Crimes Against Music

Urban Hat€monger ? · 12-18-2010, 06:52 PM

I don't really give a shit about Fleet Foxes or Bon Iver anyway let alone what their drummers put out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RezZ

Says UMG wont allow video to be played in my country.

See, even the record company think it's shit and shouldn't be heard.

~~someonecompletelyrandom~~ · 12-18-2010, 07:02 PM

Early Overproduction

Johnny Cash said it himself. He sounded best with as minimal accompaniment as possible - just him and his guitar. Present in the 1960s but prevalent in 1970s was the notorious overproduction of singers and singer-songwriters. Big sappy string sections, flutes, barber-shop quartets, harpsichords, horns, oboes... none of which used in moderation and serve only to distract you from any talent the artist is displaying. Phil Spector ruined the Beatles send-off album Let it Be
by indulging in such techniques. Due to whatever weird reason people like Spector and Jack Clement were successful, throughout the 60s and 70s producers sought to imitate such styles. This resulted in big chunks of garbage records from otherwise talented musicians.

Who knows why the concept of minimalism is such a difficult one to grasp for some people. I can just imagine the mindset, however - stuff a tune with as much "good sounding" stuff as possible and it's bound to sound better! Right?

Wrong. What does the female quartet refrain in Ray Charles' Georgia On My Mind add to the composition? Nothing. It only makes the beautifully composed piece of music feel corny and dated years later. And that's criminal.

From The Sound of Johnny Cash

Rick Rubin producing the same song years later

A nearly unlistenable mess of a Beatles song.

Stripped-down version.

**Janszoon** · 12-18-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conan

Early Overproduction

Johnny Cash said it himself. He sounded best with as minimal accompaniment as possible - just him and his guitar. Present in the 1960s but prevalent in 1970s was the notorious overproduction of singers and singer-songwriters. Big sappy string sections, flutes, barber-shop quartets, harpsichords, horns, oboes... none of which used in moderation and serve only to distract you from any talent the artist is displaying. Phil Spector ruined the Beatles send-off album Let it Be
by indulging in such techniques. Due to whatever weird reason people like Spector and Jack Clement were successful, throughout the 60s and 70s producers sought to imitate such styles. This resulted in big chunks of garbage records from otherwise talented musicians.

Who knows why the concept of minimalism is such a difficult one to grasp for some people. I can just imagine the mindset, however - stuff a tune with as much "good sounding" stuff as possible and it's bound to sound better! Right?

Wrong.

I both agree and disagree with this. On the one hand, you're totally right about Johnny Cash, but on the other hand Phil Spector was successful because he really did produce some great music. It's just a case of using the appropriate music for a given artist. The wall of sound is perfect for the Righteous Brothers, not so much for Mr. Cash.

jackhammer · 12-18-2010, 07:16 PM

That's not a lullaby. A dummy dipped in whiskey is a lullaby.

I don't give a flying fuck if it's for charity. It's a stain.

Every damn wedding you get jive bunny played and the old dears get up dancing and wafting their skirts. The dads get up and move like brooms.

Insipid crap also available at weddings where all the men pretend to still be in love with their wives whilst chatting up the barmaids between songs.

~~someonecompletelyrandom~~ · 12-18-2010, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

I both agree and disagree with this. On the one hand, you're totally right about Johnny Cash, but on the other hand Phil Spector was successful because he really did produce some great music. It's just a case of using the appropriate music for a given artist. The wall of sound is perfect for the Righteous Brothers, not so much for Mr. Cash.

I don't know. I very much dislike the Wall of Sound and haven't heard it used in a way that I enjoy yet. And as much as I have to respect Spector for creating something new, I still hold him responsible for influencing producers in the wrong way. Plus, his work on Let it Be was just awful and it's hard to forgive someone for making a band like the Beatles sound bad.

EDIT: Actually I haven't heard any Righteous Brothers so my judgment is staved for now.

