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-   -   Eugenics and the 21st Century (https://www.musicbanter.com/lounge/69408-eugenics-21st-century.html)

Stephen 05-01-2013 08:05 PM

People think way too much. Trouble is the smart people talk themselves out of reproducing and the idiots breed like rabbits which just means the next generation of smart people are overwhelmed by the idiots all over again.

Hitch 05-01-2013 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stp (Post 1314313)
People think way too much. Trouble is the smart people talk themselves out of reproducing and the idiots breed like rabbits which just means the next generation of smart people are overwhelmed by the idiots all over again.

I've always thought that genetics never worked that way, in that two idiots can breed, but as long as not say, there is no malnourishment, the child can end up quite contrary to what their parents may be. Of course, doesn't seem to happen often enough, possibly due to the overwhelming influence of the parents, but it's the same reason why I don't feel a necessary revulsion towards a child of a demagogue or dictator.

duga 05-01-2013 08:33 PM

Do I believe in eugenics? No. Do I believe in being able to remove undesirable genes Gattaca style? Yes, but with limits. For example, ensuring your child doesn't have Down Syndrome would be something I hope everyone can agree on. There is absolutely no detriment to being able to eliminate risk for disease and genetic disorder. However, my reason for not allowing the picking and choosing of the "best" genes isn't really a moral stance...it's more of a scientific one. Eventually, genetic diversity will be diluted out and the human race would put themselves at risk.

I know a lot of this seems like science fiction, but we are very close to all being judged based on our genetic makeup. Currently, it costs about $2000 to re-sequence an entire genome. That is down from about $10,000 a little less than 10 years ago and well over a million 20 years ago. Once that comes down to $100 dollars, everyone will be required to have their genome sequenced (sorry, it's just gonna happen). Then your insurance rates will be based on your genetic predispositions. I hate to say it, but this stuff is inevitable.

Burning Down 05-01-2013 09:01 PM

I don't believe in the practice of eugenics. I think it's unfair to prevent people from having children based on them having certain diseases or genetic mutations that might be passed onto their offspring. In fact, it goes against Darwinism - evolution of the human race would probably come to a standstill upon elimination of "bad genes", and humans would be at risk for extinction (presumably).

Quote:

Originally Posted by duga (Post 1314324)
I know a lot of this seems like science fiction, but we are very close to all being judged based on our genetic makeup. Currently, it costs about $2000 to re-sequence an entire genome. That is down from about $10,000 a little less than 10 years ago and well over a million 20 years ago. Once that comes down to $100 dollars, everyone will be required to have their genome sequenced (sorry, it's just gonna happen). Then your insurance rates will be based on your genetic predispositions. I hate to say it, but this stuff is inevitable.

I'm actually really excited for the opportunity to have my personal genome sequenced. I know that I will find things out that I probably don't want to know (i.e. that I'm at high, high risk for some terrible disease like Alzheimer's, etc.), but it will feed my curiosity about genetics in general. Plus we don't have the ass-backwards issue of being discriminated against because of predisposed health conditions. Canada = :love: :love: :love:

However it does raise the question of genetic privacy and who will be able to see or have access to your personal DNA sequence. This lovely scientist explains the concept of DNA sequencing and genetic privacy very well, I think:


duga 05-01-2013 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down (Post 1314350)
I don't believe in the practice of eugenics. I think it's unfair to prevent people from having children based on them having certain diseases or genetic mutations that might be passed onto their offspring. In fact, it goes against Darwinism - evolution of the human race would probably come to a standstill upon elimination of "bad genes", and humans would be at risk for extinction (presumably).

There will still be plenty of diversity as long as we allow natural genetic recombination of a "normal" genome. Making sure you don't have an extra X chromosome is not unreasonable and surely doesn't add to the fitness of our species. There are a lot of theories on this...but essentially, we have halted our own evolution just through our medical breakthroughs. These "faulty" genes would have been filtered out through natural selection if we lived naturally. So now it's up to us if we want to eradicate things like Alzheimer's or Lou Gehrig's.

I'll have to watch that video you posted. I'm fascinated by the whole thing myself.

Scarlett O'Hara 05-01-2013 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down (Post 1314350)

I'm actually really excited for the opportunity to have my personal genome sequenced. I know that I will find things out that I probably don't want to know (i.e. that I'm at high, high risk for some terrible disease like Alzheimer's, etc.), but it will feed my curiosity about genetics in general. Plus we don't have the ass-backwards issue of being discriminated against because of predisposed health conditions. Canada = :love: :love: :love:

However it does raise the question of genetic privacy and who will be able to see or have access to your personal DNA sequence. This lovely scientist explains the concept of DNA sequencing and genetic privacy very well, I think:

I'm excited about it too! I'm really keen to know whether I'm likely to get breast cancer when I'm older as my grandmother got it at 21 so there is a higher risk for me. She also has has trouble with her reproductive system which I've had trouble with too. I certainly agree about the privacy part, it's nobodies business what you body's health conditions might be.

New Zealand is getting very close to being openly accepting of people with disabilities and mental illness. There's still more work to be done to make offices and public places more disability friendly.

Burning Down 05-01-2013 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla (Post 1314357)
I'm excited about it too! I'm really keen to know whether I'm likely to get breast cancer when I'm older as my grandmother got it at 21 so there is a higher risk for me. She also has has trouble with her reproductive system which I've had trouble with too. I certainly agree about the privacy part, it's nobodies business what you body's health conditions might be.

New Zealand is getting very close to being openly accepting of people with disabilities and mental illness. There's still more work to be done to make offices and public places more disability friendly.

You should watch the video, she does a great job of explaining the ethical issues surrounding genetic privacy - like should you tell your siblings/parents what you know about your genome because it might affect them, etc, or is it none of their business.

Scarlett O'Hara 05-01-2013 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down (Post 1314379)
You should watch the video, she does a great job of explaining the ethical issues surrounding genetic privacy - like should you tell your siblings/parents what you know about your genome because it might affect them, etc, or is it none of their business.

I will, thanks for posting it!

djchameleon 05-02-2013 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duga (Post 1314355)
There will still be plenty of diversity as long as we allow natural genetic recombination of a "normal" genome. Making sure you don't have an extra X chromosome is not unreasonable and surely doesn't add to the fitness of our species. There are a lot of theories on this...but essentially, we have halted our own evolution just through our medical breakthroughs. These "faulty" genes would have been filtered out through natural selection if we lived naturally. So now it's up to us if we want to eradicate things like Alzheimer's or Lou Gehrig's.

I'll have to watch that video you posted. I'm fascinated by the whole thing myself.

Diversity is my main concern whenever Eugenics is mentioned and it kind of scares me because of that fact but if it's like you claim then I wouldn't have too much of a problem with it getting rid of certain diseases that preventable through the removal of certain genes.

anticipation 05-02-2013 01:17 PM

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