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15Steps 07-11-2008 11:22 PM

Who's The Better Elvis?
 
opinions? i really think Presley is incredibly overrated.

Son of JayJamJah 07-12-2008 12:09 AM

Elvis is not overrated. Here's why. No one (slight hyperbole) who did not live through the Elvis era really reveres him. He deserves a special place and history, I was too young to really remember but by sister is 10 years my senior and she still describes Elvis as the biggest American phenomenon she's witnessed in her life. Not because she likes the Music but because of how people reacted to him and his music and his performances.

Elvis, as much because of dumb luck and quite possibly racism as because of merit or skill paved the way for the Beatles, Dylan, Zeppelin, The Who Everyone (post 1960) who doesn't suck really. He didn't create his legacy and it killed the Man first on the inside, then the outside and then for ever. He is not over rated because everyone under rates him now because their is so many better choices. (And there are) But without what Elvis did none of it exists, regardless of rather or not someone else would have done it eventually they didn't and he did.

My Vote is for Costello, "Armed Forces" rocks!

lucifer_sam 07-12-2008 12:22 AM

To be honest I never really enjoyed Presley's stuff. I don't hold anything against him, even though it was racism in America that made him popular in the first place. I give him credit though, because The Beatles were a band not particularly influenced by delta blues, and, as John Lennon once said, "if there wasn't an Elvis there wouldn't have been a Beatles."

Strange poll though. I would think you would compare Presley to someone who was producing music at the same time. Chuck Berry or Bo Diddley, maybe? But yeah, in terms of being the better musician, songwriter, whatever, Costello kicks Presley's ass.

15Steps 07-12-2008 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam (Post 497147)

Strange poll though. I would think you would compare Presley to someone who was producing music at the same time. Chuck Berry or Bo Diddley, maybe? But yeah, in terms of being the better musician, songwriter, whatever, Costello kicks Presley's ass.

me and my friends were arguing about it today, so i went here for other peoples opinions.

bsmix 07-12-2008 02:32 AM

sadly, i haven't got into either. but I refuse to think somebody is not overrated who is dubbed the king of rock and roll and has people dress up like him more than anyone else in the whole Fing world (maybe jesus?) not his fault I guess

sweet_nothing 07-12-2008 02:32 AM

I never really got Elvis because he was doing the same as everyone else back then, maybe because he was white?

my vote goes for Elvis Costello

WaspStar 07-12-2008 07:23 AM

Just my opinions here, but Costello is one of rock's best songwriters; in his prime, he had a demonic howl of a voice. Presley had a pretty face, a lot of sex appeal, and white skin. As far as influence, Presley was one of the most influential rockers in history. As a cultural force, he was probably the most influential. As far as records go? Costello wins, hands down.


As a side note, I love the "Elvis is king" notes on the cover of My Aim Is True. Costello once said in an interview that the name helped him get away with a lot of creative borrowing. He said that everyone would be searching for his influences on old 50's records, when he was more likely to be lifting a phrase from the latest Talking Heads release.

The Monkey 07-12-2008 07:41 AM

Elvis Presley is no doubt the most over-rated artist in history.

mr. goth glam 07-12-2008 08:08 AM

I think both guys are/were pretty badass. Musically though, I'd go with Costello because that's the kind of thing I listen to.

NoseClams 07-12-2008 11:27 AM

its so damn nice to hear other people say Presley is incredible over-rated. Costello is a great artist and i feel he may be slightly under-rated.

Rainard Jalen 07-12-2008 11:50 AM

Presley shouldn't even be in a poll like this. For starters, he was not really a songwriter - he was for the majority of his career either a covers artist or singer of songs written specifically for him by professional songwriters. I repeat: Elvis was not a songwriter. Costello, on the other hand, is an actual singer/songwriter artist. In other words, there are no actual grounds on which to compare the two other than purely as singers.

So, if you want to ask the question "who was the better songwriter", then it's a no contest: Presley wasn't really songwriter to begin with so Costello wins by default. If you want to ask "who was the better singer", then I think anybody with working ears can tell that the answer is clearly Presley. Really good voice.

Presley is not overrated either. Which claim about Elvis is suggestive of him being overrated? All people say is that he was a great singer and concert performer, which he was. Anybody who denies that has simply got to be an idiot. If he was neither, he would never have been the most popular singer on earth.

