The rise and fall of musical genres

William_the_Bloody · 08-07-2015, 10:35 AM

All right some disagreement on rap (though I suspect it's more based on passionate rap fans not wanting to let go than statistics)

So far we have....

Jazz, Rock, metal, rap, punk, country and various patchwork of EDM.

You know country was the one genre I thought might defy the odds because it's so rooted in geography, but when I think about it Elvis man is right, rural America has been shrinking over the decades. Peak country probably hit in the late 60's when Cash and Haggard where at their peak.

Okay here is an easy one:

Disco:

Starts in the early 70's and begins to ascends in the mid 70's & we hit peak disco around 1977/78 with colossal hits like Staying Alive & Heart of Glass.

Instead of a natural decline like most music genres it comes to an abrupt end with the disco backlash of 79 (Disco demolition night) where with the exception of a few underground dance clubs, it becomes completely obliterated as a genre by the early 80's with the onset of the New Wave.

Ninetales · 08-07-2015, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William_the_Bloody

All right some disagreement on rap (though I suspect it's more based on passionate rap fans not wanting to let go than statistics)

not wanting to let go of what :/

i mean theres a lot of hip hop currently on or featured in songs on the charts. im not sure what it was like in the 90s but i doubt it was drastically different in terms of hearing hip hop on popular radio stations (was Jay-z really as popular as N-sync in the 90s?)

**Frownland** · 08-07-2015, 11:02 AM

Jazz is still very much thriving, it's just something that you see in a more localized sense. Even still, we have jazz albums taking the internet by storm from time to time, so I don't think it's too unlikely for jazz to have another peak in the near future. And metal is most definitely not in a dip, I'd say it's at one of its best stages in its history right now.

I think that these days, the internet is preventing falls and to a lesser extent, rises, by keeping them more at a constant level because it connects niches and creates a more tight knit community surrounding the music. It's not so simple as a rise or fall anymore. You could say that they're in a decline because they don't tear up the charts, but with the way that the music world is today I don't think that's a healthy indication of the state of a genre.

Black Francis · 08-07-2015, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William_the_Bloody

Disco:

Starts in the early 70's and begins to ascends in the mid 70's & we hit peak disco around 1977/78 with colossal hits like Staying Alive & Heart of Glass.

Instead of a natural decline like most music genres it comes to an abrupt end with the disco backlash of 79 (Disco demolition night) where with the exception of a few underground dance clubs, it becomes completely obliterated as a genre by the early 80's with the onset of the New Wave

For the most part i agree with this but you can still hear traces of disco in modern artist like Thundercat or even Of montreal. New wave is dead as a hell though which is a shame because i love that genre.

The last decent new wave band ive heard is the Lost sounds which remained together till 2007 or so..

Ninetales · 08-07-2015, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Jazz is still very much thriving, it's just something that you see in a more localized sense. Even still, we have jazz albums taking the internet by storm from time to time, so I don't think it's too unlikely for jazz to have another peak in the near future. And metal is most definitely not in a dip, I'd say it's at one of its best stages in its history right now.

I think that these days, the internet is preventing falls and to a lesser extent, rises, by keeping them more at a constant level because it connects niches and creates a more tight knit community surrounding the music. It's not so simple as a rise or fall anymore. You could say that they're in a decline because they don't tear up the charts, but with the way that the music world is today I don't think that's a healthy indication of the state of a genre.

oh ya i agree with this for sure. I thought this thread was more about whats on the charts..

this is certainly the best era for music in general.

William_the_Bloody · 08-07-2015, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Jazz is still very much thriving, it's just something that you see in a more localized sense. Even still, we have jazz albums taking the internet by storm from time to time, so I don't think it's too unlikely for jazz to have another peak in the near future. And metal is most definitely not in a dip, I'd say it's at one of its best stages in its history right now.

I think that these days, the internet is preventing falls and to a lesser extent, rises, by keeping them more at a constant level because it connects niches and creates a more tight knit community surrounding the music. It's not so simple as a rise or fall anymore. You could say that they're in a decline because they don't tear up the charts, but with the way that the music world is today I don't think that's a healthy indication of the state of a genre.

This is a good point and critique of the thread, technology, particularly the internet has changed the state of music as people are no longer soley dependent upon big corporations and a few indie labels to feed them their music.

Nevertheless, popularity is still relatively defined by commercial sales & surveys, and jazz definitely doesn't dominate the music charts or sales anymore. That era is long gone, but it's still thriving as a niche genre.

Think of the British Empire, it once dominated the globe like jazz did in the 50's, but today the UK, while still a thriving G7 will never attain the historic dominance it once had.

It had it's peak and went into decline, interestingly both jazz & the UK seemed to have bottomed out around the late 70's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Francis

For the most part i agree with this but you can still hear traces of disco in modern artist like Thundercat or even Of montreal. New wave is dead as a hell though which is a shame because i love that genre.

The last decent new wave band ive heard is the Lost sounds which remained together till 2007 or so..

Well there was a big new wave revival, if you consider indie rock bands like the Strokes & Interpol as new wave.

