Top-50 All-time (Rough Draft) (albums, fan, Europe, American, career)

Frances · 08-06-2007, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

Chuck Berry and Jerry Lee Lewis were Rock N Roll pioneers. Why in the hell shouldn't they be above Zep?

I gotta agree with that, but you know, if it's his list........

boo boo · 08-06-2007, 03:15 AM

I wasn't talking about his. I was talking about the one I'm planning on making.

sleepy jack · 08-06-2007, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

I wasn't talking about his. Were was talking about the one I'm planning on making.

fixed >:[ youre not going solo until it fails miserably!

boo boo · 08-06-2007, 03:35 AM

I meant the seperate list I'll make before I fuse it with yours.

sleepy jack · 08-06-2007, 03:37 AM

rightright

Son of JayJamJah · 08-06-2007, 11:26 AM

boo boo

Put the super fanboy cape on my back. Regardless, Chuck Berry and Jerry Lee Lewis were Pioneers of Rock and Roll, but neither has stood the test of time very well. How many people did you know growing up who had any of their CD's? What they did was pave the way for future artists to take the music to a new level. I suppose you could debate their place as being along side or ahead of Zeppelin under circumstances, however if I am going be accused of recreating a list I can't stand idly by and let you roll off Rolling Stones Immortals list almost verbatim as a counterpoint to Zeppelin inclusion amongst the top 5 or 10.

I am a huge Velvet Underground fan, but they bombed during their existence. Warhol's ego alienated rock and roll fans and overshadowed the amazing groundbreaking music they were producing. It's was only years after when their sound was clearly starting to influence new bands that the finally got the recognition they deserve. Still however four albums and only two real memorable ones. Not sure I could justify them over Zeppelin, or the Who, Pink Floyd or Bob Dylan for that matter.

Buddy Holly may be at the top of this list had he The Big Bopper and Richie Valens not boarded that plane, however tragedy did strike. And while rock and roll teaches use that it's better to burn out then to fade away, such a limited discography prevents him from really being a top 25 candidate in my opinion.

I appreciate the way you argue your points, and while I disagree I feel your criticisms are valid and thoughtful.

ImLearning · 08-07-2007, 08:38 PM

where the hell is MJ... hes crazy, but hes an incredible talent

deff a top 5er

boo boo · 08-07-2007, 08:59 PM

Come to think of it, if we were to do rock AND pop. Putting Michael Jackson above Led Zeppelin would make sense. Especially if you're gonna make such a big whoop about record sales.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayJamJah

boo boo

Put the super fanboy cape on my back. Regardless, Chuck Berry and Jerry Lee Lewis were Pioneers of Rock and Roll, but neither has stood the test of time very well. How many people did you know growing up who had any of their CD's?

Grandma.

And their music has stood the test of time. Thats why both are still pop culture icons till' this day.

Quote:

What they did was pave the way for future artists to take the music to a new level.

Without them there would be No Beatles, No Rolling Stones, No Who, No Zep.
No nothing.

Quote:

I suppose you could debate their place as being along side or ahead of Zeppelin under circumstances, however if I am going be accused of recreating a list I can't stand idly by and let you roll off Rolling Stones Immortals list almost verbatim as a counterpoint to Zeppelin inclusion amongst the top 5 or 10.

Well I'm talking about greatness. And you still can't even make up your mind on what kind of list you're trying to make.

Also The Immortals list had Zep above Lewis. It was an ok list, the top 50 was good, but the bottom 50 just pissed me off, it was pretty biased and random. Having Eminem and AC/DC above Miles Davis is just lame. And of course Pink Floyd were completely screwed over. And for who? Nine Inch f*cking Nails. Give me a break.

Quote:

I am a huge Velvet Underground fan, but they bombed during their existence. Warhol's ego alienated rock and roll fans and overshadowed the amazing groundbreaking music they were producing. It's was only years after when their sound was clearly starting to influence new bands that the finally got the recognition they deserve. Still however four albums and only two real memorable ones. Not sure I could justify them over Zeppelin, or the Who, Pink Floyd or Bob Dylan for that matter.

I never said they should be above Bob Dylan.

