The Official Religious/Political Debate Thread (quote, history, Viola, Hang)

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by jibber

^ wow ripped that post apart.

OK well we start of semi-positive with your post right here.

Originally Posted by jibber

once again I'm getting tired of debating this topic.

Yeah then we start to slip away from positiveness, but your point is agreeable though, this is getting tiresome.

Originally Posted by jibber

After a while, we just have to realize that this debate will never come to any conclusion, and it gets to a point where I feel as if I'm debating with a brick wall.

Yes, this is true, but you're still slipping further into negative territory.

Originally Posted by jibber

So I'm off to go write angry letters to the government blaming them for the shortcomings of my peers when it's clearly their fault.

Ah. Yeah now you've slipped so far that you're pratically making insults.

Originally Posted by jibber

After that I plan to hold a rally against the war, where i'll pull facts out of my @ss and argue solely based on my own personal prejudices against Bush.

And there's the big one. It's very good, but it doesn't really apply to me or anyone else. Not yet anyway.

I do still beleive that your post was purely based on what you think the thread will become. But dude you have to be careful with these things. I might've taken that personally.

[jibber]

woa, ok my post was directed at alejo, and I was saying you did a good job on your post. the last part was me being sarcastic, playing off of the persona that the conservatives on this site have most likely assigned to me. no insults intended, just trying to illustrate that it's getting pointless debating with people whp have an already conceived opinion of me which prevents them from considering my points.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by jibber

woa, ok my post was directed at alejo, and I was saying you did a good job on your post. the last part was me being sarcastic, playing off of the persona that the conservatives on this site have most likely assigned to me. no insults intended, just trying to illustrate that it's getting pointless debating with people whp have an already conceived opinion of me which prevents them from considering my points.

OK it's cool, that's what I thought.

Loved the "pulling facts out of my @ss" bit, LOL.

[IamAlejo]

Quote to death...Okay, I'm gonna Laugh at your ignorance to death again.

Ah yes, you're still in high school, and you're not old enough to drink yet, not old enough to pay taxes, and not old enough to vote. Lets hold on to those facts shall we?

Ever heard of a job? You seem to say your family is not well off (the homeless shelter) yet you don't have a job yet. I got a job when I was 16. Now I am a Senior. 18 years of age turning 19 in September. How old do you have to be to vote? 18. How old to pay taxes? 16 (or whenever you get a job). Where does drinking come in? And I am old enough to drink, just not legally.

I seriously doubt that.

Wake up from your sheltered world of your computer. Some of us get out and do things. I have worked at CHKD and volunteered at schools around my area (portsmouth, newport news, etc) as part of a senior project we had to do. You don't know me, don't pretend you know what I do.

Did you know that there have been fraud investigations on companies that advertise statistics? This is because over 50% of all statistics and percentages are made up on the spot, because they have a psychological effect that door to door salesment have been using to win people over for years and years.

So you have proof that this isn't true. Or you are just going with the "it might be a lie" factor. Good proof again dip****.

America was founded because our ancestors were greedy, money hungry, arrogant snobs. They'd taken the land by force, and now they wanted to call it their own. Doesn't look like much has changed after all these years.

America was founded by immigrants wanting freedom from persecution primarily on religion. They came to the US, started getting taxed to death after the French and Indian War (thats a war between England and the French primarily, figured I'd tell you since you don't seem to have your US history down). The immigrants didn't think it was their right to have the majority of taxes put on them so they revolted against the government. Other countries helped US out, and US won. To call them arrogant snobs shows that you have no education. Are you trying to act like such an idiot to prove your point we need more educational funding?

Because if they can't even move to an area where their kids can get a public education, then they are hardly in a position to take out a loan.

What areas aren't covered by public schools? Everywhere, even Alaska. And nobody cares about Alaska.

No, I'll tell you what "people want". People want to keep a roof over their head, they want to feed themselves and their children, they want their family to live in a healthy environment, they want to be able to LIVE a life that is more than just scraping a living so that they can support themselves.

Why don't they get a job, two jobs, or even three. There are always ways to make money, but they aren't going to walk up to your door and ask you to take them. People, even without high school education, are making millions in the United States. Once again, it's all about drive. Some people have it, others don't.

Yes. Poor people can only pay so much in taxes, then there is a breaking point where they will only get poorer and poorer. Taxes do not need to be increased to fund research projects, America just needs to stop pillaging middle-eastern countries.