Also lately there has been a lot of new wave sounding bands dominating the pop charts.

(ie Goyte: Someone I use to know, Foster the People: Pumped up Kicks)

but your right new wave will never be as dominate as it was in the 80's, (we probably hit peak new wave in 83?) you should map that one out.

EPOCH6 · 08-07-2015, 01:15 PM

I was totally on board with the thrash revival of the late 00's and early 10's, damn near all I listened to between 2008 and 2012. A lot of great albums came out of that movement (Black Future, Waking Into Nightmares, Ironbound, Enter the Grave etc) but a lot more mediocrity came with it, at least thrash is still fun as hell even when it's mediocre. Did that wave of bands see any attention here on the forum? Batlord maybe?

Trollheart · 08-07-2015, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William_the_Bloody

with the ascent of Lady Gaga in other artists..

You have juicy scandal to impart?

Quote:

Originally Posted by William_the_Bloody

All right some disagreement on rap (though I suspect it's more based on passionate rap fans not wanting to let go than statistics)

So far we have....

Jazz, Rock, metal, rap, punk, country and various patchwork of EDM.

You know country was the one genre I thought might defy the odds because it's so rooted in geography, but when I think about it Elvis man is right, rural America has been shrinking over the decades. Peak country probably hit in the late 60's when Cash and Haggard where at their peak.

Okay here is an easy one:

Disco:

Starts in the early 70's and begins to ascends in the mid 70's & we hit peak disco around 1977/78 with colossal hits like Staying Alive & Heart of Glass.

Instead of a natural decline like most music genres it comes to an abrupt end with the disco backlash of 79 (Disco demolition night) where with the exception of a few underground dance clubs, it becomes completely obliterated as a genre by the early 80's with the onset of the New Wave.

Sorry but Blondie were never disco. They were new wave.

William_the_Bloody · 08-07-2015, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

You have juicy scandal to impart?

Sorry but Blondie were never disco. They were new wave.

Sigh Troll heart, do you really think that someone who worked in the music industry playing in bands, setting up stage equipment & had a home recording studio is not going to know that Blondie was new wave!!!

Heart of Glass is considered a disco hit, its only on over a 1000 disco compilation CD's. Don't be one of those no it all retards that surfs MB to input contrary comments. Your smarter than that.

Trollheart · 08-07-2015, 08:25 PM

Just because something is a hit in the discos William does not make it a disco song, and using Blondie as an example of disco is wrong. Anyway, I don't know what your problem is: I already pointed out the peak/trough of prog (which you completely ignored in your summing up) so it's not like that's the only contribution I've made to the thread. I think in fact I was second to post?

But if I see someone label something as something it isn't, I'll correct it. Nothing wrong with that. Get your facts right and you wont be corrected. "Harry's Game" by Clannad was a huge hit in the clubs, but they're a traditional Irish band. You gonna call them disco too?

08-07-2015, 11:02 AM	#23 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	Jazz is still very much thriving, it's just something that you see in a more localized sense. Even still, we have jazz albums taking the internet by storm from time to time, so I don't think it's too unlikely for jazz to have another peak in the near future. And metal is most definitely not in a dip, I'd say it's at one of its best stages in its history right now. I think that these days, the internet is preventing falls and to a lesser extent, rises, by keeping them more at a constant level because it connects niches and creates a more tight knit community surrounding the music. It's not so simple as a rise or fall anymore. You could say that they're in a decline because they don't tear up the charts, but with the way that the music world is today I don't think that's a healthy indication of the state of a genre. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x

08-07-2015, 08:25 PM	#30 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,994	Just because something is a hit in the discos William does not make it a disco song, and using Blondie as an example of disco is wrong. Anyway, I don't know what your problem is: I already pointed out the peak/trough of prog (which you completely ignored in your summing up) so it's not like that's the only contribution I've made to the thread. I think in fact I was second to post? But if I see someone label something as something it isn't, I'll correct it. Nothing wrong with that. Get your facts right and you wont be corrected. "Harry's Game" by Clannad was a huge hit in the clubs, but they're a traditional Irish band. You gonna call them disco too? __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

08-07-2015, 10:35 AM	#21 (permalink)
William_the_Bloody Music Addict Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Sunnydale Cemetary Posts: 2,093	All right some disagreement on rap (though I suspect it's more based on passionate rap fans not wanting to let go than statistics) So far we have.... Jazz, Rock, metal, rap, punk, country and various patchwork of EDM. You know country was the one genre I thought might defy the odds because it's so rooted in geography, but when I think about it Elvis man is right, rural America has been shrinking over the decades. Peak country probably hit in the late 60's when Cash and Haggard where at their peak. Okay here is an easy one: Disco: Starts in the early 70's and begins to ascends in the mid 70's & we hit peak disco around 1977/78 with colossal hits like Staying Alive & Heart of Glass. Instead of a natural decline like most music genres it comes to an abrupt end with the disco backlash of 79 (Disco demolition night) where with the exception of a few underground dance clubs, it becomes completely obliterated as a genre by the early 80's with the onset of the New Wave.