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sleepy jack 08-26-2007 12:04 AM

Mother Teresa
 
Quote:

In life, Mother Teresa was an icon — for believers — of God's work on Earth. Her ministry to the poor of Calcutta was a world-renowned symbol of religious compassion. She was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.

In a rare interview in 1986, Mother Teresa told CBS News she had a calling, based on unquestioned faith.

"They are all children of God, loved and created by the same heart of God," she said.

But now, it has emerged that Mother Teresa was so doubtful of her own faith that she feared being a hypocrite, reports CBS News correspondent Mark Phillips.

In a new book that compiles letters she wrote to friends, superiors and confessors, her doubts are obvious.

Shortly after beginning work in Calcutta's slums, the spirit left Mother Teresa.

"Where is my faith?" she wrote. "Even deep down… there is nothing but emptiness and darkness... If there be God — please forgive me."

Eight years later, she was still looking to reclaim her lost faith.

"Such deep longing for God… Repulsed, empty, no faith, no love, no zeal," she said.

As her fame increased, her faith refused to return. Her smile, she said, was a mask.

"What do I labor for?" she asked in one letter. "If there be no God, there can be no soul. If there be no soul then, Jesus, You also are not true."

"These are letters that were kept in the archbishop's house," the Rev. Brian Kolodiejchuk told Phillips.

The letters were gathered by Rev. Kolodiejchuk, the priest who's making the case to the Vatican for Mother Teresa's proposed sainthood. He said her obvious spiritual torment actually helps her case.

"Now we have this new understanding, this new window into her interior life, and for me this seems to be the most heroic," said Rev. Kolodiejchuk.

According to her letters, Mother Teresa died with her doubts. She had even stopped praying, she once said.

The church decided to keep her letters, even though one of her dying wishes was that they be destroyed. Perhaps now we know why.
source

boo boo 08-26-2007 01:09 AM

YouTube - BULL$#!+ - Friends of Mother Theresa
YouTube - BULL$#!+ - Mother Theresa

Theres another link which I will refrain from posting, due to graphic content.

TheBig3 08-26-2007 06:09 PM

I <3 Christopher Hutchins

Son of JayJamJah 08-26-2007 07:53 PM

Christopher Hitchins is a marvelous orator and an equal drinker!

swim 08-26-2007 07:54 PM

So she's just like every other Catholic. Cool.

anticipation 08-26-2007 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimintheundertow (Post 391047)
So she's just like every other Catholic. Cool.

player haterz.





All the cool Catholics know that Mother Teresa is so last decade.

boo boo 08-26-2007 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBig3KilledMyRainDog (Post 390999)
I <3 Christopher Hutchins

Every liberal says that.

Until they realise that he supported the war in Iraq. ;)

Anyway. I'm currently compiling a list/article/blog of the 50 most evil, stupid and downright loathsome "Christians". Anyone you guys think to be particularly worthy?

EDIT: Please spare me the Bono requests.

adidasss 08-27-2007 03:36 AM

I actually already knew this. I don't think it was a big secret. And it makes her work even more incredible.

right-track 08-27-2007 04:07 AM

It seems she spent a lifetime discovering something lots of people already know...that there is no God.

boo boo 08-27-2007 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adidasss (Post 391161)
I actually already knew this. I don't think it was a big secret. And it makes her work even more incredible.

Click my links. But if thats not enough you can also look up Aroup Chatterjee and Christopher Hitchens work on her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by right-track (Post 391168)
It seems she spent a lifetime discovering something lots of people already know...that there is no God.

No one knows that there is no god. Nobody knows anything for certain.

right-track 08-27-2007 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 391175)
No one knows that there is no god.

I know this for certain, that if there is a God...that woman put it to shame.

God's contribution to humanity, is conspicuous by it's absence.

As you may have guessed, I'm not a religious person.
It's my opinion that the existance of God is based on man's fear and that the whole religious deal is founded on nothing more than wishful thinking.

anticipation 08-27-2007 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 391175)
Nobody knows anything for certain.

o rly?



that doesn't even make any sense at all.

right-track 08-27-2007 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by right-track (Post 391215)
I know this for certain, that if there is a God...that woman put it to shame.

God's contribution to humanity, is conspicuous by it's absence.

As you may have guessed, I'm not a religious person.
It's my opinion that the existance of God is based on man's fear and that the whole religious deal is founded on nothing more than wishful thinking.

wtf am I talking about!

adidasss 08-27-2007 05:04 PM

You'll remember when you sober up...;)

right-track 08-27-2007 05:08 PM

I posted that this morning.