I am literally amazed that in 2008 people still don't realize that Elvis Presley was not a songwriter or a trained musician of any sort.

WaspStar 07-12-2008 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainard Jalen (Post 497212)
If you want to ask "who was the better singer", then I think anybody with working ears can tell that the answer is clearly Presley. Really good voice.

Presley is not overrated either. Which claim about Elvis is suggestive of him being overrated? All people say is that he was a great singer and concert performer, which he was. Anybody who denies that has simply got to be an idiot. If he was neither, he would never have been the most popular singer on earth.

I have to disagree about the voices. Have you heard What's So Funny About Peace, Love, & Understanding or God Give Me Strength? Costello can be overambitious, but more often (those are the two tracks that immediately come to mind) he's up there with the greats.

People say that Presley had a great voice; I really don't think he did. I don't think he could sing rock very well (compare Jailhouse Rock to Maybellene, or even Rave On; the songwriting's not an issue here because a great rock singer can make even the worst songs sound great), and I don't think he was able to put the ballads across very well. You say that if Presley was not a great singer/performer, then he wouldn't have been the most popular singer on earth. Do you think Britney Spears (or any other "most popular" singer of the modern pop world) is a great singer/performer?

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoseClams (Post 497204)
Costello is a great artist and i feel he may be slightly under-rated.


I think he's been cheated out of his rightful place in rock history. He wasn't as innovative as some of his contemporaries, but he wrote some amazing songs and, with the help of the Attractions, made some of the most memorable records of the late 70's and 80's.

Son of JayJamJah 07-12-2008 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweet_nothing (Post 497166)
I never really got Elvis because he was doing the same as everyone else back then, maybe because he was white?

my vote goes for Elvis Costello

He was doing it on National Television, no one else was. As I mentioned it's not about his talent it's about the circumstances.

Rainard Jalen 07-13-2008 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WaspStar (Post 497221)
You say that if Presley was not a great singer/performer, then he wouldn't have been the most popular singer on earth. Do you think Britney Spears (or any other "most popular" singer of the modern pop world) is a great singer/performer?

I suppose it is true that Elvis was ultimately marketed to people on grounds other than his singing, much like Spears or whoever.

I do think that he was at least a very good performing artist, though - taking things like crowd control etc into consideration.

Crowe 07-13-2008 02:34 AM

I was raised on the Elvis that Mr. Costello got his name from. Gotta love the King. Some of these overrated comments are so off the mark it's slightly blasphemous.

bsmix 07-13-2008 02:42 AM

jesus christ (neither of those words spell check) **** he wasnt talented yeah but he was shown on television!!!!!!. If you dont celebrate that today then why do it yesterday. Yeah they showed HIM who gives a flying FFFFFFFFF.

Davey Moore 07-13-2008 10:01 PM

Think of Rock and Roll as a religion if you will, in a hypothetical sense. Elvis Presley is the greatest preacher Rock ever had.

However I am tired and I accidentally voted Elvis Costello.

lucifer_sam 07-13-2008 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davey Moore (Post 497494)
However I am tired and I accidentally voted Elvis Costello.

Your subconscious serves you well, young Padawan.

Burpgun 07-13-2008 11:38 PM

My vote actually goes for Elvis Hitler. Some good crampsy garage rock that seems to excel over both Costello and Presley.

15Steps 07-14-2008 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burpgun (Post 497507)
My vote actually goes for Elvis Hitler. Some good crampsy garage rock that seems to excel over both Costello and Presley.

:nono:

Burpgun 07-14-2008 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 15Steps (Post 497536)
:nono:

http://www.tux.org/~bagleyd/unicycle...rtoons/yes.gif

ADELE 07-20-2008 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 15Steps (Post 497127)
opinions? i really think Presley is incredibly overrated.

Yeah but the Who are a completely different act!!!!!
he he he!~
But I do agree the Who are a better act then Elvis

WWWP 07-26-2008 03:32 AM

I never really got into either of them, so I guess I liked them both about the same.
However, I saw Elvis Costello live a few weeks ago when he opened up for The Police. So he gets my vote.

TheBig3 07-27-2008 11:26 PM

Translation of how most see this:

You want the guy that redneck inbreds like or...

