Does anyone agreee that there is too much music out there? (electronic, alternative)

Rainard Jalen · 04-16-2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Music Watchtower

Hi All,

It is hard to get close to good music unless you are very lucky. You can spend hours, days, weeks or even years getting through everyone's myspace or social networking site and not find much or more of the same.

Yeah. You looking in the wrong places, buddy. Go to more well informed sources and you'll find great material with ease.

boo boo · 04-16-2009, 09:14 PM

I like simple rock music, but it just seems very skilled musicians get a bum rap because they don't waste their talents making the same kind of basic rock n roll that everyone else does.

I feel that progressive rock and a lot of classic rock bands especially takes an unfair beating for it, because they take the more complex approach.

So for example, while I'd say Never Mind the Bollocks is as good as say... Inner Mounting Flame by Mahavishnu Orchestra. I have to give more credit to the band that actually put a lot of skill and effort into their product.

Or another example, I find Fall Out Boy and Dream Theater to be about equally unbearable to listen to. But I give DT more credit for a variety of reasons, one of them is that they can actually play their instruments and play them well, and another is that they seem to actually appreciate music and love what they do, rather than just being in it solely for the money. So for that, even though I f*cking loathe Dream Theater, I respect them, because I sure as hell couldn't do what they do for a living if my life depended on it.

But anybody could do Pete Wentz' job.

**Janszoon** · 04-16-2009, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

I like simple rock music, but it just seems very skilled musicians get a bum rap because they don't waste their talents making the same kind of basic rock n roll that everyone else does.

I feel that progressive rock and a lot of classic rock bands especially takes an unfair beating for it, because they take the more complex approach.

It's funny but I feel like it's pretty much the opposite. All those classic rock guys get held up as the gods in the pantheon of rock n roll while the punk and post-punk musicians are kind of neglected.

Meh. I bet a lot of the difference in our perception probably comes from our difference in age too. I grew up in a time when those 70s guys were totally worshipped, but maybe when you were growing up the punks were getting more worship.

boo boo · 04-16-2009, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

It's funny but I feel like it's pretty much the opposite. All those classic rock guys get held up as the gods in the pantheon of rock n roll while the punk and post-punk musicians are kind of neglected.

Well that's not the case here at all, and certainly not for critics.

There are some punk bands I love, I have a modest punk library from 20 or so punk bands. But IMO the best punk bands tend to be more gifted than other punk bands on a technical level. Like The Minutemen and X. Though I also love Ramones just as much as the next person.

Overall I find the legacy of punk to be rather phony. I don't like the concept of music being this thing where image is REALLY important, prog bands consist of dorky guys with balding mullets and porn staches, it's like the one rock genre that just lets the music sell itself, no need for a fashion line. The idea that punk saved rock n roll from progressive rock is absurd, prog was already getting kicked to the curb by the time punk showed up. Granted the late 70s did get really awful what with Foreigner and all and punk and new wave did make that half of the decade worthwhile, punk does deserve credit for that, without it, the 80s would have been nothing but Toto and Night Ranger.

But I feel punk did more harm then good in the long run, yes it lead to new wave and it lead to Pixies, Sonic Youth and Nirvana, blah blah. But to me aside from Joy Division, Wire and some Gang of Four songs, I never cared for post punk at all. It's like diet punk, punk without the fun, in other words it's something a 3 year old could do AND it's boring.

Then of course post punk begat goth rock which begat emo which begat "fake" emo

Punk begat pop punk which begat even worse pop punk.

Punk begat alternative which begat grunge which begat post grunge.

Punk begat hardcore which begat post-hardcore and grindcore which begat metalcore.

Punk begat new wave which begat synth pop which begat crappy synth pop which begat dance punk.

Sorry if it sounds like I'm reading out of the bible, but it seems that punk is responsable for just about 90% of everything that sucks about rock music today.