I actually believe it...I just can't believe I typed it.

right-track 08-27-2007 05:14 PM

I must have had a momentary lapse of seriousness. :(

right-track 08-27-2007 05:16 PM

Oh look...a triple post. :bonkhead:

right-track 08-27-2007 05:16 PM

*feels better*

The Dave 08-27-2007 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by right-track (Post 391327)
wtf am I talking about!

I was wondering that myself.

Son of JayJamJah 08-27-2007 07:22 PM

I understood it right track

God is a concept by which we measure our pain

boo boo 08-28-2007 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gentleman Johnny (Post 391322)
o rly?



that doesn't even make any sense at all.

I meant on weither or not god exists.

For the record, I don't believe Evolution (which you'd have to be very stupid to try to disprove) disproves the existence of god.

DearJenny 08-28-2007 02:17 AM

^Dinosaurs are described in the bible. But its minor, open to interpretation, and commonly overlooked when the topic of creation vs evolution comes up.

boo boo 08-28-2007 02:28 AM

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/128/4...4b1b06b1b8.jpg

Son of JayJamJah 08-28-2007 04:25 PM

I hope that no one who has read the bible believes it or follows it

i get high sometimes 08-28-2007 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 391472)
I meant on weither or not god exists.

For the record, I don't believe Evolution (which you'd have to be very stupid to try to disprove) disproves the existence of god.

Nothing disproves the existance of God! What don't people understand about that very simple concept?

Substitute the word 'God' for 'unicorn' and it would still be true. What evolution does is remove the neccessity to invoke God an an answer to life's complexity.

MHDTV 08-28-2007 07:00 PM

Not really.

i get high sometimes 08-28-2007 07:03 PM

Yes, really. You are 12, what? Have you taken not taken 'life science' yet, or whatever kiddie science class they give you guys in 3rd grade?

anticipation 08-29-2007 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by i get high sometimes (Post 391630)
Nothing disproves the existance of God! What don't people understand about that very simple concept?

Substitute the word 'God' for 'unicorn' and it would still be true. What evolution does is remove the neccessity to invoke God an an answer to life's complexity.

absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.




creationists <3 circular logic.
get over it.

MHDTV 08-29-2007 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by i get high sometimes (Post 391711)
Yes, really. You are 12, what? Have you taken not taken 'life science' yet, or whatever kiddie science class they give you guys in 3rd grade?

Actually I started 7th grade today. Do you know what causes evolution? Theoretically anyway.

i get high sometimes 08-29-2007 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gentleman Johnny (Post 392045)
absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.




creationists <3 circular logic.
get over it.


Are you calling me a creationist? Or are you saying that I am using 'absence of evidence as evidence of absense' or what?
Your post is very unclear.

To MHDTV, I know what causes evolution. I don't really believe you have a firm understanding of what does though.

DontRunMeOver 08-30-2007 04:30 AM

Yay for religious debates.

One of my friends described Christianity as "A very long wait for a train the doesn't come". Discuss.

DontRunMeOver 08-30-2007 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHDTV (Post 392056)
Actually I started 7th grade today. Do you know what causes evolution? Theoretically anyway.

Mutations of DNA, followed by continuation of the strain if the organism survives and reproduces and spread of the new mutation if it gives the organism a survival benefit.

Evolution = Continuation of beneficial mutations.

Modern knowledge of evolution is not to be confused with Darwinism, which is like confusing modern quantum physics with Newton's work. Newton and Darwin were both geniuses (Newton much more so) but there were still a LOT of flaws in their work - they were only individual people after all and access to scientific literature, computers and other electronic research aids was a bit thin on the ground, so they had to make do with levers, pulleys and drawing pictures of finches. Which is kind of limiting.

MHDTV 08-30-2007 08:56 AM

Exactly, and I'm certainly not saying I believe this, but many would say that that is proof of intelligent design. Once again, I don't believe that but I'm just making the point that that isn't proof that God doesn't exist, as you implyed.

Son of JayJamJah 08-30-2007 09:40 AM

If a Tree Falls in the forest and no one is there to see it, does it make a sound or does it evolve into a log?

Son of JayJamJah 08-30-2007 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DontRunMeOver (Post 392210)
Yay for religious debates.

One of my friends described Christianity as "A very long wait for a train the doesn't come". Discuss.

Lennon said God is a concept by which we measure our pain (then he said it again)

I have always felt fairly certain that less then 1 tenth of 1% of religious folk actually "believe" it. They like the idea, and if allowed to make their own revisions and interpretations to religious doctrines and texts can find a Church whose principals and morality they share and that gives them comfort not only in their lives but in death.

