Maybe it's just me, but...
 

Why is mainstream music constantly complete garbage? If it's mainstream, that means the majority of music fans like it (?)... how can so many people like these songs that are generally sh*t?
I know it's all a matter of opinion, but I also know, for a fact, that I'm not the only person that feels this way.

The top 5 songs atm according to myspace.com:

1. Find Your Love, by Drake
2. OMG, by Usher
3. Billionaire, by Travis McCoy
4. Drop The World, by Lil Wayne
5. Not Afraid, by Eminem

I really did try to give each of these songs a chance and I'm now suicidal (not really).

Eminem's new stuff is great

mainstream music is garbage because it's sold as a product to passive listeners who are more interested in having the 'correct' topical background soundtrack to their daily lives as per their peers than they are interested in actively searching for music that speaks to their soul.

and yeah, the new Eminem single is the best thing i've ever heard from him.

I will say the Eminem song is the only one that I started to get some sort of enjoyment out of.

I wouldn't go (even nearly) that far! But as I said before it's a matter of opinion.

Surely it's just a matter of personal taste? Each to their own and all that? Ok, so if we look at stuff like X Factor winners, manufactured boy bands (do they even still make those anymore?) then I think we can agree that any 'original' music they do is pretty non-descript, standard stuff that my 4 year old neice could write, given the chance. But you've made a pretty sweeping statement about mainstream music. I think a majority of it is just where people can't be bothered to give other genres a chance. I guess some people are just happy listening to whatever's there and not really delving any deeper.

I have a friend who stops listening to material from a band once they've appeared on a 'Now that's what I call music' album, purely on the basis that he thinks that being in the mainstream is a kind of sell out these days and that the band will now probably go downhill (granted, some do...), which I think is kind of sad.

Saying that, Apart from Eminem (not a massive fan but even I rate his new stuff) I haven't actually heard any of that list. Usher and Lil Wayne can suck balls as far as I'm concerned, so I merely stay away from it. I can't remember the last time I listened to a local radio station or a music channel so I'm kind of out of touch with what's in the charts now. I know what I like and tend to stick to those areas.

I think the problem is the majority of people either can't be bothered to look deeper for music and are content to have it spoonfed to them or just assume that, because it's not from a big name, it's automatically crap, or both. Also a lot of mainstream listeners in pop aren't willing to give any other genres a try and make generalisations like all metal is smashing dustbins together and shouting.

One could argue that listeners of other genres sometimes do the same sort of the thing, I know I do. I (as a metalhead) make alot of generalizations about other genres and sometimes see a band isn't metal and automatically think I won't like it before listening to it. A big difference between myself and the common mainstream listener is that I have a basis to judge the other genres, as I've given non-metal genres a chance: country (which I do like sometimes), rap, indie rock, and even pop (in the boy band era *shudders*) to name a few.

Yah it can go both ways, for example, a lot of "indie" people refuse to listen to anything if it's mainstream for no fact other than it's mainstream, which I think is just as bad. And yeah, I went through that boy band era... >.> but now I try to keep an open mind to whatever I'm listening to, but I do tend to make generalisations abot rap...

I couldn't agree with you more. It's like you knew what I was thinking.

I really try giving today's mainstream music the benefit of the doubt, but every time I do, I feel like I've lost a thousand braincells. It really does my head in. I completely understand that it is a matter of taste and that I'm just the weird minority that don't get it, but that's just the thing - I really don't get it.

i don't think the bolded is true for most; but definitely some. i think these three things are true for most mainstream (by which i mean music featured on popular TV and radio programmes) music listeners:

- they have generally conservative tastes (no musical extremes) and mainstream music is probably the least extreme in musical aspects.
- they do not grow bored of what they like as often/quickly, and mainstream music provides more than enough fodder presented in slightly different styles for them to occupy themselves with.
- they are either not motivated to find (or are not interested in finding) new artists.

of course, these three things are not dependent on one another.

this doesn't mean they are more interested in fitting in with their peers necessarily, -though that may be the case for some- just that they have no interest, no internal reason to expand their musical tastes. which is fine, who cares? i think that applies more to most mainstream music fans than mainstream the group you mean, who have externally caused reasons for listening to music, such as to gain approval, impress others, fit into a group, etc. this is more appropriately contemptible, but not true for the majority of mainstream listeners, i think.

Pop music and it's appreciators automatically (possibly subconciously) deserve less respect because it's so easy. You don't have to do much, for example you don't have to discover it on your own, you're not required to make an effort to learn about music and it probably doesn't have to grow on you much before it sticks. It's handed to you and all you have to do is accept it. I think this is why people who are genuinely interested in music think less of it and that the actual quality of pop is less important.

To those who say pop is safe and does nothing new, I don't fully agree. Granted, some of pop does that, example Michael Bublè (my impression). Still, I think the most popular hits, like those of Lady Gaga these days or Britney Spears' "Toxic", have just about the right blend of old familiarity with a good dose of freshness. It gives people enough of the same old while piquing their interest with something new. I think if you buy the album and start listening to the songs which are not hit singles, that's probably where it starts to get really unimaginative.

