Need a bit of advice, forming a band.
 

Hello all, new to this forum, hoping to get some advice. I'm just now starting to put together a band after I gigged with a drummer playing a few As I Lay Dying tunes at a local bar, and I was really impressed by his drumwork. He told me he's interested in putting something together, so after talking to a few friends, we have 2 guitarists, and I, being a 3rd guitarist, drew the short straw and got placed on bass duty.
The other guitarists and myself are into really heavier stuff, like Whitechapel, Lamb of God, etc, but the drummer likes a lot lighter things, like Underoath and The Devil Wears Prada. I'm trying to find a decent balance between the 2 genres so that no one gets hurt, but I really am not looking for any clean singing at all. If anyone could give any suggestions, that would be amazingly helpful. Name suggestions are appreciated too =)

Also, if anyone could possibly suggest a decent bass amp, the little practice one I have right now will not cut it. Has to be able to hold pretty low tunings as well.

Thanks in advance!

In terms of who is heavier, there really isn't much of a difference between these bands. I can't really see any difficulty in coming to a compromise. Why not branch out? There's no law that says you have to stick to the same style for every song you play.

I Like HDIGTHOMA (How did I get this hicky on my ass)

I strongly suggest you specifically spell out how you are going to decide things from the beginning.

Just my humble opinion, but I like bass way more than guitar. I guess depends on what you like.

this is excellent advice for a starting band. it eliminates drama further down the road. some people might say it makes one member seem like a pretentious dictator, but i always liked Dave Wyndorf's explanation on how he ran Monster Magnet - it's like a democratic dictatorship, the other guys are totally free to bring in their ideas, comment on the songs and the riffs, but ultimately, it's HIS band and he's got final say.

considering the way you (OP) describe the band as being yours and something 'you' started with another member. now is the time to establish your leadership, keep in mind you can't force others to do your will, but on the other hand there's no point for you to keep YOUR band going if it doesn't make you happy. there's nothing wrong with laying out a vision for a band in black and white, it makes it easier for the other members to know what the real intentions are. just make sure you afford them the freedom to pursue other interest independently of your band or they'll grow to resent you.

as for bass amps, i used a Warwick Sweet 15 for a few years with a fuzzed out 5 string fretless and the low B never got muddy so long as i paid a modicum of attention to the EQ knobs.

I don't like the idea of making a band a dictatorship.
I like everyone to have an opinion. I'd rather have drama and talk it out than the members feel they were being bossed around.
A band is supposed to be fun, and if some people like TDWP while others don't, and you can't compromise and play a little of both, then maybe you shouldn't be in a band together.
Drummers are really important, though, and usually hard to find- and if you get along with him, I'd suggest you do make a compromise.

I think that, in terms of leadership, you should pick whatever is best for your band for whatever song.

Make sure what you put down on the table is the best. That's what I try.

But I shouldn't be talking. My "band" is falling apart as we speak.

that's why i specified a democratic dictatorship. i don't see anything wrong with taking ownership of your vision. it only becomes an issue if you start trying to control your band members, you can have 'your' band 'your' way and still have input from all members. if some input strays too far from your vision then address it in the moment, afford them the freedom to pursue interests independently of your own but still welcome them back into your fold when they want to play your style.

my personal experience with the situation did ultimately fail, but not for lack of trying. i expressed my views on what i wanted to do with my music, my 3 friends all agreed and nodded along. then any time i'd start talking about some sort of public performance the issues that 2 claimed to not have would crop up again and again. i'd tell them flat out that there were 6 other nights in the week where they could follow other directions and play other styles. the only one who did that was the, technically speaking, 'bad' drummer. funny how he's the only one i'd consider playing music with now if we could only collaborate schedules and find a jam room.

the drama and underlying tensions of the situation soured two friendships and resulted in complete stagnation of our music. it would be super nice if everyone could just get everything going smoothly, but fact is, the world isn't fair and human life isn't infinite, so having a room of guys all biting their tongues because they'd rather say what they think the other guys want to hear rather than what's really going on is futile.

it's not to say the other way doesn't work, but i think it has to be established from the get go. if you've got a vision, lay it out in black and white for the other guys and let them make their choice to follow along. on the other hand if you want to make it a full on by the people, for the people collaborative effort express it that way as well and make sure everyone tosses their opinion to the mix.

ultimately, just like playing music, there's no right or wrong way to handle a band, but i do think that any musician getting involved in a band needs to take the time to do a little soul searching to figure out just what they think a band should be and what they want to get out of it. then it needs to be expressed openly and honestly with all other potential band members, and if everyone ends up on the same page from their own internal devices then hold on because you just started something seriously serious.

