Screaming at the Moon - Music Banter Music Banter

Go Back   Music Banter > The MB Reader > Members Journal
Register Blogging Today's Posts
Welcome to Music Banter Forum! Make sure to register - it's free and very quick! You have to register before you can post and participate in our discussions with over 70,000 other registered members. After you create your free account, you will be able to customize many options, you will have the full access to over 1,100,000 posts.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-14-2010, 08:46 PM   #71 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default

I tried in vain before to carry the water for some World Music. It never flew. So I'll post one song here, off one of my favorite albums, and hopefully it works out. Try it while you're doing something else. Let it sink in.

Bandoneon and cello aren't always a pop-smash combo, but I think this is the sort of thing you use for background music while you create art yourself. Try.

__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 06:43 AM   #72 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default

So I'm on No Depression's e-mail list. I don't normally read every issue cover to cover but I do check out the articles and see what strikes my fancy. In the most recent letter, one such has...

The history of any art form can eventually be traced back to its folk roots. The rich and subtle paintings of DaVinci or Vermeer have their antecedents in the simplified cave paintings of Lascaux. The delicate sculpture of Michelangelo, Bernini, or Rodin find their roots in the bluntly voluptuous Venus figures from tens of thousands of years ago. Of course, these folk forms endure through history, patiently awaiting their next cycle of rediscovery by future generations who re-appropriate and re-render them in their own contemporary image. This tension between the “primitive” forms of old and the “sophisticated” forms of educated artists informs much of the most celebrated modern art – see Picasso, Gauguin, Brancusi, and Dubuffet as famous examples. I can’t help but feel that roots-oriented music is entering a similar cycle where highly technical players are applying erudite musical knowledge with some of the oldest folk forms of American music (which were, in turn, derived from even older European and African forms.) I’m not sure what the hell to call it, though…


I began thinking about this after seeing the Punch Brothers play an hour long set at Grimey’s Record Shop in Nashville this weekend. For those unfamiliar, the band is composed of what would normally be traditional bluegrass instrumentation – mandolin (Chris Thile of Nickel Creek fame), fiddle (Gabe Witcher), banjo (Noam Pikelny), guitar (Chris Eldridge), and double bass (Paul Kowert). However, the Punch Brothers’ intricate melodies, harmonic density, lively counterpoint, and wild shifts both dynamically and rhythmically owe almost as much to classical music conventions as they do bluegrass. They take this form, the standard bluegrass band setup, several steps beyond the Newgrass music pioneered by John Hartford, Sam Bush, J.D. Crowe, and others in the 70’s and 80’s. It’s very difficult to classify.

While the taxonomy and categorizing of music can be a painfully frivolous endeavor, it can also be convenient. I’ve described the Punch Brothers and other groups with similar characteristics as chamber music with a strong bluegrass/old-time influence. (To emphasize that point, the Punch Brothers were heading to Vanderbilt University’s Ingram Hall, a fine-arts theater with a “chamber music” vibe and hefty price tag, right after their free afternoon in-store appearance.) So, perhaps Chambergrass might be appropriate? Or, instead of Newgrass, how about Grass Nouveau (because let’s face it, everything sounds more sophisticated in French)? None of this “highfalutin” wording is meant to imply that Grass Nouveau can’t be a foot-stopping, ass-shaking good time. It definitely can (and was on Saturday.) However, its complex forms can also make for pure head music, perfectly suited to strap on some ear cans, slurp down bong hits, and waste an afternoon drooling in a beanbag for those so inclined. Also, it can provide dense educational fodder for serious music nerds looking to study some pretty heavy compositions. In fact, the supercharged versatility of Grass Nouvea is its greatest strength, though its practitioners are few and far between (to this writer’s knowledge, anyway.)