The nerdy looking guy you try to dress like and pretend to own all the albums of to get pussy from college girls?

This whole racism thing is just guilty white people looking for a way to show their not racist. I mean was anyone else playing working class blues like Cudrupp's with disgusting pep and vigor?

Say Presley at worst was too excited to add an appropriate emotion to the music and accidentally hit a nerve but when you say he wins out because of racism, it means everyone who ever liked him then wanted to see black people hung from a tree.

I'm no huge fan of either but ever since I bought "When I was cruel" I was a Presely fan much more.

The King.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burpgun (Post 497580)

Where the hell did you get that? PFLAG's application for clown college?

lucifer_sam 07-27-2008 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBig3KilledMyRainDog (Post 501524)
Translation of how most see this:

You want the guy that redneck inbreds like or...

The nerdy looking guy you try to dress like and pretend to own all the albums of to get pussy from college girls?

This whole racism thing is just guilty white people looking for a way to show their not racist. I mean was anyone else playing working class blues like Cudrupp's with disgusting pep and vigor?

Say Presley at worst was too excited to add an appropriate emotion to the music and accidentally hit a nerve but when you say he wins out because of racism, it means everyone who ever liked him then wanted to see black people hung from a tree.

I'm no huge fan of either but ever since I bought "When I was cruel" I was a Presely fan much more.

The King.

Costello was far more racist than Presley ever was. Presley was the man covering the songs and integrating blues riffs into his music. The overwhelming majority of his fans WERE racists, but Presley himself wasn't. Costello, on the other hand (being both a fan of Presley's and outspoken to the last), WAS indeed a racist, and his Buddy Holly sheen does nothing to mask the foul stench. But he was a far superior songwriter and musician. Presley may have been the innovator and the sex symbol, but he was no lyrical or musical genius.

Please, don't try to dissuade people's distaste for Elvis Presley by saying that we're trying to assuage our guilt about racism. It is evident that Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Fats Domino, or Bo Diddley didn't enjoy as much popular acclaim as Presley, and not because they were worse musicians. It's because they were black. And not a fucking thing is gonna change that.

Don't try to feed us accusatory bullshit, mmmkay?

FireInCairo 08-10-2008 04:11 AM

All Presley did was angliscise black music
he made boring rockabilly then boring faux operatic pop
elvis costello is a fantastic songwriter

eggyhendrix 08-10-2008 05:16 AM

The actual "greatness" of Elvis is definitely overrated. None of his songs are all that great (in my opinion), but I can't deny that he opened the doors for other acts such as the Who.

Janszoon 08-11-2008 01:42 PM

The fact of the matter is that the best Elvis is The Evil Elvis, Glenn Danzig. And that's despite the fact that he's a jackass.

Minstrel 08-11-2008 02:19 PM

Elvis Presley is kind of the Joe DiMaggio of music. His iconic status is out of proportion with his greatness, but both were definitely great.

Early Elvis music is still pretty fantastic, in my opinion. I don't think it's the best music ever, but it's easy to see why he took the nation by storm with it.

And he wasn't just a copyist. He may have owed a greater debt to bluesmen then was ever recognized at the time, but he he gave that music a rock energy and backbeat.

Other artists, like Little Richard, did also, but they were contemporaries (who deserved more credit than they got). Elvis was doing it at virtually the same time and deserves the same "innovation" credit.

I like Elvis Costello's music, but I'll take Presley over Costello any day. At least, his earlier stuff.

joyboyo53 08-11-2008 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayJamJah (Post 497142)
Elvis is not overrated. Here's why. No one (slight hyperbole) who did not live through the Elvis era really reveres him. He deserves a special place and history, I was too young to really remember but by sister is 10 years my senior and she still describes Elvis as the biggest American phenomenon she's witnessed in her life. Not because she likes the Music but because of how people reacted to him and his music and his performances.

Elvis, as much because of dumb luck and quite possibly racism as because of merit or skill paved the way for the Beatles, Dylan, Zeppelin, The Who Everyone (post 1960) who doesn't suck really. He didn't create his legacy and it killed the Man first on the inside, then the outside and then for ever. He is not over rated because everyone under rates him now because their is so many better choices. (And there are) But without what Elvis did none of it exists, regardless of rather or not someone else would have done it eventually they didn't and he did.

