Petrokov

I recently agreed to try to teach piano to a girl that I know. However, I quickly realized that she has no understanding of what a major third or a perfect fifth or a semitone is. I believed until a few months ago that everyone (except tonedeaf people) could intuitively understand the relative pitch that appears in music. For example, I thought that if anyone listened to Happy Birthday, they could immediately hear the relative tones (5 5 6 - 5 - 1 - 7 - - - 5 5 6 - 5 - 2 - 1 - - - 5 5 5 - 3 - 1 - 7 - 6 - 4 4 3 - 1 - 2 - 1) and that people who didn't sing it right just wanted to look cool by not trying. So basically I intuitively understand relative pitch and intervals and pretty much all aspects of music theory, and I have since I was a little kid, so I don't know how to explain any of it.

I know this girl isn't tonedeaf because she can hear dissonance and resolution. I honestly don't know if she can remember what songs sound like because she REFUSES to sing or hum.

I need a way to explain it simply because her English isn't that great. Any help would be very much appreciated.

Howard the Duck

if you're gonna use terms like "major third", "perfect fifth" "interval", "resolution" and "relative pitch", I doubt I would even understand when I started learning theory

have her look at the keyboard - try to show her the position of the black and white keys

assign a number for each note - e.g. C=1 B=7

explain to her the space between the white keys is a "tone" up

the space between white and black is a "semitone"

you can't expect everybody to be a theory prodigy like you

you tell me "relative pitch", "interval" and "semitone" when I first started, i'd go look for another teacher, seriously

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Trollheart

Yeah I agree. Although I'm sure it wasn't meant that way, your statement that everyone should know tones/pitches by ear unless they're tone deaf is very insulting, and would without doubt push me away from you as a teacher if this is your attitude to a beginner. I have been trying (extremely unsuccessfully) to learn piano/keys for years. I'm not tone deaf, but neither could I even understand the progression you seem to regard as child's play. To be honest, you'll find that people who can distinguish pitch by ear are few and far between, and I must say your condescending attitude towards this girl (probably unintentional, I'll grant you) makes me wonder why anyone would want you as a teacher, or indeed, if the rest of us mere mortals are so beneath you in musical terms, why you would want to teach. You come across as snobbish and elitist, and I would wonder how your lessons with the girl go? Lots of snapped sticks and broken china?

Seriously, no offence but try looking at it from her view --- which is the view of a much larger percentage of the world that you obviously realise --- and make it fun and easy to learn. I hate to say it, but come down to her level: don't try to make her another you.

Or alternatively, give up as no-one is ever likely to measure up to your lofty expectations.

Hope it works out for you both, but you've got to realise as Howard says that not everyone perceives music like you, and that those who do not are not to be looked down upon --- calling people tone deaf is probably the worst insult you could level at an aspiring musician.

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Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

Music Lover 2010

I think u should consult Gary Ewer n Dolmetsch to see how they teach it. They teach it very well, n the latter is free on-line. It's how I learnt it along with Théorie de la musique by the Vincent d'Indy music school. There's some English books u can consult for it like the 2 Marc Schonbrun books.

KW710

You have to figure out a way to make it visual, not necessarily tonal at first. If there's no reference point for her, then she's not going to understand what any of that means.

Face

I would assume if you can read music you should be able to break it down into it's most simple steps in order to explain it.

I can hum a song yet oddly enough I have no idea what a major third or a perfect fifth or a semitone is. Maybe you should pick up a music for dummies book so you can get to grips with how to teach it to someone not as obviously gifted as you.

Music Lover 2010

I can hum a song yet oddly enough I have no idea what a major third or a perfect fifth or a semitone is. [/QUOTE]

It's not so oddly enough because someone can sing or play without knowing the theory. And u can even compose without knowing notation--Jules Stein n Irving Berlin did it. It's just something interesting to know n I think it makes u appreciate music more or gives u a better understanding of it at least.

Neapolitan

Have her draw out the keyboard and then label the notes for her, then have her do it. Do stuff like that, in a way music theory is build into or related to a piano keys and the music staff appears. Also look up The Suzuki method for piano see if that can help.

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jackhammer

Maybe teach them music theory in the first place and drop the elitism?

Either that or realise that music theory is just that - a theory. Music is intuition too

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