Your Day

~~jwb~~ · 01-09-2021, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie Monday

@ jwb Fair enough, but it still seems like a naturalistic fallacy to me. If he points out that we should question hierarchies then that's fine, but that doesn't take anything away from the fact that he brings up hierarchies being ubiquitous in nature as an argument for their usefullness to humans.

No because the naturalistic fallacy is saying something is morally good because it's natural. He's not saying that. He's saying that its not just an arbitrary social convention, that it emerges in nature in quite primitive forms of life based on basic utility.

~~jwb~~ · 01-09-2021, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

I was ****ting on kermit before it was cool.

nobody has mocked him better than nick mullen from cumtown tbh

The Batlord · 01-09-2021, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

No because the naturalistic fallacy is saying something is morally good because it's natural. He's not saying that. He's saying that its not just an arbitrary social convention, that it emerges in nature in quite primitive forms of life based on basic utility.

But it's his unstated implication that it is good because it is natural, no?

~~jwb~~ · 01-09-2021, 03:14 PM

Not exactly, more that it's not necessarily always bad. That some amount of hierarchy is necessary for society to function but it should be questioned to prevent tyranny. Like I said, very mundane stuff. I was on a lot of drugs and like i said he was very verbose about it all so after a year of listening to him it got old and he started repeating the same tropes and i realized it wasn't that deep, just dressed up with language. I agree with you that he's a grifter. But when people take the message that he's promoting social darwinism and that kind of thing they are misundersanding what he says which is sorta what made me ignore the haters for so long because they sounded like they had no clue what he was even saying. Once I saw the videos about what post modernism actually is then i started to see the grift. Then the benzo thing just put the nail in the coffin. RIP

OccultHawk · 01-09-2021, 03:20 PM

Didn’t he go to Russia for some quack treatment where they induce a coma?

~~jwb~~ · 01-09-2021, 03:31 PM

Yeah. And then made a video talking about how he became addicted and how it was a physical addiction not a psychological addiction, a distinction that is supposed to detract from the stigma of being an addict. Which is stupid. Because there's no such thing as a physical dependency without a psychological dependency. You can have a psychological dependency without a physical dependency, as in no withdrawal symptoms, but if you get to the point of a physical dependency then you absolutely also have a psychological dependency on that drug. You have triggers and patterns of use etc that will outlast any physical withdrawal symptoms. I think he just made that distinction to make him look less hypocritical for preaching the self help **** and clean your room **** while his room was on fire. I don't respect that at all.

The Batlord · 01-09-2021, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

Not exactly, more that it's not necessarily always bad. That some amount of hierarchy is necessary for society to function but it should be questioned to prevent tyranny. Like I said, very mundane stuff. I was on a lot of drugs and like i said he was very verbose about it all so after a year of listening to him it got old and he started repeating the same tropes and i realized it wasn't that deep, just dressed up with language. I agree with you that he's a grifter. But when people take the message that he's promoting social darwinism and that kind of thing they are misundersanding what he says which is sorta what made me ignore the haters for so long because they sounded like they had no clue what he was even saying. Once I saw the videos about what post modernism actually is then i started to see the grift. Then the benzo thing just put the nail in the coffin. RIP

I'm not talking about the internal consistency of his position but that his conscious approach to communicating his position was to dog whistle to people who'd be buying his books a basically naturalistic fallacy.

**Marie Monday** · 01-09-2021, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

No because the naturalistic fallacy is saying something is morally good because it's natural. He's not saying that. He's saying that its not just an arbitrary social convention, that it emerges in nature in quite primitive forms of life based on basic utility.

If that's the definition of a naturalistic fallacy then sure, but like Bat said it seems like he's implying that that means hierarchies tend to be useful to us, or that they're more or less inevitable, and that is at least adjacent to a naturalistic fallacy. I see how it's being misunderstood though.

OccultHawk · 01-09-2021, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

Yeah. And then made a video talking about how he became addicted and how it was a physical addiction not a psychological addiction, a distinction that is supposed to detract from the stigma of being an addict. Which is stupid. Because there's no such thing as a physical dependency without a psychological dependency. You can have a psychological dependency without a physical dependency, as in no withdrawal symptoms, but if you get to the point of a physical dependency then you absolutely also have a psychological dependency on that drug. You have triggers and patterns of use etc that will outlast any physical withdrawal symptoms. I think he just made that distinction to make him look less hypocritical for preaching the self help **** and clean your room **** while his room was on fire. I don't respect that at all.

I couldn’t find it. I found this

He says he didn’t understand the addictive power of benzos...

Uh whaaaa? That makes about as much sense as a hip hop fan saying they never heard of Run-DMC.

If you have a link to the video you were talking about I’d like to watch it unless it’s an hour long or something

OccultHawk · 01-09-2021, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie Monday

If that's the definition of a naturalistic fallacy then sure, but like Bat said it seems like he's implying that that means hierarchies tend to be useful to us, or that they're more or less inevitable, and that is at least adjacent to a naturalistic fallacy. I see how it's being misunderstood though.

Have you ever listened to the guy?

01-09-2021, 03:20 PM	#72065 (permalink)
OccultHawk one-balled nipple jockey Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Dirty Souf Biatch Posts: 22,006	Didn’t he go to Russia for some quack treatment where they induce a coma? __________________ 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Member of the Year & Journal of the Year Champion Behold the Writing of THE LEGEND: https://www.musicbanter.com/members-...p-lighter.html

01-09-2021, 03:14 PM	#72064 (permalink)
~~jwb~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 4,403	Not exactly, more that it's not necessarily always bad. That some amount of hierarchy is necessary for society to function but it should be questioned to prevent tyranny. Like I said, very mundane stuff. I was on a lot of drugs and like i said he was very verbose about it all so after a year of listening to him it got old and he started repeating the same tropes and i realized it wasn't that deep, just dressed up with language. I agree with you that he's a grifter. But when people take the message that he's promoting social darwinism and that kind of thing they are misundersanding what he says which is sorta what made me ignore the haters for so long because they sounded like they had no clue what he was even saying. Once I saw the videos about what post modernism actually is then i started to see the grift. Then the benzo thing just put the nail in the coffin. RIP

01-09-2021, 03:31 PM	#72066 (permalink)
~~jwb~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 4,403	Yeah. And then made a video talking about how he became addicted and how it was a physical addiction not a psychological addiction, a distinction that is supposed to detract from the stigma of being an addict. Which is stupid. Because there's no such thing as a physical dependency without a psychological dependency. You can have a psychological dependency without a physical dependency, as in no withdrawal symptoms, but if you get to the point of a physical dependency then you absolutely also have a psychological dependency on that drug. You have triggers and patterns of use etc that will outlast any physical withdrawal symptoms. I think he just made that distinction to make him look less hypocritical for preaching the self help ** and clean your room ** while his room was on fire. I don't respect that at all.