Funny. You say poor people don't pay much taxes, yet a majority of tax money goes to poor people instead of the rich. Our government acts like Robin Hood in a way. Pillaging middle eastern countries? Yeah, we are already up to two. What a great pillage. Ever thought George Bush thought of these countries as a threat? And was Bush the one that voted to go to war? No, I think it was Senate and the House of Reps. That's right. If you have ever taken history (which I doubt you have) you would know that the President can only move troops for 60 days. Before then the Senate must vote to go to war, which they did. Hmmmmm.....

No it allows mothers to stay at home and raise their children.

If you aren't in good financial state, why wouldn't you want to go out and get a job? You would want to have money to be able to have the best resources for your kid. O wait, maybe you are just a lazy piece of ****.

Then you probably don't get out much, or don't talk to many adults. People complain about governors all the time. Complaining about presidential administrations is not the be all and end all.

I don't get out much, yet you complain about no one ever being on these boards? Right....I am talking about putting all the blame of the war on Bush. All the blame of the economy on Bush. It takes about 3-4 years to have your effect on our economy. If you knew how the economy worked, you would understand that a tax cut will not help and economy right away. Things take time.

LOL I love this statement. "Get a babysitter if you must." LOL, well what the **** else will you do eh? Just leave the kid at home to fend for itself?

Some people have grandparents (the parents of your parents to put it on your intellgience scale). The grandparents can look after the kid, therefore no need for a babysitter. Vualah.

You either pay taxes or you don't. I hope that when the day comes, I won't be so poor that my tax is in minus figures.

This one made no sense. Some people don't pay much in taxes. My first job I had to pay taxes when I first started getting the job. My revenue tax (the tax I pay based on what I get paid) was around 40 or so dollars since I had been working for about 2-3 weeks. That's what I call "not much"

Oh yeah, you're guessing that are you? It doesn't even make sense! "the total is combined to normal military spending". No it's not dumbass, the total IS the normal military spending. The clue is in the name "Cost of war" dip****.

Hey idiot. I'll spell this out for you. American government spends (im gonna make a figure for us to have fun) 10 billion dollars a year on bombs. Now that we are using those bombs, it is probably adding that "10 billion" WHICH WE WOULD HAVE SPENT ANYWAY as a cost of war. Get it yet? Probably not, I'll add something new. The US would spend (guesstimate again) 1 billion on gas and rations men on ship. Because the ships are now in the Middle east (instead of routine voyages to mediterranean etc) they are probably adding the cost of the gas and rations onto a cost of the war. This makes the number decieving. I hope I brought that down to your level.

You have a very prejudiced opinion on this, probably based on your experiences with just one or two people.

Or maybe because I lived in Richmond for the first 12 years of my life? But I probably only saw about two people during that span.

May I remind you that YOU are also not old enough to vote, since you are still in HIGH SCHOOL.

Man, you really seem to be caught on the fact I can't vote. O wait, I can. Hmmm again....

but I gaurantee you that nobody in their right minds votes because they "know a lot about someone".

And then you wonder how a President that you consider so "horrible" like Pres. Bush gets into office. Maybe more people should do some research.

No you can't. Don't lie. You don't have the brain capacity to "understand".

Wait, aren't you the idiot that thinks high schoolers can't vote?

Ripped my post apart? Doubtful, especially when he makes himself seem like an idiot because his main argument is "you can't even vote stupid" when i can.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Quote to death...Okay, I'm gonna Laugh at your ignorance to death again.

From a preliminary look at your entire thread, I'd say you are the one who posesses the real ignorance around here.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Ever heard of a job? You seem to say your family is not well off (the homeless shelter) yet you don't have a job yet.

Oh my GOD. You actually do work for the US military intelligence don't you? OK number one: I'm an ORPHAN, that means I don't have a family. Number two: I do not live in a homeless shelter, I live with adopted parents. Number three: I never said I didn't have a job - you made that assumption, and that's YOUR mistake.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I got a job when I was 16. Now I am a Senior. 18 years of age turning 19 in September.

OK, and? Not everyone has the time ability to do that.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

How old do you have to be to vote? 18.

Yes. (convenient that you're 18 isn't it, shame you're not using your vote with the kind of intelligence that it deserves)

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

How old to pay taxes? 16

No.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

(or whenever you get a job).

Yes.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Where does drinking come in? And I am old enough to drink, just not legally.

