Free Will? (house, quote, Computer)

sleepy jack · 02-04-2007, 06:14 PM

Who says we shouldn't?

jibber · 02-04-2007, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

Who says we can't?

no one has said we can't, the point is that as of yet, we have been unable to figure out HOW, mainly because there's much more at play in the human brain than set reactions to the various synapses going on. The fact thatw e have yet to program computers to think as humans do in my mind is concrete proof that the human mind is capable of free will, because it acts on different levels than simply acting upon pre-calculated reactions to past events.

jibber · 02-04-2007, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimintheundertow

So now that the idiot is gone I can finally make this thread.

The question is do you believe free will really exists? Why or Why Not?

No name calling bullshit. Please?

I say no. The two things determine everything about you are completely out of your control. DNA and environment. I believe in nurture over nature but dna does have a very important role in developing. If anything dna is a set of potential of how smart or strong you can be when placed in the best conditions. Everything you do is based on everything that has happened to you. I think that every reaction is a complex is system that if could possibly be recreated would happen in the same everytime. Society already believes both are influencers but why can't they be determiners?

I'm going to post a reply to your original argument, because I have yet to do so. I agree that DNA is completely out of our control, but environment, no, it's not. One, we have the ability to change and modify our environment; there's free will popping its head up. Two, we have a choice on how we chose to react to our environment; once again, free will rearing its little head.

Kevorkian Logic · 02-04-2007, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

Who says we can't?

Because all we can do is get them to manipulate information, not understand it. And the understanding is what makes the consciousness unique from all the other particle collisions going on.

jibber · 02-04-2007, 06:29 PM

another point, swimintheundertow made an agrument about how all of our choices are determined by past experiences and how we have reacted to situations in the past.

Consider a recovering drug addict. Under your logic, breaking an addiction would be an impossible feat, considering all an addiction is is repeating actions based on past behavior and previous reactions. How, under your logic, would it be possible for a drug addict to recognize that their actions are not working, and go through the VERY difficult steps in order to break their behavioral cycle?

Kevorkian Logic · 02-04-2007, 07:13 PM

an intervention.

jibber · 02-04-2007, 08:09 PM

^which don't work unless the addict chooses to go along with it. You cannot legally force someone into drug rehab, they can leave the program at any time they wish.

Kevorkian Logic · 02-04-2007, 08:37 PM

You've been watching too much pop culture with Lindsey Lohan, you're not allowed to check yourself out, if you are declared at harm to yourself or others, its pretty ****ing hard to get out.

jibber · 02-04-2007, 08:41 PM

^it's drug rehab, not an institution. Most drug addicts are able to leave the program when they want to, I've had family members go through this process, so I'm talking from experience, not from watching Entertainment Tonight. If you're an adult, it's a violation of your rights to commit you to a rehabilitation program against your will. You're going off on a tangent and confusing a phyciatric institution with rehab.

Kevorkian Logic · 02-04-2007, 09:04 PM

Yea, I've have family members continuously cycling through both, so I am likely getting the rules for each one mixed up.

the law can give you the choice between jail and rehab though, if you get caught doing or selling or buying drugs.

But what do interventions have to do with free-will? Honestly, though, this conversation is a repetition of an earlier conversation, with different situations.

02-04-2007, 06:29 PM	#95 (permalink)
jibber Freeskier Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Istanbul was Constantinople now it's Istanbul not Constantinople... Posts: 1,536	another point, swimintheundertow made an agrument about how all of our choices are determined by past experiences and how we have reacted to situations in the past. Consider a recovering drug addict. Under your logic, breaking an addiction would be an impossible feat, considering all an addiction is is repeating actions based on past behavior and previous reactions. How, under your logic, would it be possible for a drug addict to recognize that their actions are not working, and go through the VERY difficult steps in order to break their behavioral cycle? __________________ What you've done becomes the judge of what you're going to do -- especially in other people's minds. When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then. People don't have your past to hold against you. No yesterdays on the road. William Least Heat Moon, Blue Highways Your toughest competitor lives in your head. Some days his name is fear, or pain, or gravity. Stomp his ass. HOOKED ON THE WHITE POWDER

02-04-2007, 07:13 PM	#96 (permalink)
Kevorkian Logic Imperfectly Perfect Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 1,290	an intervention. __________________ "it is only through a limitless accumulation of the imperfect that a certain type of perfection can be attained"

02-04-2007, 08:09 PM	#97 (permalink)
jibber Freeskier Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Istanbul was Constantinople now it's Istanbul not Constantinople... Posts: 1,536	^which don't work unless the addict chooses to go along with it. You cannot legally force someone into drug rehab, they can leave the program at any time they wish. __________________ What you've done becomes the judge of what you're going to do -- especially in other people's minds. When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then. People don't have your past to hold against you. No yesterdays on the road. William Least Heat Moon, Blue Highways Your toughest competitor lives in your head. Some days his name is fear, or pain, or gravity. Stomp his ass. HOOKED ON THE WHITE POWDER

02-04-2007, 08:37 PM	#98 (permalink)
Kevorkian Logic Imperfectly Perfect Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 1,290	You've been watching too much pop culture with Lindsey Lohan, you're not allowed to check yourself out, if you are declared at harm to yourself or others, its pretty ****ing hard to get out. __________________ "it is only through a limitless accumulation of the imperfect that a certain type of perfection can be attained"

02-04-2007, 08:41 PM	#99 (permalink)
jibber Freeskier Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Istanbul was Constantinople now it's Istanbul not Constantinople... Posts: 1,536	^it's drug rehab, not an institution. Most drug addicts are able to leave the program when they want to, I've had family members go through this process, so I'm talking from experience, not from watching Entertainment Tonight. If you're an adult, it's a violation of your rights to commit you to a rehabilitation program against your will. You're going off on a tangent and confusing a phyciatric institution with rehab. __________________ What you've done becomes the judge of what you're going to do -- especially in other people's minds. When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then. People don't have your past to hold against you. No yesterdays on the road. William Least Heat Moon, Blue Highways Your toughest competitor lives in your head. Some days his name is fear, or pain, or gravity. Stomp his ass. HOOKED ON THE WHITE POWDER

02-04-2007, 09:04 PM	#100 (permalink)
Kevorkian Logic Imperfectly Perfect Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 1,290	Yea, I've have family members continuously cycling through both, so I am likely getting the rules for each one mixed up. the law can give you the choice between jail and rehab though, if you get caught doing or selling or buying drugs. But what do interventions have to do with free-will? Honestly, though, this conversation is a repetition of an earlier conversation, with different situations. __________________ "it is only through a limitless accumulation of the imperfect that a certain type of perfection can be attained"