Other than the Punch Brothers, the first group that comes to mind blending chamber music-like compositions with bluegrass and old time forms is the Sparrow Quartet (and, perhaps, some of its individual members in their solo projects.) Similar to the Punch Brothers, the Sparrow Quartet weaves very complex melodies, boisterous dynamic shifts, and somber harmonics with gleeful explosions of fiddle riffs, blues vamps, and other folk forms. The group boasts two banjo players, a fiddler, and a cellist. Of course, when one of your banjo players is Bela Fleck, renowned newgrass pioneer and virtuosic player, and the other is Abigail Washburn, a clawhammer banjo player with a stunning voice who sings in both English and Mandarin, one shouldn’t expect rote renditions of bluegrass standards. (By the way, Fleck and Washburn are now married, apparently working to create a master species of lightning-fingered banjo deities.) Filling the space around the dueling banjos are two highly educated musicians in their own right. Casey Driessen is a Berklee-trained fiddler whose solo explorations would certainly qualify as Grass Nouveu, though they have more electronic and jazz influences than the “prototypical” Punch Brothers or Sparrow Quartet. Ben Sollee is a classically-trained cellist from Kentucky whose side projects eschew the intricacies of chamber music for experiments in a soulful acoustic indie-pop with a strong rural influence. While I appreciate the solo work and various side projects of all of these musicians, the sum is greater than the whole of the parts when the Sparrow Quartet brings all of this talent together in one room. Whether they record further as a coalition or experiment separately, these are some of the musicians, along with the Punch Brothers, that I’ll keep my eye on to see what strange and interesting new hybrids flower from the roots of bluegrass music.

Of course, Bluegrass itself is also a hybrid of prior forms including European folk songs, African blues forms, early jazz, and more. Such is the history of art, constantly tilling the soil of the past and planting the seeds of differing cultures who find themselves unexpectedly intertwined. The tale is as old the hills that spawned Earl Scruggs or Roscoe Holcomb before him. While the story isn’t new, each generation tells it a little differently, re-arranging the chapters and verses. Indeed, everything old is nouvea again, and I’m glad to be around for this arrangement.


I hope you enjoyed it. Short, rich, and something most people here are nose-diving into. Also, if you missed the link at the top, here it is again.

From Newgrass to... Grass Nouveau? - Americana and roots music - No Depression
__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 05:18 PM   #73 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default How far must classical come?



Because I have no other metaphor readily available, I’m going to relate it to Cryptozoology. For years we suspected some sort of mythological creature lived in lower east Asia. You’d hear tales from villagers, shepherds, and sherpa's about some man-like thing living in the high hills. Eventually we found out those were silver-back low-land gorillas. And today we regard them as just another animal, though there are still books for of Sasquatch this and Loch Ness that.



In the music world, very few things go into the classical realm with ease. For a long time, few instruments made the cut as something that was ranged enough, and flexible enough to take on the classical repertoire; Piano created this movement, being born for the substandard instruments of the past, harpsichord, dulcimer and the harp. Once man had achieved his instrument of progression, others earned their way into the game, violin and the bowed instruments. All the manner of woodwind and see the orchestra was filled with instruments you could be classically trained in. As the style fell from favor, many would believe that what classical could achieve was already discovered, set and stone, and reduced to mere hobby for those interested enough to pursue.



Then Segovia came along, like some silver-back gorilla and said “yes, the rumors are true, the Guitar is and can be a classical instrument. Watch.” And while many wrote classical for guitar prior, it was mostly mythology, novelty, or shtick. It certainly wasn’t the proud pea**** of the concert hall we consider it today.



The question for us as appreciative observers is, what other lowland gorillas exist out there amongst the yetis and chupacabra?



This question, and to some degree passion, originates in my own fascination with one instrument bordering on the very cusp of where guitar might have been 110 years ago. For all intents and purposes, lets call it the Accordion. If you do your research, you’ll understand why its difficult to use any particular name. The problem is 3-fold.



For one thing, there doesn’t seem to be much scholarship in regard to both construction of the three major instruments (addressed later), and also the classifications tend to be, at least thus far, scattered.



To explain that last part, lets address the aforementioned 3 instruments that might comprise what I’m referring to when I say Accordion.



* Accordion – Most westerners hear this and think of the spring-like box with piano keys on it that sounds like a portable little organ. Its mostly associated in the United States with 3 major ethnic groups; Latin Americas (and Mariachi), Italian Americans (and Tarantella, generally), and Eastern European in its many different incarnations (klezmer, gypsy, ect.). To a smaller extent, the Irish population be come to mind, but its generally with another sort of accordion.



* Button Box – I’m using this title because its to differentiate the accordion above from this one. Primarily, the first is unisoronic, meaning that no matter which direction I’m moving the instrument (push, pull) it makes the same noise for the key you’re playing. The button box, possibly referred to as a melodeon by our international friends, is commonly bisoronic which is often why buttons replace keys. A push generates a different note than a pull would for the same key. Its no wonder they moved away from piano keys, which is one of the western words most iconic muscial symbols. To suggest that the white key between two black keys isn’t a D may have been see as musical-blasphemy.