Oh you complete moron. The phrase "old enough to drink" generally emplies that you are old enough to drink legally.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Wake up from your sheltered world of your computer. Some of us get out and do things.

Again you make assumptions. I do get out and do things thankyou, the fact that you think you know me proves how arrogant you really are.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I have worked at CHKD and volunteered at schools around my area (portsmouth, newport news, etc) as part of a senior project we had to do.

Well you obviously did not really open your eyes to all of the problems in those areas. You seem to be tunnel visioned on this whole matter, that people who don't get an education are just damned lazy. There are a whole load of other reasons why, it's just that you either refuse to accept them, or are to ignorant and dumb to notice them.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

You don't know me, don't pretend you know what I do.

LOL. Yet you think you know me well enough to make the assumption that I don't have a job, don't get out and do much, and have a family/parents?

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

So you have proof that this isn't true. Or you are just going with the "it might be a lie" factor. Good proof again dip****.

It was sarcasm. I was basically telling you that I don't believe your statistics, because statistics are usually just bull****.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

America was founded by immigrants wanting freedom from persecution primarily on religion. They came to the US, started getting taxed to death after the French and Indian War (thats a war between England and the French primarily, figured I'd tell you since you don't seem to have your US history down). The immigrants didn't think it was their right to have the majority of taxes put on them so they revolted against the government. Other countries helped US out, and US won.

Yes blah blah blah, that's lovely. At the end of the day, it's still a bunch of immigrants coming over to america then eventually calling it theirs. What difference does it make if you put some heroic crap in between?

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

To call them arrogant snobs shows that you have no education.

It shows nothing. If anything it shows that I am no weak minded enough to justify some bitch@ss immigrants taking over control of a country with a load of heroic patriotic bull.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Are you trying to act like such an idiot to prove your point we need more educational funding?

You're already doing that for me.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

What areas aren't covered by public schools? Everywhere, even Alaska. And nobody cares about Alaska.

Again you're not taking into account all the facts. Some schools are understaffed, underfunded, crime ridden, have drug problems, suffer violence, are full, or just plain dangerous (structurally).

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Why don't they get a job, two jobs, or even three.

Probably because they need at least 8 hours of sleep per day to avoid going insane.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

There are always ways to make money, but they aren't going to walk up to your door and ask you to take them. People, even without high school education, are making millions in the United States. Once again, it's all about drive. Some people have it, others don't.

Yes, there are one or two people in the united states who are making millions but don't even have a highschool education. These people have been homeschooled.

There is only one person I know of, who was classified as an idiot due to his dyslexia, but turned out to be a stock market genius, and is now the worlds richest teenager - and he doesn't even live in the states.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Funny. You say poor people don't pay much taxes, yet a majority of tax money goes to poor people instead of the rich.

Actually the majority of tax goes to running the country.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Our government acts like Robin Hood in a way. Pillaging middle eastern countries? Yeah, we are already up to two. What a great pillage. Ever thought George Bush thought of these countries as a threat? And was Bush the one that voted to go to war? No, I think it was Senate and the House of Reps. That's right.

Don't act like Bush is some kind of innocent party. Bush manipulated his entire administration to make the war happen, and they all followed along like sheep. It was only when they got to the UN that they encountered resistance, and when they got that, they decided to pretend that they were "above UN durisdiction anyway".

I mean, if they really thought that they didn't need to "seek a permission slip" or "ask for help" then they wouldn't bother with the UN anyway. So they really don't have anyone fooled on that one.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

If you have ever taken history (which I doubt you have) you would know that the President can only move troops for 60 days. Before then the Senate must vote to go to war, which they did. Hmmmmm.....

Again you're making more unfounded assumptions about me. These are stacking up you know.

In case you didn't notice before, I'll repeat again here. The president decides to go to war, and his entire administration makes it happen - on his own the president doesn't have much power, lucky for him his entire administration are basically his lapdogs.

[Sharky]

(this post follows on from the previous one because it was too long)

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

If you aren't in good financial state, why wouldn't you want to go out and get a job?

So you can look after your children.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

You would want to have money to be able to have the best resources for your kid.

That's why the husband would go out to work.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

O wait, maybe you are just a lazy piece of ****.

Clearly you don't know how much hard work looking after children can be then.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I don't get out much, yet you complain about no one ever being on these boards? Right....I am talking about putting all the blame of the war on Bush.

