Unpopular Music Opinions

The Batlord · 07-13-2019, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

Yeah I was taken aback by that, too but I let it go because he’s talking about putting forth a framework (I think)

I'm not putting them on the same level on a creative level. I'm saying that the Ramones debut album was massively important to punk and alternative rock in a way that is a milestone. And Metallica's debut is similarly important as a milestone in a way that hadn't been seen since the Ramones.

The Batlord · 07-13-2019, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

I have to take The Ramones out of your question to deal with seriously.

Was VH as important as Kill Em All? That depends on what you’re trying to measure.

I'm saying did Van Halen influence anything truly important and watershed in the way that the Ramones and Metallica did with their debuts?

**Frownland** · 07-13-2019, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

did Metallica fundamentally change the musical landscape or even contribute to something like that

putting them on a Ramones level is pretty insane

Even bands you don't like can be influential, believe it or not.

The Batlord · 07-13-2019, 04:27 PM

I'd say Joy Division were pretty ****ing influential and deserve a place at the table but the Smiths were part of what was already happening. But Metallica legit set a place at the table that every metal band at the time noticed and everything that happened after was changed as a result of their debut. Most certainly the bands in their area readily admit that Metallica showed them all how to do what they were all working towards. And metal in the 80s was quite possibly the biggest musical movement of that time.

OccultHawk · 07-13-2019, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug McClasky

I'm saying did Van Halen influence anything truly important and watershed in the way that Metallica did with their debut?

Still have to remove The Ramones despite your disclaimer.

Van Halen was great but the bands they inspired were not. So by that measure no.

OccultHawk · 07-13-2019, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

Smiths were massively important to indie rock in a way that was a milestone

etc

except bands like Smiths and Joy Division fundamentally altered popular Rock music in its entirety

Metallica not really?

You may not realize what an insanely vast and talented musical universe grew out of thrash.

OccultHawk · 07-13-2019, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

but yes also Metallica are complete garbage

But take that as it's own seperate unpopular opinion

Besides the first 3 I hate them too and they are by far the worst of the Big 4. But their influence is phenomenal.

OccultHawk · 07-13-2019, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

The Smiths influence on indie all the way up to the present is one of the biggest shadows I can think of since The Beatles

I agree. They carved a new space, bat.

OccultHawk · 07-13-2019, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

sure in their subgenre of a subgenre but so are a long list of bands in the time period given

the popularity of groups like Ramones and Joy Division changed the very concept of a rock band

The Ramones don’t have peers but yes I see that with Joy Division.

The Batlord · 07-13-2019, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

Still have to remove The Ramones despite your disclaimer.

Van Halen was great but the bands they inspired were not. So by that measure no.

I thought I did. Musically Metallica brought together what was happening at the time and did it in a way that no other band was prepared to do in such a forward thinking way but they did not reinvent the wheel that the Ramones did. Without Metallica I think 80s metal might have required perhaps two three or more bands doing what they did in perhaps one or two more years time and without their vision of seriousness I don't know that those bands in that time would have convinced enough people to care to solidify into the scene that evolved by the late 80s. I mean Master of Puppets sounds like metal taking itself seriously, but compare Kill Em All to anything by Judas Priest or Iron Maiden in 1983 and tell me that Metallica didn't have an undercurrent of unification for people who thought that metal could be anything other than goofy fun. Kill Em All was legit the end of the NWOBHM and all of the silly bull**** prog and AOR sensibilities still existing in metal at the time.