mr dave

you're still ignoring the power and influence the publishers have over the developers. madworld has great potential, but the only reason it's getting as much attention as it is right now is due to it's unique art style.

you're also missing my point in regards to the mechanics and design philosophy. it's not a matter of the complexity of writing code it's a matter of changing the way you perceive playing the game prior to even drawing up the first flowchart. it's also one of the main reasons so many wii games have waggle controls that really don't do anything besides make you look like you're rubbing one out (especially in party game events). it's one thing to conceptualize it, it's another to implement it to properly emulate the concept, see red steel for the perfect example.

do you really think that releasing a new game for the wii that uses the gamecube controller as its primary input won't have people freaking out and calling it a leftover from the GC days?

i'll say it again, the wii's greatest strength is also it's greatest weakness. couple that with the announcement of a new version of the machine in the next 2 years and i doubt many 3rd party developers will be willing to invest much into improving their positions with the current hardware.

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i am the universe

boo boo

True, but art style can be very important for a game.

I doubt people would like The Wind Waker as much if it looked just like any other Zelda game in visual style. The cel shaded look was a big part of that games appeal.

Sega have always invested in "arty" games since the days of the Saturn, they may not be commercial successes but they make for some very acclaimed games. If anything the lack of these kinda games have been one of Segas greatest weaknesses since the Sega-Sammy merger.

If anything people should learn how Nintendo has been designing games for their own system. I think they implemented the unique controls into games like Galaxy and TP perfectly, if not so much for Brawl, which was never meant to use the wiimote in the first place.

Well you can't have your cake and eat it too. Either you have a bunch of games that focus more on how to use the wiimote than solid gameplay or you actually start dissing out more than just a few great third party games, I don't care how they do it, they should do it. Honestly I don't care if the Wii is just Gamecube 2.0, since I love the Gamecube I'm all for an extended version of that console, which I think was never used to it's full potential either.

Third parties should at least take the time to learn how to use the wiimote controls. In the meantime they can just make games with traditional control schemes, until they get the hang of the wiimote's motion sensing capabilities. They don't need to be in such a big hurry to diss games out regardless of quality.

If these companies want to make money, it should be as simple as

A. Actually making good games.
B. Making them for the biggest selling console out there, the Wii.

This dosen't justify anything, you do know that.

The Wii is the best selling console, developers should take advantage of that.

The Dreamcast was the biggest commercial failure Sega ever had (save the Sega CD and 32x), but it also had some of the best third party support Sega ever had too. Developers were pysched about it because of the advantages it had over the N64 and PS1, which were it's big competitors at the time. Developers do seem to care more about which is the more advanced system more than which is the best selling. Back then that was pretty admirable, it made owners of underdog consoles feel like they got their moneys worth. And Nintendo found a way to cope with lack of third party support, but I don't know if they can do that for a third time in a roll.

Times have changed, Sega were the underdog, and even though they are out of the hardware business, no one has taken their place, there is no underdog anymore. It's a race between 3 big superpowers. Everybody has an audience. And third parties are favoring Sony and Microsoft for no reason whatsoever other than just plain laziness. A popular console deserves a good library. It shouldn't be that hard for developers to invest in a f*cking Nintendo system. Nintendo helped make most of these developers the big names they are in the first place.

And you're telling me it's all because they think the Wii's control scheme is too complicated? Even though they don't have to use it? And what a double standard, the PS3 is a bitch to program for, even Mr. Riiiiiiiidge Racer himself admits this and he's even proud of the fact. So third parties have no problem with that but they can't even learn how to f*cking use what is a very basic form of motion sensing controls? For the best selling system?

Makes no sense at all. Especially now that differences between systems in terms of processing power is not as important as it once was. Since the 6th gen consoles, developers have all the power they need, now it's all about the better graphics. All they should be concerned about is gameplay. The Wii's graphics are excellent, I don't care what anyone says. Just because it can't animate f*cking dust particles or such appealing things as facial wrinkles PS3 and 360 fanboys have to go hyperbole crazy about how bad the Wii's graphics are. Whatever happened to escapism? Isn't that what video games are about? What's with the needless obsession with realistic graphics?