I didn't complain about anything. I brought it up as being a possible issue, hoping for some suggestions on what we can do about it. So don't try to use my own good constructive nature against me for your destructive primitive purposes.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

All the blame of the economy on Bush. It takes about 3-4 years to have your effect on our economy. If you knew how the economy worked, you would understand that a tax cut will not help and economy right away. Things take time.

I'm not talking about tax, I'm talking about the 100 billion dollar cost of war that has basically taken the economy by the balls, and mauled it like a rabid dog.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Some people have grandparents (the parents of your parents to put it on your intellgience scale).

Jesus christ, how many times do I have to tell you that I do not have parents.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

The grandparents can look after the kid, therefore no need for a babysitter. Vualah.

It's spelt voila.

And what if the grandparents are dead or too old?

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

This one made no sense. Some people don't pay much in taxes. My first job I had to pay taxes when I first started getting the job. My revenue tax (the tax I pay based on what I get paid) was around 40 or so dollars since I had been working for about 2-3 weeks. That's what I call "not much"

What's your point?

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Hey idiot. I'll spell this out for you. American government spends (im gonna make a figure for us to have fun) 10 billion dollars a year on bombs.

No they don't. You made that figure up. You even admitted it.

And no, the American military manufactures bombs especially for the war and the rest are often just kept in storage. The cost of the war is based on spending during the war period. It is not based on how much every single particle of military equipment used has cost us - if it was it would run into the trillions most probably.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Now that we are using those bombs, it is probably adding that "10 billion" WHICH WE WOULD HAVE SPENT ANYWAY as a cost of war. Get it yet?

Wrong. The US army do not continually manufacture ammunition, bombs, or missiles. They only do that during times of war - and anything left over gets put into storage dumps. Some of this equipment gets used during training and practice, but most of it remains to be used in future conflict.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Probably not, I'll add something new.

I got exactly what you mean't. Please do not assume what my ability to understand is.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

The US would spend (guesstimate again) 1 billion on gas and rations men on ship.

Stop making these bull**** estimates and use the internet to find the real facts, before you go opening your big, uneducated mouth.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Because the ships are now in the Middle east (instead of routine voyages to mediterranean etc) they are probably adding the cost of the gas and rations onto a cost of the war. This makes the number decieving. I hope I brought that down to your level.

"your level." oh jesus christ grow up please.

I've already told you, the cost of the war does NOT add the cost of annual military spending, and does NOT add the cost of all the resources taken from supply dumps.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Or maybe because I lived in Richmond for the first 12 years of my life? But I probably only saw about two people during that span.

You said you lived outside of Richmond, not in it. If you're going to lie make sure you keep it consistant.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Man, you really seem to be caught on the fact I can't vote. O wait, I can. Hmmm again....

High schools' finishing year is at age 18, unless your birthday is after the graduation. In which case you'll finish at age 17.

But I find it convenient that you are 18, even though you don't act like it. Because you being exactly 18 would make you just old enough to prove me wrong on one tiny insignificant point.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

And then you wonder how a President that you consider so "horrible" like Pres. Bush gets into office. Maybe more people should do some research.

What research is there to do? He went to war on a lie, and cost us such a huge amount of money, that if we didn't go to war, we could give every single person on earth 20 bucks.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Wait, aren't you the idiot that thinks high schoolers can't vote?

Most high schoolers can't vote until their last year, unless, like I said, their birthday is AFTER they graduate and finish highschool. In which case, they will not be able to vote for the duration of their stay in highschool.

So don't call me an idiot.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Ripped my post apart? Doubtful, especially when he makes himself seem like an idiot because his main argument is "you can't even vote stupid" when i can.

A: That was not my main argument.

B: I am not a him, I am a her.

C: You made yourself look like an idiot by getting my sex wrong, not noticing the 4 times I mentioned that I am an orphan, basically picking some random number out of your head and saying that it's "how much the government spends on bombs" or whatever, and practically telling me what my education was.

I have had enough with this arguement, and my responses to it end here. You are an ignorant person who doesn't even do his research, makes up facts and figures, talks a load of total crap about my intelligence, upbringing, familiy background, financial status, and education, and above all you think you are in a position to call ME ignorant.

Grow up.

[IamAlejo]

Number three: I never said I didn't have a job - you made that assumption, and that's YOUR mistake.

You don't have a job...Yet your post before says "when my day comes to pay taxes..."
If you have a job, you are paying taxes. Therefore, you are ignorant in what you saying. Assumption? No, going on wat you said.

