Lyrics: Fact or Fiction ?

Lisnaholic · 06-02-2013, 07:43 AM

It seems so simple in the world of books; every library or bookshop is clearly divided into Fiction and Non-Fiction sections and whatever book you pick up, you know within minutes which category it falls into.

Why aren´t songs classified the same way? Something to do with the same songs being sung by various people, I suppose, and vocal styles that are or aren´t convincing.

Examples of unconvincing fictions:
The other day I heard Abba singing about, "...the stars were shining bright for you and me, for liberty, Fernando," as if Abba saw themselves as freedom fighters, ranked up there with Ché Guevarra and Nelson Mandela - a notion which I find pretty hard to swallow.
Another example is Roy Buchanan, who plays a mean guitar, but when he sings, "I´m evil" he sounds about as menacing as a teletubby.

Convincing fictions:
Did Bob Dylan actually marry Isis on the Fifth of May? I don´t care because I´ve already bought into all the metaphorical self-mythologizing about his life. Same goes for Springsteen; without knowing the details, you can imagine that he´s singing from experience, even if he didn´t have a brother who died at Khesan.

Fact:
Not so many examples of this. There´s "The Ballad of John and Yoko" and, er ...

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone else thinks about songs in these terms, or just wants an excuse to grumble or enthuse about lyrics.

**Goofle** · 06-02-2013, 07:51 AM

I don't care if lyrics are fact or fiction so long as they sound pretty cool.

sidewinder · 06-04-2013, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goofle11

I don't care if lyrics are fact or fiction so long as they sound pretty cool.

This is the right answer.

Trollheart · 06-04-2013, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder

This is the right answer.

Who are you, Anne Robinson?

Anyhoo, it doesn't really matter to me if the lyric is real or imagined, but I do like it when the singer puts something of themselves, their history or experience into their song. Like this one from the late Dan Fogelberg. It details his family's coming to America, the diverging destinies of his brothers and the way life repeats itself in an endless cycle. God, I miss that man!

Lisnaholic · 06-07-2013, 08:47 AM

^ First time I´ve heard a Dan Fogelberg song, Trollheart - so thanks, I´m quite impressed !

Of course everyone knows Paul Simon, but in his quiet way, he took a lot of risks when he wrote the material for The Capeman. As well as looking sympathetically at a figure who was briefly demonized by white America, this song includes racial slurs and street language which seem very out of character for PS. It´s almost a cappella, and he piles in so many facts and figures that the melody is kind of left to hang; it´s only in the last couple of lines I really noticed that he was singing one at all.

Trollheart · 06-07-2013, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

^ First time I´ve heard a Dan Fogelberg song, Trollheart - so thanks, I´m quite impressed !

You're welcome man. Keep an eye on my journal for a special on him coming up, but in the meantime if you want to get into his music I'd suggest starting with the double album "The innocent age" then maybe "Phoenix" and possibly "Nether lands". I can hook you up if you need any albums.
TH

**Goofle** · 06-07-2013, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

Who are you, Anne Robinson?

He isn't, but I am!

Stephen · 06-02-2013, 08:01 AM

I don't know I guess when it comes to lyrics it doesn't matter if they are factual or not. If a song has an interesting narrative I guess knowing it is describing factual events adds another level of interest but ultimately the quality of the writing is more important than the source of inspiration.

djchameleon · 06-02-2013, 08:08 AM

I feel like it's up to the listener to decide whether they feel convinced enough by the lyrics that the singer is belting out or not.

Popular Example - NIN - Hurt versus Johnny Cash's version of Hurt. You could really feel the pain in Johnny's voice during his version but not so much from Trent.

ZiggyStardust · 06-02-2013, 10:34 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le727fRZHpA

I always like this one (it's a great ballad from a poem) as it's almost a history recital.

06-02-2013, 07:43 AM	#1 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	Lyrics: Fact or Fiction ? It seems so simple in the world of books; every library or bookshop is clearly divided into Fiction and Non-Fiction sections and whatever book you pick up, you know within minutes which category it falls into. Why aren´t songs classified the same way? Something to do with the same songs being sung by various people, I suppose, and vocal styles that are or aren´t convincing. Examples of unconvincing fictions: The other day I heard Abba singing about, "...the stars were shining bright for you and me, for liberty, Fernando," as if Abba saw themselves as freedom fighters, ranked up there with Ché Guevarra and Nelson Mandela - a notion which I find pretty hard to swallow. Another example is Roy Buchanan, who plays a mean guitar, but when he sings, "I´m evil" he sounds about as menacing as a teletubby. Convincing fictions: Did Bob Dylan actually marry Isis on the Fifth of May? I don´t care because I´ve already bought into all the metaphorical self-mythologizing about his life. Same goes for Springsteen; without knowing the details, you can imagine that he´s singing from experience, even if he didn´t have a brother who died at Khesan. Fact: Not so many examples of this. There´s "The Ballad of John and Yoko" and, er ... Anyway, I was wondering if anyone else thinks about songs in these terms, or just wants an excuse to grumble or enthuse about lyrics. __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953

06-07-2013, 08:47 AM	#5 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	^ First time I´ve heard a Dan Fogelberg song, Trollheart - so thanks, I´m quite impressed ! Of course everyone knows Paul Simon, but in his quiet way, he took a lot of risks when he wrote the material for The Capeman. As well as looking sympathetically at a figure who was briefly demonized by white America, this song includes racial slurs and street language which seem very out of character for PS. It´s almost a cappella, and he piles in so many facts and figures that the melody is kind of left to hang; it´s only in the last couple of lines I really noticed that he was singing one at all. __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953

06-02-2013, 10:34 AM	#10 (permalink)
ZiggyStardust Music Addict Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Mars Posts: 108	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le727fRZHpA I always like this one (it's a great ballad from a poem) as it's almost a history recital. __________________ Welcome to the internet, where opinions are like toilets; everyone thinks theirs are perfect but the public ones stink.

06-02-2013, 08:01 AM	#8 (permalink)
Stephen I sleep in your hat Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Melbourne, Vic. Aus. Posts: 1,848	I don't know I guess when it comes to lyrics it doesn't matter if they are factual or not. If a song has an interesting narrative I guess knowing it is describing factual events adds another level of interest but ultimately the quality of the writing is more important than the source of inspiration.