That was a long answer.
I know what you mean, I'm just not one for anything to do with a dictatorship in my band.
I gave respect to the people who were in the band before me, but when it came to something I wanted to take part in, I refused to let the choice be made for me.
I was the singer, so I needed a say in what songs we'd be doing due to my voice range and stuff.

sorry i was killing time before work hahaha

we're also describing very particular situations. in the examples i provided, with Monster Magnet, it is the singer/frontman who has final say; in my own band, there was no frontman so it wasn't a factor, i took ownership because i owned pretty much all the gear and organized the weekly jam.

there's a pretty huge difference in asking a guitar player to play a bluesy riff in A when they'd rather play a more metal riff in E as opposed to asking a baritone to sing like a tenor.

I lost you.

that's ok maybe the D word wasn't the most appropriate.

basically there's no right or wrong way to organize your band. regardless of what method you choose to run it i still think it needs to be communicated clearly to the other members as soon as possible. that's really all i've been trying to get at. if you have a plan for your band, let the others know what it is and be totally honest with yourself and your friends as to what that plan truly entails.

if you want to keep it totally open with full equal collaborations from everyone... GREAT! just make sure everyone else is on the same page and pitching ideas.

same as if you want to be the leader and have the final word yourself, let everyone know from the get go that it's your band.

the last bit i mentioned yesterday revolved more around the 2nd situation, where there is a clear leader in the group. asking a instrumentalist to do something different might not be the nicest thing ever, but it's not asking them to run counter to their physiology.

I know what you mean, there is no right or wrong way.
I don't know, I guess I have my own rules and conditions that I need.
I don't like drama in my band, so I'm really sexist in that aspect and don't want other girls in my band.
I don't want someone who's not open to all kinds of music.
I want someone who's willing to experiment.

When it's someone else's band, I like consulting with them for everything on my own, do you know what I mean? I don't like for them to tell me what I can and cannot do all of the time.
I quit my old band when they were telling me I could only be in one band at a time incase we got famous.
I didn't want to get famous just yet, I just wanted to sing.

so all I mean to say is define at the begninning how decisions will be made.

Is one person in charge?

Is everyone in charge?

My band has a core of three friends (vox/bass/drums), and we decide what we will play and where and when. The other two can like it or find another band. Of course we three have very similar taste, so we'll probably like what the other 2 suggest.

I was booking gigs, practice, and doing all the PR, while my buddy bass player did the recording and the sound, and the singer (his girlfriend) picked the songs. He's a nadgery little f'er though (nag/ badger), and kept nadgering me about every little thing. Really, this is my hobby. I am playing the music I like at the places Iike for the $ I like, and don't have time or energy to be nadgered.

So I told him he was smarter than me and had more and better ideas (he doesn't, I'm great at booking, and even though he is a better musician, he still has to ask me for booking tips), and why didn't he take over as band leader and do the booking.

He (smugly) graciously took over the booking, saying it was big of me to admit it. Now I am stress free, still playing what, when, and where I want. But I retain my "core 3" status for veto power and suggestions. I am enjoying not being in charge.

However, I had a lot of stress for a while, because we didn't say at the BEGINNING who would decide and how things would be decided, beyond "us 3 will decide".

I got tired of laying ground work, only to have them change their minds or add a step that messed up my ground work...So, they can do all the work, and I'll just enjoy the benefits.

exactly, it's a horrible feeling and completely detrimental to what made playing in a band so great in the first place. unfortunately a lot of people are passive aggressive and would rather not be direct in fear of being seen as bossy.

@ AwwSugar - your personal rules and conditions are exactly the kind of stuff that we're getting at in terms of what needs to be discussed as early as possible within the band setting. while they seem perfectly reasonable to me, from the sound of things they likely weren't with your old bandmates.

They honoured my requests pretty well aside from the fact that they were always telling me what to do.

and as you proved when you quit, that's exactly the sort of passive toxicity that kills a band when there's no established leadership. since i doubt you would have joined the band if they were clear about the '1 band limit in case you got famous' clause from the start.

I suppose that makes sense.
But they were my friends, so I don't know.

I was doing all the work to print out the set lists and make sure they were available for everyone at gigs, so I made the set lists.

This is a good example of laying ground work. You can't just throw songs together. Just like a DJ, they need to lead into each other. So i put them together how I wanted, to see if i was right/ see if I was reading things the right way. Then I could see the crowd response and make adjustments.

So the singer starts changing the set lists. Now I can't see how my ideas worked in order to adjust them and build my crowd reading skills. To me this is important, as it shapes how you write songs.

I figured if she was going to take over ****ing with the set lists, she could do the ground work of printing them and remembering to bring them. So now thats on her and she doesn't do it. She brings one old set list she looks at and calls out the next song. It kinda works, but the guitar player is alaways asking what key everything is in, because he can't be prepared.

Unfortunately, and I'm sure this goes for me too :eek: musicians are just difficult to deal with, with our varied opinions and artsy behavior.
So, I say define at the beginning how things will go, who will decide what, and how problems will be resolved. Otherwise you waste al your time disagreeing, and not enough time doing what got you there in the first place- loving playing music with these people.