Imagine the overwhelming confusion and fear humans must have felt when they realized their own mortality. That everyone dies. Obviously this would blow your effing mind, so since the dawn of time, Man has created various religions either by the passing down of stories, the continuation of traditions or whatever manner.

No as time has gone on and our understanding of the world around has grown thanks to Science and Philosophy (and most of all experience) we have ironically evolved our religions to be more aprapo of the times. Of course no right minded person believes the bible as a historical text, far too many of it's stories have been disproved by archeology. But this does not make faith crumble, or even flinch. You see the absence of reason to believe is not comforting at all to most. We still need answers or at least feel like we do. Science in time will bring us closer and closer to understanding where we truly came from.

But we are still humans are our natural instincts to carry on traditions and find solace in the lose of friends are still as strong as they were in the days of the Flintstones. So a lot of people choose to follow. Most of them live good lives in the name of the Lord, though all are hell-bound hypocrites if their beliefs are taken literally, this is the evolution of religion which fun-house mirrors the evolution of Science and logic.

In addition it is human instinct, in times of great personal despair, trepidation and loss to search for solace, and the unknown offers very little. This is why more then 1/3 of those who describe themselves as "deeply religious" in prison became so once they got there. Or why, while not entirely true, we have the phrase "there are no atheists in foxholes" Undoubtedly when there are no more answers to be found for suffering it is easy to just have "faith".

What do people do when there team is down in the fourth quarter or bottom of the ninth? What about when a family member is bed-ridden or ill? They have faith, and don't feel the need to complicate it with possible explanations from doctors or experts, they want to know the truth, and if the truth is unknown, they almost exclusively choose faith in the best outcome. Faith is what's left when nothing else is going your way. Personal Faith is often equal to personal pain and a in many cases a welcome antidote. A sort of philosophical Oxycontin if you will.

So maybe John Lennon was right, God is a concept or if not certainly is a measuring stick for and of human pain.

DontRunMeOver 08-30-2007 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHDTV (Post 392236)
Exactly, and I'm certainly not saying I believe this, but many would say that that is proof of intelligent design. Once again, I don't believe that but I'm just making the point that that isn't proof that God doesn't exist, as you implyed.

It's a good thing you're not saying you believe it's proof of intelligent design because I can't see how it would be. Evolution isn't really proof of anything much. All the current scientific knowledge tells us is that mutatation and the following 'natural selection' is one process that happens. There are lots of other possible processes which could happen, from the extremes of randomness to intelligent design and everything in between, and it could have been any combination of these unknowns which brought things to where they are today.

I think that evolution theories are currently focussed on the effects of DNA mutation because Crick and Watson happened to crack the structure of DNA in the 1950's (I think) so it's given scientists a better grip on that piece of the puzzle than they might have on other aspects of evolution theory. As with many things in science, until you have the 'paradigm shift' necessary to jump to another level of research then comparitively little progress gets made and I'm pretty sure that were a good few paradigm shifts away from even understanding evolution to a decent extent let alone having any explanation for the history of evolution beyond invoking some god/gods that people made up rather than admit they didn't know why anything was happening.

Quote:

This is why more then 1/3 of those who describe themselves as "deeply religious" in prison became so once they got there.
Also because they realise it'll win them brownie points with the prison authorities and being 're-born' helps them in trying to distance themselves from whatever crime they committed (almost like a metaphysical cry of "It wasn't me!")

i get high sometimes 08-30-2007 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MHDTV (Post 392236)
Exactly, and I'm certainly not saying I believe this, but many would say that that is proof of intelligent design. Once again, I don't believe that but I'm just making the point that that isn't proof that God doesn't exist, as you implyed.


Are you that thick? I didn't imply anything. I specifically stated that NOTHING disproves the existance of God. Clearly stating that nothing disproves the existance of God is the complete opposite of 'implying' that evolution disproves the existance of God. Opposite in every possible way.

Frances 08-30-2007 07:28 PM

Intelligent design? That's the Eiffel Tower.

Voice_of_the_Soul12,13,01 08-30-2007 09:38 PM

OH MY GOD! Don't we already have a thread for religious debate that erupted from the subject of jacking off? DO YOU SEE HOW MESSED UP THAT QUESTION WAS?!


I'm saying one thing now, and this is kind of in reference to right-track's supposed drunken post, and what I believe; God gives nothing to humanity because we have to work for it. If he has to give us something, we certainly don't need the gift of life to obtain it. In other words, he's give us life; the challenges, the victories, the defeats, good days and bad days, and that is more than enough. Some people are just ungrateful.

i get high sometimes 08-30-2007 09:49 PM

Your mother and father gave you that life. Not the magic man in the sky. Or the stork for that matter.


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