Prove Jesus Christ exists, judge orders priest (quote)

right-track · 01-07-2006, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

theory
n.
a working hypothesis that is considered probable based on experimental evidence or factual or conceptual analysis and is accepted as a basis for experimentation

By that definition neither God nor Christianity are a "theory," as they are in no way based on Scientific evidence or experimentation.

As for the "if not for God, where did the Universe come from?" bit, many people seem to think that putting God into the equation seems to solve the whole Universal mystery, but where did God come from? Has he always been here? Did he just pop into existence? I guess whatever your answer to that question could be the same answer to "where did the Universe come from?" Either way, we're just guessing because it's one of those things that's impossible to know.

And I'm not really talking about the Big Bang theory here, because that explains how the Universe formed, but not where it came from... why there was a tiny point of infinitely dense mass that just decided to explode... that bit.

All true...well said.

Barnard17 · 01-07-2006, 04:46 PM

I've always loved that. Science seeks to explain something, we don't know where the matter in the big bang came from so Christians reject it. But it's perfectly acceptable to believe that a God existed from nowhere with no explanation needed.

right-track · 01-07-2006, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fal

I've always loved that. Science seeks to explain something, we don't know where the matter in the big bang came from so Christians reject it. But it's perfectly acceptable to believe that a God existed from nowhere with no explanation needed.

Just to balance things out, or an attempt to any way, the most rational Scientists, even those who refuse to believe in God, admit to a lack of completeness in our understanding of the universe.

They will admit that neither God nor the Bible can be proved or disproved by science, just as many of their favourite theories ultimately cannot be proved or disproved.
Science is meant to be a truly neutral discipline, seeking only the truth, not proof of an agenda.
And God has always intended us to come to Him through faith, not through logic.

I have more faith in science than I have in religion.
Years ago it was the other way around...in years to come as I near my end, who knows what I will think then...

Barnard17 · 01-07-2006, 05:00 PM

Of course, Science relies upon the basis that nothin is ever a fact and only ever a theory and may alwasy be disproved. Religion is far too cut and stick for it to be a healthy way to live, in my opinion. Religion is non scientific, it requires a lack of logic - hence you can never disprove a Religion with science. That doesn't make the religion true though, which is a conclusion a shocking amount of people come too.

right-track · 01-07-2006, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fal

Of course, Science relies upon the basis that nothin is ever a fact and only ever a theory and may alwasy be disproved. Religion is far too cut and stick for it to be a healthy way to live, in my opinion. Religion is non scientific, it requires a lack of logic - hence you can never disprove a Religion with science. That doesn't make the religion true though, which is a conclusion a shocking amount of people come too.

Good point and I love looking at your user pic after you make a statement you firmly beleive in...as if to say ...so there!

riseagainstrocks · 01-08-2006, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fal

Of course, Science relies upon the basis that nothin is ever a fact and only ever a theory and may alwasy be disproved. Religion is far too cut and stick for it to be a healthy way to live, in my opinion. Religion is non scientific, it requires a lack of logic - hence you can never disprove a Religion with science. That doesn't make the religion true though, which is a conclusion a shocking amount of people come too.

And this is why I think most arguements take place. I truly believe that Science is amazing and explains alot of things that are very important. I believe that evolution and adaptation do happen and did happen (not to the same extent as Darwin and other Evolutionist, but the proof is undeniable. Plus, it makes sense).

Religion in itself is a terrible thing. Well, maybe not terrible, but it has turned into a terrible thing. Any belief structure in which one man places himself above other men as "more holy" or "closer to God" will ultimatly lead to a power trip in which innocents will get harmed (the Crusades being the most prominant example, closely followed by radical Muslim "freedom fighters" aka terrorist).

I believe that linking Science and Faith are A) impossible and B) unwise to attempt. I'm not saying that logic and faith aren't intermixable however.

Consider this if you will: Life is the only thing that begets life. True? Of course it is. It has been proven. There is no spontaneous genesis. So where did life come from? The "primordial soup"? Was there some random gathering of protiens that someone formed RNA which combined to form DNA which wrote itself the code in order to create a cell? To say that having God create life is not illogical. This is where faith ties in. To say that because Science hasn't found the answer yet means that God didn't do it is illogical.

I'm using this example to show you that Christians (well some at least) do pay attention in Biology and Physics class. I know, understand, and apply scientific theories to my faith.

and Fal, in that last bit you said that because Science cannot prove nor disprove religion (or to me more specific, the existance of God, the birth of Christ, the Resurrection, etc.) doesn't mean that Religion is true. On the flip side (and this uses your own arguement "against" you ) it doesn't say that it isn't true.

There are people who claim to believe in the same God I do, and who claim to follow his laws and live like he wants them too, and on the whole I find that to be true. There are however people who are lying through there teeth. It's sad and aggravating to me as a Christian that some crazy person can claim to the same truths I do and yet stray so far from them. I say that they are not like me and do not represent my faith.

Alot of people are making generalizations about Christians and what they believe. Some might be correct and others not. I ask that you talk to someone who claims to be a Christian and decide about them whether or not you agree. Don't apply it to the whole.

did any of that make sense?

Trauma · 01-08-2006, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riseagainstrocks

I believe that linking Science and Faith are A) impossible and B) unwise to attempt.

I don't think that.
However, I think it is unwise to label faiths and seperate peoples based on them.
Anyone can be a scientific believer in a God.

riseagainstrocks · 01-10-2006, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snickers

I don't think that.
However, I think it is unwise to label faiths and seperate peoples based on them.
Anyone can be a scientific believer in a God.

I'm one of them.

Quote:

riseagainstrocks
I'm using this example to show you that Christians (well some at least) do pay attention in Biology and Physics class. I know, understand, and apply scientific theories to my faith.

Barnard17 · 01-09-2006, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riseagainstrocks

and Fal, in that last bit you said that because Science cannot prove nor disprove religion (or to me more specific, the existance of God, the birth of Christ, the Resurrection, etc.) doesn't mean that Religion is true. On the flip side (and this uses your own arguement "against" you ) it doesn't say that it isn't true.

Very much so, but I'd rather put my faith in something that seeks the truth as opposed to something which states it.

sleepy jack · 01-07-2006, 05:36 PM

*sigh*

I believe god has always been, and i have faith in this.

01-07-2006, 04:46 PM	#2 (permalink)
Barnard17 My home? Discabled, Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bristol, UK Posts: 328	I've always loved that. Science seeks to explain something, we don't know where the matter in the big bang came from so Christians reject it. But it's perfectly acceptable to believe that a God existed from nowhere with no explanation needed. __________________ Vita brevis, Occasio praeceps

01-07-2006, 05:00 PM	#4 (permalink)
Barnard17 My home? Discabled, Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bristol, UK Posts: 328	Of course, Science relies upon the basis that nothin is ever a fact and only ever a theory and may alwasy be disproved. Religion is far too cut and stick for it to be a healthy way to live, in my opinion. Religion is non scientific, it requires a lack of logic - hence you can never disprove a Religion with science. That doesn't make the religion true though, which is a conclusion a shocking amount of people come too. __________________ Vita brevis, Occasio praeceps