The punk movement seemed to have the concept that the ideal rock band is just a bunch of guys with no real talent who just crap out 1 minute songs, but what really matters is that they're having fun, and I like fun music, but I like it to be good too. I just don't get it, to me it's just an excuse for being lazy. And while there has been some great punk bands (at least up until the mid 80s) all that's left of it now is it's impact on what is ironically, awful corporate rock music.

And while theres still good things to come out of punk, as of now, I think prog is not only making a comeback, it's becoming increasingly more relevant, it'll probably overshadow punk in the future, I think the reason is because while prog was once overexposed by the media and punk was this refreshing new thing, now it's punk that's overpraised and overexposed, and it's prog that seems foreign and new to people. A lot of younger people have never heard of prog, both because it's mostly ignored by the media and because their parents are punk rockers or metalheads who got burned out on prog when they were kids, so to them it's brand new.

In other words the roles have switched, and I feel this cycle will continue forever. Simple rock music has gotten so popular that now people want something completely different, complex music. But rest assured once prog dominates rock n roll again, punk or something like it will be there to sh*t on it's parade once again. And that conflict of music philosophy will last forever.

The Mars Volta, Porcupine Tree, Muse, Coheed & Cambria, Sigur Ros, Isis, Tool and Battles are among the best bands we have today IMO, I know a lot of people hate the f*ck out of them. Likely because they fear the inevitable prog revival.

Sure it's reputation isn't clean yet (f*cking prog metal) but even so prog hasn't been as popular as it is now since the early 70s.

So to sum up this fanboy rant that is sure to enrage punk fans everywhere. What comes around goes around.

Quote:

Meh. I bet a lot of the difference in our perception probably comes from our difference in age in age too. I grew up in a time when those 70s guys were totally worshipped, but maybe when you were growing up the punks were more getting their due.

I didn't listen to the radio much as a kid, just watched MTV. And after I got bored of Limp Bizkit and Kid Rock. I got into classic rock, it was completely foreign to me, and so I don't see why I should hate it because other people have been overexposed to it and now hate it.

**Janszoon** · 04-16-2009, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

Well that's not the case here at all, and certainly not for critics.

Depends on what critics you're talking about I guess.

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

I didn't listen to the radio much as a kid, just watched MTV. And after I got bored of Limp Bizkit and Kid Rock. I got into classic rock, it was completely foreign to me, and so I don't see why I should hate it because other people have been overexposed to it and now hate it.

You shouldn't hate it. It's what you like and that's cool. I'm just saying that your experience where you feel like you've had punk shoved down your throat is like the experience I had with classic rock. Like I said before I think it's a product of us growing up in somewhat different eras.

As for your comments about postpunk, I've loved it for ages and you know what? It got zero recognition for the longest time. It wasn't until this decade when the neo postpunk bands started showing up that anybody really started giving it any press at all. The idea of actually encountering sizable numbers of people who like it is still a very foreign concept for me.

Urban Hat€monger ? · 04-17-2009, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

But I feel punk did more harm then good in the long run, yes it lead to new wave and it lead to Pixies, Sonic Youth and Nirvana, blah blah. But to me aside from Joy Division, Wire and some Gang of Four songs, I never cared for post punk at all. It's like diet punk, punk without the fun, in other words it's something a 3 year old could do AND it's boring.

And I think this is where you do yourself a huge disservice. You're missing out on a whole range of different stuff just because of one prejudice.

The reason why I enjoy post punk is because there is no boundaries with it. I think you're looking at it with a far too narrow viewpoint. The whole 'punk' thing in post punk is just one narrow aspect of it which you seemed to have grasped onto as being the most important.

Some of the stuff I have heard under the post punk banner, the actual links to punk itself are tenuous at best. I've heard Jazz albums , Prog albums , Electronica albums , Guitar rock albums , Psychedelia albums, Pop albums , Noise albums and all other sorts of stuff. And just because there may be a tiny punk influence or because they were released in the late 70s / early 80s they get the post punk label. Seriously , go listen to something like the Cardiacs 'A Little Man And a House' album or 'Iron Path' by Last Exit or Born Sandy Devotional by The Triffids & then tell me these are boring albums. Three albums under the same 'Post Punk' banner which sound nothing alike. and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

If you think it's all about angular guitars & shouty monotone vocal delivery that inspired a couple of 90s indie bands you are missing out on a hell of a lot of stuff.