Nintendo knew that what they needed in order to push games into new directions was not better graphics, but innovatve gameplay mechanics and a new control scheme. So yeah, they decided to do somethign different and risky, which financially paid off... And yet this is going to be their undoing? Because gamers seem to prefer consoles that support enough uninspired retreads of popular games as far as the eye can see... But with better graphics?

Ok, I'm starting to come off as the obvious Nintendo fanboy here and I don't want to bring this lame ass console war bullsh*t to the forum so I'll just leave it with this, I'm not trying to argue for why I think the Wii is the best of the new consoles. All I'm asking is that they get their piece of the third party pie, they sold their damn console, they f*cking deserve it. I just don't want Nintendo to go the way of Sega someday. Especially for such a dumb reason as not following this lame trend of next gen graphics and making everything doo doo brown.

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tdoc210

nintendo stopped being good with the n64
i hated the gamecube, traded for ps2, the wii just looks like a kids toy, played one, i dont ****ing like it
anyways
nintendo could be awesome if they made t3h graphix bettar but w/e at least you can play with regular controls instead of using that retarded wiimote
though brawl is allright with it

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We went back there and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God... the genius of that.

FaSho

the only good wii only game imo is the mario kart one

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tdoc210

i hate using a damn steering wheel thing
and
uhg
that game sucks if you get stuck

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We went back there and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God... the genius of that.

mr dave

but you're still talking as if developers can act freely of publishers and that just doesn't happen anymore. they don't really need to change anything in regards to the products they release in order to continue generating a profit.

don't most people who have a wii also have another console?

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i am the universe

boo boo

WRONG.

Look, I love the PS2 and all, I don't want to do this whole "my console rules and yours sucks" charade, the Gamecube had an excellent first party library, hell it did have some pretty solid third party games too. Not the quantity of titles that PS2 had but.... Is it so hard to not have both? When I was a kid I had a Sega Genesis and a Super Nintendo, so while all these dumbass kids were arguing over which was better, I was at home enjoying both.

This bullcrap argument again. It's a video game console. Just because theres not as much blood and not everything is f*cking brown dosen't make it a kiddy system, because god forbid graphics and inane violence is not what video games are all about.



I remember playing Twillight Princess and using the wiimote to swing my sword and aim my bow, killing moblins, and then playing Galaxy while using the wiimote in a lot of creative ways.

And the whole time I'm thinking to myself "oh yeah, this is totally retarded, what's all this having fun nonsense? I'd rather try to figure out what button does what because theres like 30 of them and oh, if they threw in some horrendous loading times that would have helped too"

Originality is so lame.

Hahahahaha. No.

The wiimote was fantastic for Galaxy, TP and Wiisports, it sucked for Brawl, but that's a Gamecube controller game anyway.

You REALLY hate fun don't you?

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http://www.last.fm/user/kingboobs

FaSho

the steering wheel makes it a lot less fun imo i always just play with the wiimote

i also like a few other wii games, but theyre the ones that you use a gamecube controller for

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tdoc210

i have a love hate for nintendos first party
mario was good for the first 100 games
then it gets old
i didn't like galaxy idk, i never liked 3d mario games
i like zelda
that is the only first party nintendo game series that i adore
in fact it think its the bets series i ever played

the wii could have been an upgrade to the gamecube with a controller add on
i enjoy controllers instead of swinging **** around

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We went back there and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God... the genius of that.

boo boo

Even though Nintendo has slapped Mario's face on just about everything, they take their time when it comes to his actual platformers, and I mean really take their time. In his 27 years, Mario has starred in a total of 15 platformers, not including those not made by Nintendo. That's only a third of as many Mega Man or Sonic's platformers, bloody hell, Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon almost have that many games.

There is a consistancy however, all of these games (with the exception of Mario Bros arcade, Mario Clash and Wrecking Crew) are excellent. So that's a lame ass thing to criticize Nintendo about.

And I love the wiimote, so to each his own.

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It's only knock n' knowall, but I like it

http://www.last.fm/user/kingboobs