B: I am not a him, I am a her.

Sorry, i based it on the picture you posted.

Most high schoolers can't vote until their last year, unless, like I said, their birthday is AFTER they graduate and finish highschool. In which case, they will not be able to vote for the duration of their stay in highschool.

So don't call me an idiot.

When you tried to make me look like an idiot by saying "remember, you are in high school, you can't vote" I need to do research. Now you go back on your word, "most can't". Well I guess I'm not most. It's okay though, you know you are wrong, I won't bust you on it too much.

What research is there to do? He went to war on a lie, and cost us such a huge amount of money, that if we didn't go to war, we could give every single person on earth 20 bucks.

What lie? We found the testing facilities, we found human testing facilities, we found missiles that were illegal for Iraq to have under UN guidelines. A lie? No, a promise.

Jesus christ, how many times do I have to tell you that I do not have parents.

I have friends with no parents, but live with grandparents. Jesus. And if they are dead, you can get a babysitter. And if you can't afford to have a baby and stay at home, or you can't afford to get a babysitter, than you have no business having a child.

That's why the husband would go out to work.

Why's it the husband's job to go to work? Don't even get started on that one.

I'm not talking about tax, I'm talking about the 100 billion dollar cost of war that has basically taken the economy by the balls, and mauled it like a rabid dog.

That's why Dow Jones reached 10K+ for the first time in 3 years this year? Do YOUR research. The war has actually had a positive effect on the economy. As most wars usually do.

Number two: I do not live in a homeless shelter,

Then read this from earlier posts.

The majority of the homeless shelters are run, payed for, and owned by completely independant charity organisations. I've LIVED IN ONE before, and anyone else who has ever had to use one will tell you that there isn't enough government funding going into these charities.

I never said you still live there, but you did. I made my comment. So who is changing their statements?

You said you lived outside of Richmond, not in it. If you're going to lie make sure you keep it consistant.

Don't lie. Okay, once again, your level. I lived in Richmond for 12 years. I'm 18. When I was 12, we moved to Virginia Beach, about 2 hours from Richmond. Therefore, now I live outside of Richmond. You are an idiot.

I've already told you, the cost of the war does NOT add the cost of annual military spending, and does NOT add the cost of all the resources taken from supply dumps.

Where do you get that from? Or are you just making up numbers too? I made up those numbers to show you a point, if you would really care about the numbers that bad I'll try to take time out of my day to prove some "13" (guesstimate again) year old wrong.

Wrong. The US army do not continually manufacture ammunition, bombs, or missiles. They only do that during times of war - and anything left over gets put into storage dumps. Some of this equipment gets used during training and practice, but most of it remains to be used in future conflict.

Me wrong? No, YOU WRONG. I live on a military base. They are constantly making new types of missiles, machinery, helicopters, airplanes, etc. They don't just plan on having a war and then start building a month before it happens.

Actually the majority of tax goes to running the country.

Yes, making government programs which help mostly the bottom part of society.

Yes blah blah blah, that's lovely. At the end of the day, it's still a bunch of immigrants coming over to america then eventually calling it theirs. What difference does it make if you put some heroic crap in between?

How do you think other countries were founded? Nomads going into an area, calling it their land, then protecting it. It's not like we started a trend here. All of Africa did the same thing, you are such an idiot.

It shows nothing. If anything it shows that I am no weak minded enough to justify some bitch@ss immigrants taking over control of a country with a load of heroic patriotic bull.

In which everyone born would be a bitch@ss immigrant.

Probably because they need at least 8 hours of sleep per day to avoid going insane.

If you can't afford to have a child, why have one? Parents being irresponsible.

Don't act like Bush is some kind of innocent party. Bush manipulated his entire administration to make the war happen, and they all followed along like sheep.

Sure, It's all Bush's fault. Good opinion, he made somebody else vote. He wrote it on the ballots. No, they listened to Bush and agreed with his point of view.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Sorry, i based it on the picture you posted.

I find that highly offensive. Are you suggesting that I look like a male?

I suggest that you look again.

[Kill For Satan]

Originally Posted by Sharky

I find that highly offensive. Are you suggesting that I look like a male?

I suggest that you look again.

You look like a man to me. You also act like one. You're also not a lady either, you are ****, too.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by Kill For Satan

You look like a man to me. You also act like one. You're also not a lady either, you are ****, too.

If I didn't know you were trying to piss me off, I'd be offended. But since I do know this: