot this has in common with regular 'ol death metal. 1) Heavy reliance on down tuned guitars and palm muted "chugging". 2) Death metal style growled vocals. 3) "Dark" lyrical themes about death and other ominous stuff. Although usually with a more sincere angle and less of an intent to be extreme (although a lot of regular and progressive death metal these days has more thoughtful lyrics than in the early years of the genre). 4) Like regular death metal, riffs are usually tied together and repeated in clusters. Could be something along the lines of; play riff A 4 times, then play riff B 4 times, play riff C 2 times, repeat A and B, but do a variation, then transition and play a new section of the song with new riffs and a similar "chunky" structure. The trick is to make it seem fluid and like a logical progression, but it's really quite simple from a song writing standpoint. 5) Double kick drum patterns and generally powerful sounding, propulsive drumming. 6) Lots of changes of rhythmic patterns. The tendency to have more lead guitar lines is one of the things that separates "melodeath" from just death metal. On top of that, instead of going for this Schöenbergian atonal feel of regular death metal, melodeath tends to rely more on minor chords, similar to how, say, ballads or "sad" movie scores do. This lends the sub-genre a melancholic feel (especially a band like Be'Lakor, who rides this approach for all it's worth), but if you simply shifted the chords and note-scales around a bit, it would sound a lot like normal, scary sounding death metal. These are the main things that make melodic death metal/melodeath what it is, I'd say. For the record, I'm not sure why this album is labelled as doom. That's a bit weird. Spoiler for slightly nerdier observation I'm probably not explaining too well: There's another thing that I've noticed melodeath bands tend to do a lot. I don't know how many think about this sort of thing, but if you listen carefully to what's going on, or if you play an instrument yourself, you'll notice that there are several moments on this and other Be'Lakor albums where the band exploits the following dynamic: Play a lead melody or higher frequency (in terms of pitch) riff atop a lower register, repeated chord. Then change that chord while keeping the lead or riff on top unchanged. If you do this with certain minor key chord progressions and melodies, it will sound really "epic" and powerful whenever a chord change happens. This one might be a bit too obscure, depending on how one listens to music. Last edited by MicShazam; 04-10-2018 at 12:46 PM.

04-10-2018, 02:41 AM	#148 (permalink)
~~MicShazam~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Aalborg Posts: 7,634	I could also go with Binging on Unbearable Music (B.U.M.) I think i'll stick with the current name. I didn't even want to name it something, but after a few posts I realized that I'd like to make it clear when I'm listening to something questionable, and when I'm listening to something I'm 100% serious about. I realize the difference might be hard to spot with my tastes...