The separation between the artist and his music.

Wolfi65 · 04-21-2013, 07:39 AM

Interesting topic!
There was a local radio talk show host here who I listened to on and off, and on one of his shows he opened with an epiphany he'd recently had regarding music and musicians. He said that after reading X number of various biographies, articles, etc. about many of his musical heroes - mostly 60's and 70's Rockers - he realized that many if not most of them were basically just a bunch of drug addicts and that much of their music - the lyrics in particular - were really just the ramblings of someone VERY stoned or tripping, which caused him to lose a lot of respect and appreciation for them. Can't say I disagree.
Personally, I used to LOVE Bruce Springsteen growing up, he was definitely one of my musical heroes. Until I saw a few interviews, The Boss in his own words, up close and personal, and I realized - the guy's not very bright at all.
He's just really good at writing catchy tunes with cool lyrics.

sopsych · 04-21-2013, 10:23 AM

Springsteen probably isn't highly intelligent, but don't mistake inarticulate conversationalist for dumb.

I've known John Mayer is a cad long before Playboy. I don't really care if he has vaguely racist sexual preferences. To me, the only consequence of his saying that is he is even less sensitive than I thought.

**Janszoon** · 04-21-2013, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

Springsteen probably isn't highly intelligent, but don't mistake inarticulate conversationalist for dumb.

I've known John Mayer is a cad long before Playboy. I don't really care if he has vaguely racist sexual preferences. To me, the only consequence of his saying that is he is even less sensitive than I thought.

Vaguely racist? I'd say he's pretty explicitly racist. Watching you downplay racism to such a massive degree is certainly illuminating about where you're coming from though, I'll give it that.

Trollheart · 04-21-2013, 05:11 PM

I must agree with Jansz. Your anger against adultery speaks possibly of personal experience, though of course I don't know that, but I think most people if given the choice would rather be in a car/on a bus/in a lift etc with an adulterer than a racist. I mean, what's the former gonna do? Sleep with your wife?

Wolfi65 · 04-21-2013, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

Springsteen probably isn't highly intelligent, but don't mistake inarticulate conversationalist for dumb.

I've known John Mayer is a cad long before Playboy. I don't really care if he has vaguely racist sexual preferences. To me, the only consequence of his saying that is he is even less sensitive than I thought.

It wasn't the lack of articulation that bothers me regarding Mr. Springsteen, it's his incomplete and fairly ignorant grasp - or lack thereof - of the facts. In the interviews I saw, he was basically just parroting the en vogue talking points.

I have no idea who John Mayer is, but the term 'racist' is one of the most highly overused in our times.
Adulterer? You mean like every Rock star who ever lived?

sopsych · 04-21-2013, 09:46 PM

I agree that "racist" is overused, and it trivializes some important incidents. Anyway, if John Mayer were a hardcore racist, his career would be over.

Many rock stars are cheaters, I believe. Adultery means cheating when married. I perceive that the more ballad-oriented musicians are less likely to be cheaters. I don't expect much of the metal guys. Maybe that Neal Schon likely hasn't contributed much lyrically to Journey's (or his other bands') love songs is a reason why I mainly shrug at his dirty personal behavior.

Stephen · 06-17-2013, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I perceive that the more ballad-oriented musicians are less likely to be cheaters.

No I'm afraid ballads were only invented to seem more sensitive and get more groupies without looking like a douche.

Musico Nova · 04-22-2013, 03:04 AM

Depends on the purpose of life of the artist in question otherwise in general no separation

Urban Hat€monger ? · 04-22-2013, 09:32 AM

People will always find excuses to listen to things and blank out the aspects that they don't like.

Robotrock04 · 04-23-2013, 09:05 AM

Oooh good question. I'm a fan of Michael Jackson so this is something I've asked myself before. I have to admit - I do think that Michael Jackson wasn't guilty so I still enjoy his music a lot. If I were to ever read something that made me believe he was guilty though I would no longer be able to enjoy his work. Particularly because not only is the crime utterly disgusting, but its almost rubbing it in when you have songs in your discography like Heal The World.