My Vote is for Costello, "Armed Forces" rocks!

Before having read this I had just voted "Elvis Presley" and I was about to give a whole spiel about how even though to the displeasure of many people present, without Elvis having popularized rock music (and music to the general public as commercialism hit the record industry) we would have never embraced it as though we did. Now you went and took all my words and I dont got much to say.

lucifer_sam 08-11-2008 09:08 PM

If Glenn Danzig is added then Josh Homme should be too.

Let's stick to the people that adopted Elvis as their stage name, not nick name.

Janszoon 08-12-2008 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam (Post 505846)
Let's stick to the people that adopted Elvis as their stage name, not nick name.

That raises the question though: Why is Elvis Crespo not on the list?

http://www.cubadance.ch/salsa/wp-con...spo-122807.jpg

lucifer_sam 08-12-2008 02:30 PM

He sucks.

The only salsa I want to see better have tortilla chips next to it.

Janszoon 08-12-2008 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam (Post 506024)
He sucks.

I make no claims about the man's worth as a musician, just that he's an Elvis.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam (Post 506024)
The only salsa I want to see better have tortilla chips next to it.

Haha. I think Elvis Crespo is a Merengue guy though. :p:

15Steps 09-08-2008 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 505585)
The fact of the matter is that the best Elvis is The Evil Elvis, Glenn Danzig. And that's despite the fact that he's a jackass.

he had one good album.

john1964 04-17-2009 02:57 AM

Elvis, I mean THE KING, was the best. He had such an incredible voice in blues, country, rock & roll, gospel, love songs, etc...I don't think a Costello can do better.

The Monkey 04-17-2009 08:13 AM

^ Check out "My Aim is True".

Presley had a nice voice, sure, but that alone doesn't merit his title.

Keigh 04-22-2009 07:48 AM

Costello is better. Singer/songwriter/collaborator.

Presley was just a figure. He could sing and dance and look pretty, that was all. He gave a non-threatening voice to a music the labels wanted to capitalize on. They can call him the "King" all they want. He invented nothing. He was on ok singer who couldn't write his own material.

SceneSalsa 04-22-2009 03:39 PM

Elvis Presley is the most overrated artist of all time.

It's rather fitting that he died on the toilet, seeing as how he was nothing but a piece of ****.

4ZZZ 04-22-2009 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keigh (Post 644041)
Costello is better. Singer/songwriter/collaborator.

Presley was just a figure. He could sing and dance and look pretty, that was all. He gave a non-threatening voice to a music the labels wanted to capitalize on. They can call him the "King" all they want. He invented nothing. He was on ok singer who couldn't write his own material.


Using a British colloquialism your comment about "non-threatening" is a load of Bollocks. For a start he began his career on a small label called Sun and typical of those times as it is now anyone with any popularity is signed by a major label. Dylan went to CBS at the time.
So what if Presley signed to a major label eventually. I have read a few books on his cultural impact and we, that is me and you and many others would not have a clue unless we have lived around that time, the mid fifties or bothered, as in my case, to read about it.

I will quote wiki as it is a readily available source.

Quote:

When "That's All Right" was played, many listeners were sure Presley must be black, prompting white disc-jockeys to ignore his Sun singles. However, black disc-jockeys did not want anything to do with any record they knew was made by a white man.[102] To many black adults, Presley had undoubtedly "stolen" or at least "derived his style from the Negro rhythm-and-blues performers of the late 1940s",[103] though such criticism ignored Presley's use of "white" musical styles. Some black entertainers, notably Jackie Wilson, argued: "A lot of people have accused Elvis of stealing the black man’s music, when in fact, almost every black solo entertainer copied his stage mannerisms from Elvis."[104]c

By the spring of 1956, Presley was becoming popular nationwide and teenagers flocked to his concerts. Scotty Moore recalled: "He’d start out, 'You ain’t nothin’ but a Hound Dog,' and they’d just go to pieces. They’d always react the same way. There’d be a riot every time."[105] Bob Neal wrote: "It was almost frightening, the reaction... from [white] teenage boys. So many of them, through some sort of jealousy, would practically hate him." In Lubbock, Texas, a teenage gang fire-bombed Presley's car.[106] Some performers became resentful (or resigned to the fact) that Presley's unmatched hustle onstage before them would "kill" their own act; he thus rose quickly to top billing.[106] At the two concerts he performed at the 1956 Mississippi-Alabama Fair and Dairy Show, one hundred National Guardsmen were on hand to prevent crowd trouble.[107]