Antonio · 12-18-2010, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dayvan Cowboy

that's a crime against the english language.

and here's:

[CENTER]Dayvan Cowboy's ANGRY ANGRY Rant On Laptronica

Now, in the electronic scene, you have a lot of greats. Aphex Twin, Boards Of Canada, Autechre ect.... and they all (maybe not BOC) have used laptops and software at one point to make their music. Hell, Autechre likes to modify software so much that they came up with this weird thing. The IDM greats are definitely an exception, (they've been going on for 10-20 years, so I consider them the greats) because they actually released musically valid albums

Now with FL Studios and other pieces of software that the greats refuse to utilize, we get laptronica. laptronica is where your ****ty myspace bands, your BORING ambient soundscape albums and your sorry attempts at chiptune are made. This is the "NOBODY ****ING CARES" realm. This is where you have christ., Robot Science and your little youtube projects. Honestly, cut it out. IDGAF about your songs and I never will. some people can do it right, but for now, Stop spamming my youtube inbox.

to be honest, i don't really have too much of a problem with electronic programs being easily available to people who may not have some of the programs/equipment to do it otherwise. While I agree that there's several people who don't use it right and just make bland stuff, that's not so much the fault of the equipment so much as the fault of the person using it.

And really, i enjoyed those two songs that you presented as "bad music". Maybe i haven't listened to too much IDM, i don't know, but those appealed to my ears, so i say it's fine.

Also, what's wrong with a little youtube song projects? not every artist has show venues or the resources to present through, and alot of these people don't need or want to have all of that baggage that comes with music performance. There's nothing wrong with a little self-expression, you know.

**Janszoon** · 12-18-2010, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conan

EDIT: Actually I haven't heard any Righteous Brothers so my judgment is staved for now.

You've never heard "Unchained Melody"?

Seltzer · 12-18-2010, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

Drummers Making Solo Albums

Do I really need to add anything else?

There are a few counter examples like Robert Wyatt, Bill Bruford, Klaus Schulze, Aynsley Dunbar and some jazz drummers, but for the most part, this rings true... drummers should stick to assault and battery

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Man, I can very vividly imagine what "Bridge Over Troubled Water" would sound like on pan flute.

On the other hand, I can't imagine what the panpipes version of All that She Wants would sound like... it's that Ace of Base pop-reggae song right? That doesn't seem right...

Dr_Rez · 12-19-2010, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

Drummers Making Solo Albums

Do I really need to add anything else?

Dont forget Steve's attempt.

khfreek · 12-19-2010, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dayvan Cowboy

Dayvan Cowboy's Boring Rant On Modern Day (unoriginal) Math Rawk

I hardly think a bunch of copycat bands of Tera Melos qualifies for "Crime against Music" status.

12-18-2010, 07:02 PM	#52 (permalink)
~~someonecompletelyrandom~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,538	Early Overproduction Johnny Cash said it himself. He sounded best with as minimal accompaniment as possible - just him and his guitar. Present in the 1960s but prevalent in 1970s was the notorious overproduction of singers and singer-songwriters. Big sappy string sections, flutes, barber-shop quartets, harpsichords, horns, oboes... none of which used in moderation and serve only to distract you from any talent the artist is displaying. Phil Spector ruined the Beatles send-off album Let it Be by indulging in such techniques. Due to whatever weird reason people like Spector and Jack Clement were successful, throughout the 60s and 70s producers sought to imitate such styles. This resulted in big chunks of garbage records from otherwise talented musicians. Who knows why the concept of minimalism is such a difficult one to grasp for some people. I can just imagine the mindset, however - stuff a tune with as much "good sounding" stuff as possible and it's bound to sound better! Right? Wrong. What does the female quartet refrain in Ray Charles' Georgia On My Mind add to the composition? Nothing. It only makes the beautifully composed piece of music feel corny and dated years later. And that's criminal. From The Sound of Johnny Cash Rick Rubin producing the same song years later A nearly unlistenable mess of a Beatles song. Stripped-down version. Last edited by someonecompletelyrandom; 12-18-2010 at 07:20 PM.

12-18-2010, 07:16 PM	#54 (permalink)
jackhammer Ba and Be. Join Date: May 2007 Location: This Is England Posts: 17,331	That's not a lullaby. A dummy dipped in whiskey is a lullaby. I don't give a flying fuck if it's for charity. It's a stain. Every damn wedding you get jive bunny played and the old dears get up dancing and wafting their skirts. The dads get up and move like brooms. Insipid crap also available at weddings where all the men pretend to still be in love with their wives whilst chatting up the barmaids between songs. __________________ It be my music and film collection. “A cynic by experience, a romantic by inclination and now a hero by necessity.”