Alternative: Style or status?
 

Do you guys consider a particular band alternative because they have a fairly unique sound, or do you prefer to base it on commercial success (or lack there of) and accessibility?

For example, I like Red Hot Chili Peppers, and refer to them as "alternative" rock, but I know many people wouldn't because RHCP is hugely successful now.

Just curious about your opinions on the subject.

Alternative is one of those stuffy concepts like punk which can be twisted to mean anything really. I suppose every artist is an alternative to something else. I don't like using it at all personally.

I think the Chili Peppers would be a bad example, as they've opted for a more mainstream sound as of late. But I would tend to agree with PMO, Alternative is a very non-descriptive title, encompassing everything from Death Cab to Radiohead to Of Montreal.

"Alternative" has lost all intended meaning and today stands as a means of association -- just a label that people give to music for the sake of comparison.

IMHO, it's a load of crap.

It's a term people use to make their favorite band sound really cool.

alternative is to the 90s what new-wave was to the 80s and 'indie' is to the 00s. it's a marketing term used to convince a generation they aren't buying from the same trough their older siblings did.

I totally agree with everything said here about labelling styles and genres of music - we do tend to fit meaningless labels on bands or groups of bands to sorta describe what we like... and "Alternative" is one heck of a vague, kinda useless term...

But the record companies sure like us to fit into nice little sales categories. Really, though, there is great diversity within the "alternative" camp if you wanna put it that way... who, aside from ignorant people, could sit down and listen to Nirvana, Radiohead, Pearl Jam, and even newer "alternative" acts and say they sound like a cohesive style? There are common threads in some of the bands' music, but stylistically, they are all quite different, and lyrically they all deal with many and varied concepts...

So what is the basis for the category. Nothing really. Just an easy way to lump bands together for sales purposes and for fitting certain personality types with product...

I'd sooner forget the tag "alternative" and listen ot what the music is like. I've certain heard some great "alternative" bands and some truly ****ty ones... It's all in the listening.

Marketing tool

The end

Yeah, pretty much! Just listen to what inspires your imagination folks - and don't close your mind and get led down a tunnel by what the media or a record company wants you to think - seek out new ground, listen, evaluate, enjoy, keep your **** filters switched on- fall in love with a band that sounds great, but seriously don't give a damn about its label - be that alternative or whatever else...

Well, thanks for the replies. Although I was actually wondering what you would qualify as alternative, not the record labels.

There is just no cohesive definition. However, since this site has an "alternative" section, I assumed there were probably some identifiable, shared characteristics between the varied bands. I mean, if I made a post about Led Zeppelin, surely someone would move it to another section right?

I hope this makes some degree of sense...

Alternative pop/rock is essentially a catch-all term for post-punk bands from the mid-'80s to the mid-'90s. There is a multitude of musical styles within alternative rock, from the sweet melodies of jangle-pop to the disturbing metallic grind of industrial, yet are all tied together by a similar aesthetic — they all existed and operated oustide of the mainstream. In some ways, there are two waves of alternative bands, with Nirvana's unprecedented crossover success in 1991 acting as a dividing point. Throughout the '80s, the majority of alternative bands were on independent labels; those that eventually signed to major labels, such as Hüsker Dü and the Replacements, didn't break through to the mainstream and thereby were able to keep their hip credentials alive. If anything, Alternative Rock of the '80s was even more diverse and fractured than the mainstream; among the styles classified as alternative was roots rock, alternative dance, jangle-pop, post-hardcore punk, funk-metal, punk-pop, and experimental rock. All of these genres made into the mainstream, in some form or another, after Nirvana's success in 1991, but their edges were sanded down since many of the new alternative bands were signed by majors. Consequently, '90s altenative rock often sounds more sanitized and homogenous than its counterpart, especially since the heavier material proved to have greater commercial appeal than the quieter or quirkier elements of alternative rock. Most of these idiosyncratic bands didn't sign to majors (those that did quickly disappeared), deciding to stick to independent labels, where they had more artistic freedom. These bands were grouped together under the term indie rock. Although the term had been around since the '80s, in the '90s it connotated bands that were dedicated to their own independent status, either for musical or hipness reasons.

Wow you pretty much hit the nail right on the head there - great comprehensive definition of what Alternative really means and represents, and a good potted history of the term... nice post!

STOP PLAGIARIZING PEE HOLE!

allmusic

It would have been acceptable if he used quotes or a quote box.

Sorry im not up on internet "rights n wrongs". :whythis:

It's a commercial concept created by major for taking money into pockets of poor morons who think they're different.

What they are quite rightly saying is that you have just cut and pasted your text from another website which is both lazy and gives us no idea whatsoever concerning your OWN views and writing style. Allmusic messed up anyhow as 'metallic grind of Industrial' was only arrived at when metal was introduced into the equation. Industrial music originally started as a concept that you could get alien sounds out of known and unknown instruments and adding a monotonous tone to certain aspect. So Allmusic can bugger off!

:usehead:I' m not a music expert and I figured Allmusic probably knows more then anyone else on here, thus better definition. My logic. :usehead:

Plus the 'metallic grind' section makes no indication of time, so I' m not completely sure what you mean.

So why post if you are not a music expert? By cutting and pasting other sites you are not making any contributions whatsoever. That is the third cut and paste you have posted on the forums. The rest of us can post intelligently about music and don't need another website to tell us what we already know. Those people are critics. We are merely fans and that usually means WE are better informed about music than they are because we are impartial and don't need cool points.

As for the 'industrial' aspect, I was commeting on their (allmusic) inaccuracy which then validates my above point.

That' s rather offputting to new members, amirite?

So is calling people a moron which you did in another thread and YOU said you are not a music expert. Not me.

Point is you don't really need to be a musical expert to interpret a thread properly and put your view across instead of someone elses.

Fair enough, I won't copy/paste from Allmusic anymore.

Haha RHCP are just in a league of there own

like what you like. hate what you hate. stuff everything else.

Simple but sage advice Mr. Nic...

I just realised I complemented a post that was completely copied from elsewhere... I feel kinda dumb now... :-S

I have no issue at all with genre categorisation to describe what one is listening to when trying to explain to others who are maybe interested. When discussing music on a forum such as this I would have thought that most of us understood genres meaning even if we were a bit reticent about some genre usage.

I do have a reluctance to use the terms Indy and Alternative. I think that Indy has lost it's meaning. With the downturn in major labels taking on new artists most of what we listen to could be described as Indy. Alternative I have always thought was an odd term. Alternative to what?

But as suggested by others style or status has little meaning; the idea is to just enjoy the music in the end.

Don't let it worry you. I felt a bit foolish and bit back at the individual on another thread when I should have ignored.

I read somewhere Angels and Airwaves are alternative rock, I lol'd. Then again, I'd call REM an alternative rock band, and some would lol at me for doing so...

It's funny I'd consider R.E.M abd bands like Pearl Jam alternative too - it might just be that at the time I was getting into them they really were "alternative" or "indie" and they blew up into mainstream proportions...

But I think with those bands its all about the attitude. They're both bands that have kinda said throughout their career - "I'm doing it my way" and that is what may define their alternative - ness...

He made a fool of nobody but himself, dont worry about it