I think many pop songwriters are very good at doing what they do and do find that right blend of familiar and fresh. It's probably not an easy thing to do either. Still, I can't quite find it in me to spend time on these hits .. :p:


Mark Knopfler's latest was probably less imaginative than Lady Gaga's debut, but I'll get Knopfler's album.

I think the the problem is that, in order to appeal to the maximum number of people, music has to be kind of lowest common denominator. That's not to say all mainstream music is bad really but it's almost always very safe.

Are you guys talking about "Not Afraid"? I just watched the video on YouTube because of this thread and I have to say I thought it was pretty weak. It's not even close to the same level as his late 90s/early00s stuff.

His new look cracks me up though. Looks like he should be the singer for some NYC hardcore band back in the day.

Sometimes I wonder if posters 'play' the clueless when asking this question, as I've heard this question answered probably a 1000 times and, for the most part, it's the same general response. I'm sure others have already said what's been said many a times before, so I won't continue on like a broken record because *shock and awe* I happen to like some mainstream music.

I'll leave you with Jay-Z's awesome song from last year, which spent 5 weeks at #1 on Billboard:

I agree there's plenty of good mainstream music out there. But that Jay-Z song is exactly the type of thing that leaves me wondering how in the world such a bland song could ever get so huge.

What didn't you like about it? The song had a good beat, Keys' vocal contributions were stellar, and the lyrics were great (and served as a perfect opposition to Nas' N.Y. State of Mind). :thumb:

I think the dislike towards mainstream music is a little offensive in that it's so rash and generalized and near automated. I also think the qualities of mainstream pop is often underestimated (read my last post). Still, I myself don't listen to the latest pop music. However, I do occasionally listen to pop music from previous decades which was just as commercial and fake or pretty much whatever else you think pop is as what comes out today. I just don't really make an effort to stay updated with music today as I tend to dig in the past.

Sometimes, people will bash what comes out today for being too commercial while they still love pop hits from the 80s f.ex which can be seen as slightly hypocritical.

I agree to the fullest extent, I see the people who criticize today's music trying to bring Journey back (and I'm talking about people my age in their teens who thought music was so great back in the day), etc.

Mainstream music today may not be breathtakingly original or groundbreaking, but if it sounds good then I'm down with it. I'm not insecure about the "pop" label like so many others seem to be.

Reinventing the wheel.

There's a good David Tibet quote on the subject, but seeing as I can't seem to find it anywhere, the gist of what he was saying was that pop music (ie. the generic kind, not the stuff that is genuinely original/interesting) is listened to by people who use music for hollow, shallow, petty reasons, not to truly enjoy it. That is all you need to know. If you want to listen to music because you love it and not because the sound of a computer engine running annoys you and you want to mask it, then you can easily find good music out there. The Internet is a fabulous tool for such a thing.

An example: I heard Ke$ha for the first time yesterday. Only because a friend said 'You have to hear how bad this is.' I don't have to hear the bad music, and it doesn't have hear me. It's easily avoidable. Not everybody is interested in music, as some just use it for, as I said, petty/pathetic/boring reasons. That's why a lot of it is pretty bad, and seeing as most people feel that way nowadays, it's popular.

I think people don't know or forget perhaps that the music industry was commercialized back some 50 years ago, just as it is now if not worse. Stars were hand picked, coached, written songs for and produced just like they are now. As far as I know, it wasn't really until the 60s and the 70s that people could form bands and have the freedom to make "non-commercial" music and still have the possibility of getting a record deal (ex. krautrock or Canterbury bands).

Yeah but the main difference was back then there were hundreds of record labels putting out all sorts of stuff. Even if it was safe & commercial you still had many different takes on that.

Now there are 4 record companies. That's the real reason as to why things are so stale in mainstream music.

I'm not sure if I think there was that much diversity even back then. There are always exceptions, but from a completely general point of view, the different british invasion bands from the 60s f.ex are not that amazingly diverse. Neither are the rock and rollers from the late 40s and 50s.

I don't have a problem appreciating such artists, but I find it hypocritical when people use arguments to explain why they don't like modern pop music when they could just as well criticize the bands they love using the same arguments.

edit :

I think there are legitimate reasons why people may not like pop music. I just don't think they're always obvious to the people who say they don't. ;)

Hmm... Let’s see. Boring rapping that alternates with mind-numbingly dull singing on the choruses. Tedious mukaz-style music. Uninteresting mid-tempo beat. Crappy lyrics. Hell, it even has boring subject matter, being probably the billionth song written about New York City.

Could not agree more.

I don't dislike pop because it's pop. I dislike most pop because it's safe, boring, unoriginal and untalented. I also dislike most pop fans because they tend to say every other genre is crap purely because they are afraid that they may actually like it and therefore be different, or because they can't be arsed to actually find it.

Wow, obviously we're on very different wavelengths. Interesting you use the word tedious to describe the music, considering it's a rap song. I'd be interested as to what kind of rap you do like.