* Bandoneon – The match head that set this horrible struggle on fire for me. Those many casual observers would say one IS the other, for some reason I have yet to discover, the Bandoneon is considered to be in the Concertina family, rather than the Accordion family. This is the case despite both being free-reed (like a Harmonica). Normally I’d dismiss this as ridiculous sausage-making but the bandoneon represents one of the big arguments for the “Accordions” presence as an instrument more than capable of delivering on the Classical pile. The Tango, which sounds like Classical though is often classified as “jazz” stands as the major musical force in several Latin American countries. Like Segovia, Astor Piazzolla stands as its ranking patriarch.

Why these three exist as separate entities to some degree is a mystery. They certainly aren't without their similarities, they likely have more than not, but it seems to be that the single biggest hurdle in preventing the full on acceptance of this instrument into the classical Valhalla is that scholarship is failing on an all too consistent basis. This goes well beyond the storied halls of Major Metropolitan Conservatories. There is no movement at the bottom.

This "Accordion" still sits at the bottom of public opinion. If some youth finds themselves in possession of an instrument and weekly lessons, they are likely forced there by some diaspora-laden immigrant parent who's iron-clad rule over the house insists that the instrument is learned for traditional [enter country here] traditions. And who's the biggest sitting champion of this instrument in popular culture? Its Weird Al Yankovik. I love Al, but no wonder the instrument is taking as a joke.

Lessons are impossible to find at most local schools where a migrant population doesn't carry it in. I live in a fairly forward-leaning metropolis in America, and I can't find lessons beyond someones living room. By its very existence there, it has an aura of lacking credibility. Still, the potential is there, and with the on-coming push of roots music and, as the opinion piece I posted above will suggest, "Chambergrass" the revolution might be upon us.

__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2010, 01:01 AM   #74 (permalink)
"Hermione-Lite"
 
Arya Stark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New York.
Posts: 3,084
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBig3KilledMyRainDog View Post


new ipod song.

I kinda dig it.
I'm digging it as well, surprisingly. It definitely wouldn't have been something I would have chosen on my own to listen to.
Do you only have this song or do you have the whole album?
The image is really distracting. =P
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sansa Stark View Post
I'm down with Jesus, in that case.


MB Journal.
Azucar y Especia. My blog.
Arya Stark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2010, 03:29 PM   #75 (permalink)
air quote
 
Engine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: pollen & mold
Posts: 3,108
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBig3KilledMyRainDog View Post
Then Segovia came along, like some silver-back gorilla and said “yes, the rumors are true, the Guitar is and can be a classical instrument. Watch.” And while many wrote classical for guitar prior, it was mostly mythology, novelty, or shtick. It certainly wasn’t the proud pea**** of the concert hall we consider it today.
This is the best thing you've ever written. Good job, man
Engine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2010, 10:57 PM   #76 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AwwSugar View Post
I'm digging it as well, surprisingly. It definitely wouldn't have been something I would have chosen on my own to listen to.
Do you only have this song or do you have the whole album?
The image is really distracting. =P
I don't, my dear. I don't. Delving into albums is something I might have done at a younger age, but at the ripe old age of 87, I only hope to inspire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine View Post
This is the best thing you've ever written. Good job, man
Hey thanks, I appreciate that.
__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2010, 02:00 AM   #77 (permalink)
Music Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: The Dreamworld
Posts: 62
Default

Quote:

In my second attempt at living forever I promise to cover a smaller number of topics with less coherent thought than I had prior.

Eventually this will become cave drawings, but genius cave drawing none-the-less.

I say in advance with all due confidence, you're welcome.

-Big3
That picture is dope.. What kind of camera did you use?
TheRavenEffect is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2010, 10:08 AM   #78 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default

Ha, I wish I could tell you. Thats Tom Waits, and if I were ever close enough to photograph him, let alone in the California Wine Country, I might just quit my job and work at a gas station for the rest of my life. Where do you go when your dreams have come true?

