Metal Evolution.

Metal Connoisseur · 02-17-2012, 12:58 PM

I thought some of the topics for some of the episodes were out of place like the shock rock, grunge, and maybe even the hair metal episode. The grunge one was interesting (albeit unnecessary--I've never really connected grunge and metal before outside of the Melvins or Soundgarden), but the shock rock and hair metal episodes seemed pretty useless to me because their focus centered mainly on bands who didn't contribute a whole lot to metal as a whole. Dunn's choice to not cover death, black, or hardcore punk influenced metal is a travesty because that's where some of metal's greatest bands are.

If he really wanted to do an in-depth study, given that there was enough interest from the public and money behind the project, a whole season should be donated to each sub-genre to explore their nuances and differences. Just my take on the show.

slatesphanboi · 02-19-2012, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur

The grunge one was interesting (albeit unnecessary--I've never really connected grunge and metal before outside of the Melvins or Soundgarden), but the shock rock and hair metal episodes seemed pretty useless to me because their focus centered mainly on bands who didn't contribute a whole lot to metal as a whole.

What about Alice in Chains? In fact the whole grunge episode was basically a big lead up to the narrator coming to the conclusion that Alice in Chains was easily the most metal of the grunge bands.

Shock rock helped to bring more fans to metal. People heard about the crazy theatrics of Alice Cooper and that helped to spread the word! Same with Marilyn Manson a few years later.

Hair Metal is an important episode because for alot of folks when they think of metal... they think of Hair Metal. Also Hair Metal brought in alot of ballads and stuff to Metal (although one could argue KISS had started that trend with 'Beth') and that in turn brought in alot of chicks.

Quote:

Dunn's choice to not cover death, black, or hardcore punk influenced metal is a travesty because that's where some of metal's greatest bands are.

When it comes to Black, Death, etc... Well Metal Evolution is a tv series so that shall probably be on season two!

Metal Connoisseur · 02-19-2012, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatesphanboi

What about Alice in Chains? In fact the whole grunge episode was basically a big lead up to the narrator coming to the conclusion that Alice in Chains was easily the most metal of the grunge bands.

Shock rock helped to bring more fans to metal. People heard about the crazy theatrics of Alice Cooper and that helped to spread the word! Same with Marilyn Manson a few years later.

Hair Metal is an important episode because for alot of folks when they think of metal... they think of Hair Metal. Also Hair Metal brought in alot of ballads and stuff to Metal (although one could argue KISS had started that trend with 'Beth') and that in turn brought in alot of chicks.

When it comes to Black, Death, etc... Well Metal Evolution is a tv series so that shall probably be on season two!

Alice in Chains was by far the most "metal" of the grunge bands, but that doesn't mean that grunge and metal are connected in any way. If I remember correctly, in the interviews, the people from Tad and Soundgarden didn't associate themselves with metal at all.

What you said about shock rock and hair metal is all true but to reiterate what Unknown Soldier said, we all know about that stuff. The only people who are going to watch Metal Evolution on VH1 Classic are metalheads--and most of them already know about Alice Cooper and the LA hair bands. I was just expressing my frustration that Dunn didn't decide to cover some more extreme or obscure ground is all.

Season two all depends if they had high enough ratings to warrant the funding for future episodes...which idk if they got or not.

slatesphanboi · 02-20-2012, 03:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur

The only people who are going to watch Metal Evolution on VH1 Classic are metalheads--and most of them already know about Alice Cooper and the LA hair bands.

Not sure that is true. I'm more of an alt-rocker that is happy listening to the Pixies and Breeders and I have watched several episodes of 'Metal Evolution'.

Why?

Well there is a sub-genre of Alternative Metal out there so I am interested in what the show might say about bands like Helmet, Flyleaf, and even Soundgarden.

Also I do recognize that there are some seriously talented artists in Metal: Ronnie James Dio had a great voice and also King Diamond was just hella' creative and a 'one of a kind' sort of artist.