**Janszoon** · 04-17-2009, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

Seriously , go listen to something like the Cardiacs 'A Little Man And a House' album or 'Iron Path' by Last Exit or Born Sandy Devotional by The Triffids & then tell me these are boring albums.

*takes notes*

boo boo · 04-17-2009, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

And I think this is where you do yourself a huge disservice. You're missing out on a whole range of different stuff just because of one prejudice.

The reason why I enjoy post punk is because there is no boundaries with it. I think you're looking at it with a far too narrow viewpoint. The whole 'punk' thing in post punk is just one narrow aspect of it which you seemed to have grasped onto as being the most important.

Some of the stuff I have heard under the post punk banner, the actual links to punk itself are tenuous at best. I've heard Jazz albums , Prog albums , Electronica albums , Guitar rock albums , Psychedelia albums, Pop albums , Noise albums and all other sorts of stuff. And just because there may be a tiny punk influence or because they were released in the late 70s / early 80s they get the post punk label. Seriously , go listen to something like the Cardiacs 'A Little Man And a House' album or 'Iron Path' by Last Exit or Born Sandy Devotional by The Triffids & then tell me these are boring albums. Three albums under the same 'Post Punk' banner which sound nothing alike. and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

If you think it's all about angular guitars & shouty monotone vocal delivery that inspired a couple of 90s indie bands you are missing out on a hell of a lot of stuff.

Actually, let me rephrase what I said, which I admit was a rather silly remark not meant to be taken too seriously, I do have a tendency towards hyperbole.

The idea of making punk rock into something more artistically credible and challenging is of course a great concept. And I don't dislike post punk so much as the influence it has had on countless lo fi Fall and Joy Division ripoff bands.

I don't hate any of the post punk bands (except maybe Jesus & Mary Chain, if they count as post punk), I like Joy Division, Wire and Gang of Four. The Fall I don't really care for or have much of an opinion about, Public Image Ltd are hit and miss from what I've heard, they do have some good stuff. Ecco & The Bunnymen? Eh I've only heard a few songs but they didn't really catch my interest. Same goes for Killing Joke.

Of the goth rock variety, I like The Cure, and what few Siouxie and The Banshees songs I've heard, haven't heard any Bauhaus.

Rather my criticism towards post punk is more directed to the awful post-punk revival we have right now. I really really hate Interpol.

Antonio · 04-16-2009, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

I like simple rock music, but it just seems very skilled musicians get a bum rap because they don't waste their talents making the same kind of basic rock n roll that everyone else does.

I feel that progressive rock and a lot of classic rock bands especially takes an unfair beating for it, because they take the more complex approach.

So for example, while I'd say Never Mind the Bollocks is as good as say... Inner Mounting Flame by Mahavishnu Orchestra. I have to give more credit to the band that actually put a lot of skill and effort into their product.

Or another example, I find Fall Out Boy and Dream Theater to be about equally unbearable to listen to. But I give DT more credit for a variety of reasons, one of them is that they can actually play their instruments and play them well, and another is that they seem to actually appreciate music and love what they do, rather than just being in it solely for the money. So for that, even though I f*cking loathe Dream Theater, I respect them, because I sure as hell couldn't do what they do for a living if my life depended on it.

But anybody could do Pete Wentz' job.

imo, it's the song that matters in the end. if it's a good technical song, i respect it the same if it's a good catchy song. if the song sounds good, then i like it. i've heard plenty of extremely skilled musicians that bore the hell out of me and dudes who know a few chords that have made great songs and vice versa.

FireInCairo · 04-16-2009, 10:51 PM

You're such a progger booboo.

04-16-2009, 10:51 PM	#10 (permalink)
FireInCairo Later on... Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Melbourne Posts: 1,235	You're such a progger booboo. __________________ O G MUDBONE: Only You can prevent forest fires.