To many white adults, the singer was "the first rock symbol of teenage rebellion. ... they did not like him, and condemned him as depraved. Anti-Negro prejudice doubtless figured in adult antagonism. Regardless of whether parents were aware of the Negro sexual origins of the phrase 'rock 'n' roll', Presley impressed them as the visual and aural embodiment of sex."[108] In 1956, a critic for the New York Daily News wrote that popular music "has reached its lowest depths in the 'grunt and groin' antics of one Elvis Presley" and the Jesuits denounced him in their weekly magazine, America.[109] Even Frank Sinatra opined: "His kind of music is deplorable, a rancid smelling aphrodisiac. It fosters almost totally negative and destructive reactions in young people."[110] Presley responded to this (and other derogatory comments Sinatra made) by saying: "I admire the man. He has a right to say what he wants to say. He is a great success and a fine actor, but I think he shouldn't have said it... This ... [rock and roll] ... is a trend, just the same as he faced when he started years ago."[111]

According to the FBI files on the singer, Presley was even seen as a "definite danger to the security of the United States." His actions and motions were called "a strip-tease with clothes on" or "sexual self-gratification on stage." They were compared with "masturbation or riding a microphone." Some saw the singer as a sexual pervert, and psychologists feared that teenaged girls and boys could easily be "aroused to sexual indulgence and perversion by certain types of motions and hysteria—the type that was exhibited at the Presley show."[112] Presley would insist, however, that there was nothing vulgar about his stage act, saying: "Some people tap their feet, some people snap their fingers, and some people sway back and forth. I just sorta do ‘em all together, I guess."[113] In August 1956, a Florida judge called Presley a "savage" and threatened to arrest him if he shook his body while performing in Jacksonville. The judge declared that Presley's music was undermining the youth of America. Throughout the performance (which was filmed by police), he kept still as ordered, except for wiggling a finger in mockery at the ruling.[114] (Presley recalls this incident during the '68 Comeback Special.)

In 1957, despite Presley's demonstrable respect for "black" music and performers,[115] he faced accusations of racism. He was alleged to have said in Boston, Massachusetts: "The only thing Negro people can do for me is to buy my records and shine my shoes." A journalist at Jet magazine (run by and for African Americans) subsequently pursued Presley, and his acquaintances in Memphis, for any other admissions or anecdotes to back up the perception that the singer was racist. None was found, nor could any evidence be found of the date, location and persons involved regarding the alleged remark (Presley had never visited Boston). Presley himself was interviewed on the set of Jailhouse Rock where he denied saying, or ever wanting to make, such a racist remark.

His parents moved home in Memphis, but the singer lived there briefly. With increased concerns over privacy and security, Graceland was bought and renovated in 1957, a mansion with several acres of land. This was Presley's primary residence until his death.

Presley's record sales grew quickly throughout the late 1950s, with hits like "All Shook Up", "(Let me Be Your) Teddy Bear" and "Too Much".
And he could not write his own music? So what! There are plenty of singers that did not then or now write their own music. They are singers.

And as we are comparing him to Elvis Costello (a ridiculous idea IMO but carry regardless) what did Costello "invent"? To quote wiki again because it is readily available
Quote:

In 1954, Presley began his career as one of the first performers of rockabilly, an uptempo fusion of country and rhythm and blues with a strong back beat. His novel versions of existing songs, mixing "black" and "white" sounds, made him popular—and controversial[5][6][7]
Note the word "novel". Also Note the word "first". Wether you or I or any other individual likes it or not in the years to come Presley will be remembered for one of the hugest contributors to music in all of music's history. Costello will be but a footnote in comparison. And Elvis Costello is a smart enough individual to know that I suspect.

Those are all facts that I have presented and are excepted as historically true by just about all sources if you care to educate yourself on the subject. Do so as there are countless books that discuss the Presley cultural phenomenon of the mid to late 50's and they are great reading.


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