On the other hand I do think Courtney Love may have some involvement in Kurt Cobain's death and I find it hard to listen to Hole objectively as a result. It's a shame really because I actually could see myself enjoying their work rather a lot if I believed otherwise.

I guess its an individual case thing for me really - if I think they're just a bit of an idiot (like Morrissey) then its no issue, but if I believe they're responsible for more sinister things then it becomes much harder.

04-21-2013, 10:23 AM	#2 (permalink)
sopsych Music Addict Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: indoors Posts: 722	Springsteen probably isn't highly intelligent, but don't mistake inarticulate conversationalist for dumb. I've known John Mayer is a cad long before Playboy. I don't really care if he has vaguely racist sexual preferences. To me, the only consequence of his saying that is he is even less sensitive than I thought. __________________ If you have ideas or feedback for the site, visit The Musicbanter Improvement Thread.

04-21-2013, 05:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,996	I must agree with Jansz. Your anger against adultery speaks possibly of personal experience, though of course I don't know that, but I think most people if given the choice would rather be in a car/on a bus/in a lift etc with an adulterer than a racist. I mean, what's the former gonna do? Sleep with your wife? __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

04-21-2013, 09:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
sopsych Music Addict Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: indoors Posts: 722	I agree that "racist" is overused, and it trivializes some important incidents. Anyway, if John Mayer were a hardcore racist, his career would be over. Many rock stars are cheaters, I believe. Adultery means cheating when married. I perceive that the more ballad-oriented musicians are less likely to be cheaters. I don't expect much of the metal guys. Maybe that Neal Schon likely hasn't contributed much lyrically to Journey's (or his other bands') love songs is a reason why I mainly shrug at his dirty personal behavior. __________________ If you have ideas or feedback for the site, visit The Musicbanter Improvement Thread.

04-22-2013, 09:32 AM	#9 (permalink)
Urban Hat€monger ? The Sexual Intellectual Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere cooler than you Posts: 18,626	People will always find excuses to listen to things and blank out the aspects that they don't like. __________________ Urb's RYM Stuff Most people sell their soul to the devil, but the devil sells his soul to Nick Cave.

04-21-2013, 07:39 AM	#1 (permalink)
Wolfi65 Groupie Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 35	Interesting topic! There was a local radio talk show host here who I listened to on and off, and on one of his shows he opened with an epiphany he'd recently had regarding music and musicians. He said that after reading X number of various biographies, articles, etc. about many of his musical heroes - mostly 60's and 70's Rockers - he realized that many if not most of them were basically just a bunch of drug addicts and that much of their music - the lyrics in particular - were really just the ramblings of someone VERY stoned or tripping, which caused him to lose a lot of respect and appreciation for them. Can't say I disagree. Personally, I used to LOVE Bruce Springsteen growing up, he was definitely one of my musical heroes. Until I saw a few interviews, The Boss in his own words, up close and personal, and I realized - the guy's not very bright at all. He's just really good at writing catchy tunes with cool lyrics.

04-22-2013, 03:04 AM	#8 (permalink)
Musico Nova Groupie Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: India Posts: 8	Depends on the purpose of life of the artist in question otherwise in general no separation

04-23-2013, 09:05 AM	#10 (permalink)
Robotrock04 Groupie Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland Posts: 9	Oooh good question. I'm a fan of Michael Jackson so this is something I've asked myself before. I have to admit - I do think that Michael Jackson wasn't guilty so I still enjoy his music a lot. If I were to ever read something that made me believe he was guilty though I would no longer be able to enjoy his work. Particularly because not only is the crime utterly disgusting, but its almost rubbing it in when you have songs in your discography like Heal The World. On the other hand I do think Courtney Love may have some involvement in Kurt Cobain's death and I find it hard to listen to Hole objectively as a result. It's a shame really because I actually could see myself enjoying their work rather a lot if I believed otherwise. I guess its an individual case thing for me really - if I think they're just a bit of an idiot (like Morrissey) then its no issue, but if I believe they're responsible for more sinister things then it becomes much harder.