If I ever find out, i'll let you know.
__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 10:11 AM   #79 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default


Music is an insufferable interest. Despite what the coffee shop barista's will tell you, its the only art with an unbearable cult following and despite it being a traditional bastion of anti-religious folks, these barren souls walk around professing its scripture as if they not only believed in God, but they'd spoken to him and he said "thou shalt not enjoy past the first EP!"

Alright, so thats a little far. God's no hipster but for christ sakes all of his followers are. Whats humorous to me as I walk around these boards is that I've got ever idiot who just discovered Velvet Underground telling me how religion is a joke, but they'd sleep with someone for being as into WH/WL as they were.

For too many around these boards, they're Christians without the Sunday Mass; Evangelicals without the roof of a Megachurch.

But if I'm going to continue with this beleaguered metaphor, then let us be Buddhists - or at least Quakers - and count ourselves as believes in the awesome faith of music, but tempered with a strict patience and discipline. Not because I'm sick of you running off at the mouth about how great something is (I am), or racing to recite facts about bands/songs/et. all to a room full of people who already know just to prove you're a little smarty pants (I'd love to ****ing punch these people) but because we, as an old and wise people, with a deep appreciation and a keen eye for integrity know that, just as in life, love doesn't mean infatuation but an endearment to the flaws of thing.

If music were a woman, there would be some we'd love to **** repeatedly. There'd be too many we'd **** for a night and regret. Still more than would break our hearts, and a few that could snore at night, watch terrible television, nag you when you change lanes too fast on the highway, and buy us ****ty presents for Christmas but that we'd love because of those things. Because deep down, underneath that abhorrent veneer would be a genuine person who cared for you in return.

Too many around here run to the precipice, counting the ways in which something appeals to you, like some Shakespeare with a flower full of petals, never concerned for its failings or flaws until one day they arrive and we all grow disinterested. But like the more reasoned among us, our faith in the deliverance of things like music is only reinforced when it becomes less obvious at the intrinsic value of something.

I know these boards are no fan of religion but since I've dug myself this deeply, let me close with one final comment. And since I'm sure everyone's Pro-English, I'll even choose a quote from C.S. Lewis. The man once said (the jist of) that too many dismiss religion and its powers because a daily miracle isn't seen even now and again. And while no one turns water to wine, every day the trees drink up the water and nutrients, create from them fruit by which we make wine.

Sometimes its hard to notice the value of the candle when we're hunting for fireworks, but to those reasoned and patient enough, its not only seen but enjoyed to no end. I hope my comments here today can shed a light on what I rant and rave against here on a daily basis. That the raw awesome power of any bands first EP may fade, certainly, and sometimes that really is just selling out. But sometimes, if you look correctly, its just refined and tempered, somewhere out of plain view, if you're patient enough.

__________________________________________________ _____________________

Edit:

For my own personal count, there have been 78 posts (some of which must be mine) and 4,513 views. Which means, assuming none of the responses were mine, one in 58 viewers respond. Including me its likely to hit 1 in 70.
__________________
I've moved to a new address

Last edited by TheBig3; 01-20-2011 at 09:54 AM.
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 05:14 PM   #80 (permalink)
killedmyraindog
 
TheBig3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Posts: 11,172
Default


I'm not sure why, when someone tells you about Styx, you hear either Renegade or Come Sail away, because if they've got songs like the one I've posted here, I cannot imagine why is isn't leading the charts.

I've never heard this song on classic rock radio, its never been mentioned on compilation discs, and can anyone tell me why?

Before this past Wednesday night, Styx was, to me, a band in time. Unless it was the 70's, Styx weren't relevant. But this track sounds like a Rush track juiced up on Testosterone. The organ smells of Deep Purple. The guitars wail like early Ozzy.

The vocals still sound the same but at least they aren't the sell-out, "play-to-the-vagina-in-the-audience" **** you usually expect from Styx. I dare say they took a page from Springsteen's book, if by that they could have somehow gone to Springsteen through Bon Jovi (who hadn't existed heretofore).

Musicbanter, I know you're into pretentious Dictionary-Rock so you can get some art house poon, but every once in awhile you need to listen to something with a set of balls on it. Listen to this, take off your ironic glasses, and go **** that chick who asked you for a cigarette. I know her mouth smells like a carpet store, but she's still a freak.

Thanks, Tommy Shaw.
__________________
I've moved to a new address
TheBig3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Similar Threads



© 2003-2024 Advameg, Inc.