And seriously, ragging on the lyrics for being about NYC? How many songs are about love? Sex? Drugs? Seeing as how music has been around as long as it has, unique subject matter for a song is hard to come by. It's how you phrase it that's key. And I think the song does a great job. Couldn't disagree more here.

Why do you find it interesting that I'd find the music tedious "considering it's a rap song"? Do have a really low opinion of rap or something?

Well, you asked what I didn't like about it and I told you. I wouldn't exactly describe that as ragging on it. And it's not like I automatically dislike songs that are about overdone subject matter, it's just in this particular case it becomes one more boring aspect of a very boring song.

I'm of Tea Supremecist's opinion...it's mainly personal taste, although a lot of other factors come into it. Corportate manufacturing has always been at play. For lyrical content, the pop labels specifically cater towards the most universal tastes (hedonism, sex, happy-go-luck clubbing, chicks, and riches) in a lot of cases, filled with the catchiest hooks by the trendiest producers they can find.

But I do not stand by the statement that all mainstream music sucks. Even manufactured music can have its merits if the producer did a good job, if the singer poured his/her heart into, etc. And yes, the occasional mainstream artist can actually have some degree of substance to their work; Prince, Madonna, even Eminem, whom the OP mentioned here, all have had some gems in their extensive musical catalogues...their commercial success doesn't make their music any better or worse than what it is. Similarly, you can find really bad, alternative and less mainstream music. Trust me, there's a LOT of that.

Ultimately, yes, it all comes down to personal tastes, and mainstream music appeases the majority of people's tastes, hence it being mainstream.

There was a book I read earlier in the year called Ripped: How the Wired Generation Revolutionized the Music Industry and the author went into great detail about this subject. No not barring any errors on the authors part it pretty much goes like this. Major record label execs give large portions of money to a third party people called 'Indie Promoters' who then channel the money to the radio station to place whatever sh*tty song on the radio. Essentially they are buying their popularity and seeing as how over 50% of most radio stations are by Clear Channel, it allows to them to control what a large portion of the people listen to. Basically, Justin Bieber is as popular as he is because people invested a large sum of money to buy his place in the spotlight. It's not because everyone loves his music or that millions of people have gone out to buy My World 2.0, but because it was purchased for him. Why do you think the major labels went all psycho when people started downloading popular artists' music? How are they going to make a return on their investment if everyone goes out and downloads the song they spent thousands or millions of dollars on promoting?

I like to listen to mainstream artists, but I dig deep into their catalogues to find the stuff that's not played on the radio. Album cuts (or whatever you'd like to call them) are generally better in my opinion - they're usually more genuine because the artist or band is not making the song to fit the cookie-cutter standards of a radio hit. For example, from REM's album Out of Time, I much prefer the album cut "Texarkana" over the poppy cheesy-ness that is "Shiny Happy People." Even the band stopped playing this one live during the Monster tour in 1994 and haven't played it live since then.

versus

Over the past couple of years I've gotten more into classical and jazz, both of which are FAR from mainstream. Of course there's the more popular classical music from Beethoven, Mozart, et al, and the more popular jazz musicians like Coltrane or Davis.

I still like mainstream music, but I think people should learn to enjoy the deeper cuts and less popular stuff as well.

Many, many people are not as sad as us lot on here and just listen to music for fun or in the car etc and are not interested in the instruments used or the production or longevity etc. Of course to us it's ridiculous but 9/10 people regard music as a throwaway form of media and nothing else.

I don't like it myself but it has always been the case with popular music and todays media just intensifies that and focuses on the music that guarantees high revenue via adverts etc.

As with everything- don't let it bother you. If you look hard enough there is plenty out there to enjoy and find for yourself and not be spoon fed by the big companies.

What ^he said.

If you don't like it, don't listen to it. It's true that the majority of people just see music as something to listen to. When I'm with my friends I get stuck listening to music I don't like, i'm like "What the hell is this?" But when I pick something from my collection, and I play something like Bob Dylan, they're like "What the hell is this?" It's just the way life is, it might suck, but whatever. And not all mainstream is bad, just don't get sucked in completely and forget about the real music.

I love rap. What I meant is that most rap songs don't have a changing sound throughout the song, as the music is pretty monotonous throughout. The lyrics are what change.

You did tell me your opinion, and I told you what I thought about what you had to say. I'm not putting words in your mouth, I'm having a music banter.

My comment has nothing to with the music changing or not changing, minimalism is fine with me and actually "Empire State of Mind" isn't even particularly minimalistic by hip hop standards anyway. I'm just saying I find the music incredibly boring, not because it's repetitive but because it's bland.

There are two kinds of music listeners in the world.

Nerdy motherf*ckers like us where music makes up a great deal of our time consumption.

And people who are too busy having a life to be serious about music so they only listen to it to pass the time and thus go with whatever is available, which is whatever is on the radio.

That actually sounds insulting.

More like self depreciating.

Actually both.