The Hate List

Mucha na Dziko · 12-14-2021, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

He was clearly guilty and to be honest you're, as Guybrush said, pretty stupidly naive if you think he wasn't.

I'm just rational

Not riding on the "not guilty" or "guilty" idea, because there is just too much contradictory data.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Tell me, do you think OJ was innocent? He got off too, so he must not have done it, right?

OJ Simpson was acquitted at first, but then found guilty. It's right there in the first paragraph on his Wikipedia page.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Edit: Also, you're the one who's brought the "hate vibe" into the thread. Up to now it was, as it was intended to be, pretty light-hearted with some verbal fencing and a few verbal kicks in the verbal bal... ance of opinion. From my OP:

Give reasons if you want but you don't have to.

So anyone can vote for Jackson without explaining why. You were the one, if I recall, who demanded to know why, and now it's exploded into a whole weird defence of him

So asking for an explanation is being negative?

Saying "I won't listen to Xs music because we all know what a bastard he is" is fine, but asking "why is he a bastard?" is hate?
Come on...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

If Jackson had been an ordinary, non-wealthy person accused of these crimes he would be in jail now. It was only his celebrity status and his money that saved him.

Really, it works exactly the other way around.
I thought that rich/celebrty people can get past the juridicial system when I was like 12.
It might work that wa if you're like Elon Musk of=r she other banking clan type person, but it doesn't when you work in culture.

If you're a well-known musician selling millions of albums, you're more likely to be found guilty when charged, because the "society" makes an "example" out of you.

You can get out on bail, sure.
You can pay or something for your jail time, sure.
But you can't dictate whether you're found guilty or not.

Anyway, as long as someone isn't found guilty on strong evidence, they shouldn't be considered "guilty".
Otherwise we just go back to out caveman days when if someone said "he beat/raped me" we just go out and torch that person out to hell.

**Frownland** · 12-14-2021, 01:26 PM

That mentality favours rapists.

The Batlord · 12-14-2021, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

I think it's possible I dislike every American pop superstar

Madonna is kinda cool but still a representation of how vapid our culture can get

You know it's a good idea to have at least two things you talk about.

rubber soul · 12-14-2021, 01:37 PM

So, OJ was found innocent because he didn't have to pay for the best legal defense in town (and he was found liable, not guilty, by a civil jury)?

Look, money has corrupted all sides when it comes to Michael Jackson. Jackson could also hire the best legal defense and the main reason he was acquitted in his trial was because the jury accurately saw it as a money grab by the kids' mother. If you want proof in the pudding, (and yes, Leaving Neverland is certainly one-sided), listen to the now men who told their stories. Don't forget, in 1994, they were just impressionable boys who may have feared Michael Jackson (don't forget how much power he had in those days).

I won't go as far as I hope he rots in Hell because, as you noted, he never really had a life of his own. It was like he was the boy King but with all the dysfunction around him. But where is the justice (forget monetary) for the boys he may have victimized?

Mucha na Dziko · 12-14-2021, 01:47 PM

My point exactly RB is that he "might have"

I just can't stand the kind of thinking that allows us to say "I hope rots in hell" when things aren't clear and obvious

Mucha na Dziko · 12-14-2021, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

That mentality favours rapists.

It doesn't though

It does favour the unfairly judged (and I'm not saying MJ was or wasn't one of them)

That's the reason we have a law that's called the "Presumption of Innocence"

**Frownland** · 12-14-2021, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mucha na Dziko

It doesn't though

Nah, rapists definitely benefit from the undermining of all accusations as likely being false and by being painted as targeted victims of the state.

Unthinking "rationality" that rejects accusations of a crime that leaves behind little evidence because it doesn't meet your standard is just as much caveman **** as looking at the evidence and saying "yo that dude is a rapist."

**Frownland** · 12-14-2021, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mucha na Dziko

It does favour the unfairly judged

And the rapists who claim they are such.

Mucha na Dziko · 12-14-2021, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Nah, rapists definitely benefit from the undermining of all accusations as likely being false and by being painted as targeted victims of the state.

Unthinking "rationality" that rejects accusations of a crime that leaves behind little evidence because it doesn't meet your standard is just as much caveman **** as looking at the evidence and saying "yo that dude is a rapist."

Saying "that dude is a rapist" is fine if you live in a society of a hundred people, or a thousand. It doesn't when you have to put up with 300M of other citizens who you know **** about.

Also: it's not "my standards", it's the standards that the society had put on us, so that we can all live in a sort-of-harmony

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

And the rapists who claim they are such.

Maybe so, but that's the price you've got to pay in order to live in a society

Mindy · 12-14-2021, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mucha na Dziko

He doesn't like the negative vibes of a "hate" thread.

Therefore he told us what he loves

12-14-2021, 01:26 PM	#72 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	That mentality favours rapists. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x