And also the lack of mainstream success dosen't decrease their greatness. VU&N sold poorly, but just about everyone who bought it ended up starting a band of their own. Few bands inspired people like VU did at the time. Even if their albums aren't sellers, their influence is HUGE.

Quote:

Buddy Holly may be at the top of this list had he The Big Bopper and Richie Valens not boarded that plane, however tragedy did strike. And while rock and roll teaches use that it's better to burn out then to fade away, such a limited discography prevents him from really being a top 25 candidate in my opinion.

Not if such a short discography stands the test of time and still influences songwriters till this day.

Quote:

I appreciate the way you argue your points, and while I disagree I feel your criticisms are valid and thoughtful.

Thank ya.

Son of JayJamJah · 08-07-2007, 09:52 PM

I feel like this is an argument that can only be made from a biased perspective. Efforts to put criteria in place have proven to be a flawed premise as even the definition of each measure is subjective.

Therefore I'd like to scrap the Criteria and instead recommend people just make arguments for bands they believe are great based on the reasons they love the artist. I would suggest maybe making a top 50 list for the forum 6 months or a year from now. This place is inundated with lists right now and the diversity is only weakening each individually.

As for boo boo's comments
I don't disagree with anything you said, I just don;t think your points really address my reasoning for Zeppelin's place on the list. And Buddy Holly, Jerry Lee Lewis and Chuck Berry are not exactly on the tip of the average American's tongue when you ask about favorite musicians. I don't question their impact on other Musicians but that's only one criteria same as record sales, The groups at the top of my list do not come up short in any of the categories.

boo boo · 08-07-2007, 09:57 PM

311? What is their influence and impact?

08-06-2007, 11:26 AM	#256 (permalink)
Son of JayJamJah Occams Razor Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: End of the Earth Posts: 2,472	boo boo Put the super fanboy cape on my back. Regardless, Chuck Berry and Jerry Lee Lewis were Pioneers of Rock and Roll, but neither has stood the test of time very well. How many people did you know growing up who had any of their CD's? What they did was pave the way for future artists to take the music to a new level. I suppose you could debate their place as being along side or ahead of Zeppelin under circumstances, however if I am going be accused of recreating a list I can't stand idly by and let you roll off Rolling Stones Immortals list almost verbatim as a counterpoint to Zeppelin inclusion amongst the top 5 or 10. I am a huge Velvet Underground fan, but they bombed during their existence. Warhol's ego alienated rock and roll fans and overshadowed the amazing groundbreaking music they were producing. It's was only years after when their sound was clearly starting to influence new bands that the finally got the recognition they deserve. Still however four albums and only two real memorable ones. Not sure I could justify them over Zeppelin, or the Who, Pink Floyd or Bob Dylan for that matter. Buddy Holly may be at the top of this list had he The Big Bopper and Richie Valens not boarded that plane, however tragedy did strike. And while rock and roll teaches use that it's better to burn out then to fade away, such a limited discography prevents him from really being a top 25 candidate in my opinion. I appreciate the way you argue your points, and while I disagree I feel your criticisms are valid and thoughtful. Last edited by Son of JayJamJah; 08-06-2007 at 02:59 PM.

08-07-2007, 08:38 PM	#257 (permalink)
ImLearning Groupie Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 7	where the hell is MJ... hes crazy, but hes an incredible talent deff a top 5er

08-07-2007, 09:52 PM	#259 (permalink)
Son of JayJamJah Occams Razor Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: End of the Earth Posts: 2,472	I feel like this is an argument that can only be made from a biased perspective. Efforts to put criteria in place have proven to be a flawed premise as even the definition of each measure is subjective. Therefore I'd like to scrap the Criteria and instead recommend people just make arguments for bands they believe are great based on the reasons they love the artist. I would suggest maybe making a top 50 list for the forum 6 months or a year from now. This place is inundated with lists right now and the diversity is only weakening each individually. As for boo boo's comments I don't disagree with anything you said, I just don;t think your points really address my reasoning for Zeppelin's place on the list. And Buddy Holly, Jerry Lee Lewis and Chuck Berry are not exactly on the tip of the average American's tongue when you ask about favorite musicians. I don't question their impact on other Musicians but that's only one criteria same as record sales, The groups at the top of my list do not come up short in any of the categories.