Also folks don't watch this show in a vacuum. I happened to watch the grunge episode with my 11 year old nephew who I was baby-sitting at the time and he is just starting to get into music and stuff and watched a little bit... other folks will be exposed to it if it is on the boob tube.

Metal Connoisseur · 02-20-2012, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatesphanboi

Not sure that is true. I'm more of an alt-rocker that is happy listening to the Pixies and Breeders and I have watched several episodes of 'Metal Evolution'.

Why?

Well there is a sub-genre of Alternative Metal out there so I am interested in what the show might say about bands like Helmet, Flyleaf, and even Soundgarden.

Also I do recognize that there are some seriously talented artists in Metal: Ronnie James Dio had a great voice and also King Diamond was just hella' creative and a 'one of a kind' sort of artist.

Also folks don't watch this show in a vacuum. I happened to watch the grunge episode with my 11 year old nephew who I was baby-sitting at the time and he is just starting to get into music and stuff and watched a little bit... other folks will be exposed to it if it is on the boob tube.

There was never an alternative metal episode, so bands like Flyleaf and Helmet weren't mentioned. Leaving out alt metal could be cited as another flaw in the show.

Like I said earlier, if the show comes back for a second season, Sam Dunn very may well cover the bases he missed in the first season.

slatesphanboi · 02-21-2012, 02:14 AM

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Originally Posted by duga

I never knew that! Cool stuff...now I feel like listening to some AIC to see if I can pick any of it out.

duga, that will be real easy because Elton John actually played on an AIC song once:

Quote:

The poignant “Black Gives Way to Blue”—which serves as the title track on the new Alice In Chains album—contains a guest appearance on the piano by none other than Elton John.

For more, link: Alice in Chains' Jerry Cantrell and Elton John on their 'Black Gives Way to Blue' collaboration | The Music Mix | EW.com

Actually this isn't that surprising to me, after Big Elton played on November Rain with Guns and Roses nothing really surprises me that much anymore!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur

There was never an alternative metal episode, so bands like Flyleaf and Helmet weren't mentioned. Leaving out alt metal could be cited as another flaw in the show.

Like I said earlier, if the show comes back for a second season, Sam Dunn very may well cover the bases he missed in the first season.

Hmm, Flyleaf and Helmet could have been put into the nu-metal episode they had... I avoided that episode like the plague though since I generally dislike that genre!!!

Hopefully there shall be a season 2, that would be cool.

mr dave · 02-21-2012, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatesphanboi

duga, that will be real easy because Elton John actually played on an AIC song once:

Hmm, Flyleaf and Helmet could have been put into the nu-metal episode they had... I avoided that episode like the plague though since I generally dislike that genre!!!

That's pretty cool, I was being a jerk with the Tiny Dancer / Down in a Hole comment but the statement on influence was honest.

Also putting Flyleaf and Helmet on the same level just hurts. Helmet was recognized as one of the 'new' generation of metal bands in the early 90s, along with the likes of Ministry, Fear Factory, and Biohazard (in fact I recall a Guitar World Magazine featuring Page Hamilton and Al Jourgensen on the cover from like 1993).

Flyleaf just sounds like a combination of Avril Lavigne and the Deftones (another originator to the nu-metal sound).

02-17-2012, 12:58 PM	#1 (permalink)
Metal Connoisseur Franchise Player Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 539	I thought some of the topics for some of the episodes were out of place like the shock rock, grunge, and maybe even the hair metal episode. The grunge one was interesting (albeit unnecessary--I've never really connected grunge and metal before outside of the Melvins or Soundgarden), but the shock rock and hair metal episodes seemed pretty useless to me because their focus centered mainly on bands who didn't contribute a whole lot to metal as a whole. Dunn's choice to not cover death, black, or hardcore punk influenced metal is a travesty because that's where some of metal's greatest bands are. If he really wanted to do an in-depth study, given that there was enough interest from the public and money behind the project, a whole season should be donated to each sub-genre to explore their nuances and differences. Just my take on the show.