Political Message (lyrics, dance, punk, rap, great song)

sleepy jack · 01-18-2006, 09:48 PM

As i said earlier alot of crust/anarcho punk is politically driven. Contravene and Nausea being my favorites you should really check them out.

Trauma · 01-18-2006, 09:51 PM

I concur.

TheBig3 · 01-18-2006, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

I dislike political messages in music, because usually it's predictable, horribly biased, and never very unique. I don't mind it, just so long as it doesn't become more about the message than the music.

Personally, I prefer lyrics that are more introspective rather than, oh gosh the war is so bad blah blah blah.

What about Springsteens song "Devil's and Dust" which is a fictional introspection testimony from a solider in war.

Theres more than one way to approach a song, and while some songs come right out and say the usual stuff (sabbath "war pigs") this is a song that looks at it from a diffrent prespective.

Im sort of wondering what you think about songs like this.

jazzfromhell · 01-19-2006, 12:05 AM

In my opinion, songs can be as political as they want, blatantly or otherwise, but the key is to offer a solution to the problems they're talking about. Green Day can talk about how much Bush sucks all day and into the night, but it's not as if Billy Joe Armstrong would know what to do if we put him in the white house. And who would he suggest putting in there, anyway? Kerry? Why? That's the biggest problem I have with politically influenced music, people not knowing what they're talking about, and not offering any solutions.

On a side note, another "political" musician who annoys the **** out of me is John Mellencamp. If you guys like his music, fine, but he's always seemed like a really bland, untalented Springsteen rip-off to me. These days, he's apparently a big symbol for pro-democratic, anti-Bush rock music. He started pulling all this political bull**** at the Bridge School Benefit (if you don't know what it is, it's a concert Neil Young does to benefit a school his wife made for kids with cerebral palsy), not even close to being the right time or place. On top of that, the messages in his songs were no better than Green Day's, just a bunch of "Hey man, Bush is a mean, stupid old redneck" junk. **** that, worst act of the evening (to put that in perspective, Good Charlotte performed that night), and completely broke the mood. Sorry for the Mellencamp rant, I felt like it fit.

Big3, I agree that it's cool to see musicians approaching politics from a different perspective. One example (sort of) is John Coltrane's "Alabama", which he wrote as a companion piece to MLK's eulogy for the girls killed in Alabama, back in the 60's. It doesn't have any lyrics, but it's interesting how the mood of the music fits perfectly with the subject matter.

TheBig3 · 01-19-2006, 12:11 AM

To piggy back off your comments though, sometimes political messages aren't directly about politics.

Mellancamp's "Rain on the scarecrow" is about the loss of farmland in america's bread basket. Thats a song that paints a pitcutre of how things are, but only tlaks about the farmers, not the way politicians are ignoreing their needs and outsourcing jobs like famring. You're made awre of it, and thats rather political in itself.

Also, Fogerty's "Have you ever seen rain" which doens't come out to say anything directly, but has its foot in political motivation.

The tough thing is to ablance message and music. I like "American Idiot" because the music is pretty good, and has a great vocal melody.

jazzfromhell · 01-19-2006, 12:22 AM

Yeah, those are valid examples of well-handled political songwriting. In fact, that's probably the best kind, because instead of telling people what to think, they're (at least, the Mellencamp song, from what you're saying) presenting the situation and evidence, and allowing people to come to their own conclusions. Which is great, in a modern age when kids' minds are getting programmed by parents/tv/bands/whatever, at way to early of an age. Like I said, what I've got issues with are people not knowing what they're talking about, and just mindless, aimless hatred/whining that doesn't lead to any way out of the situation.

I also agree that it's completely fine to like a political song for reasons other than the political arguments.

Muzak Geek · 01-19-2006, 06:42 PM

I personally don't mind politics in music at all.. There are a lot of people (myself included) who listen for the music first, lyrics second. Just because I don't agree with everything Zach De la Rocha says (and I don't), doesn't mean that I don't think RATM make (er… made) great music.

I believe that music (or most art, for that matter) doesn't really dictate peoples' basic values or political thinking - It just reinforces it. If you agree with someone's lyrics, you're probably going to think the music is good… even if it really isn't; And if you don't agree with someone's lyrics, you may think the music sucks… even if it doesn't. Or, you may be like myself, and not really care all that much… as long as it sounds good to you.

~~bungalow~~ · 01-19-2006, 06:47 PM

Thank you for bringing this thread back.
I agree, many times if I hear a song, and I think that the lyrics are wack, I will probably think to myself

"This song really sucks"

This may not be true, but, lyrics are a very important part of a song. As I have said before, I really can't stand all of the "war is ghey blah blah" politics that wannabe punk bands spew all over the place. Political messages should be done tastefully and intelligently. BYOB, was a terrible song in my opinion. I really don't think that SOAD articualted their point well at all. RATM on the other hand can get their point across effectively and have the spine to stand up for things that may not be too popular to stand up for.

mosesandtherubberducky · 01-19-2006, 06:51 PM

^ At Loloapalooza they came out bare ass naked and stood there for 15 minutes or so protesting the mothers for censorship orginzation with guitar feeding back the whole time. Then they played.

Muzak Geek · 01-19-2006, 07:08 PM

I do prefer it when a band/artist articulates their political (or anti-political) views in an effective manner; Which is just one of the many reasons why I think Radiohead's "Hail to the Thief" was a great album - They were able to make an indirect political statement without directly spelling it out, and without letting it overpower their music… especially evident in a song like "2 + 2 = 5"

01-18-2006, 09:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
Trauma snickers Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: detroit Posts: 2,194	I concur. __________________ A mi no me importa nada Para mi la vida es un sueño

01-19-2006, 12:11 AM	#15 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	To piggy back off your comments though, sometimes political messages aren't directly about politics. Mellancamp's "Rain on the scarecrow" is about the loss of farmland in america's bread basket. Thats a song that paints a pitcutre of how things are, but only tlaks about the farmers, not the way politicians are ignoreing their needs and outsourcing jobs like famring. You're made awre of it, and thats rather political in itself. Also, Fogerty's "Have you ever seen rain" which doens't come out to say anything directly, but has its foot in political motivation. The tough thing is to ablance message and music. I like "American Idiot" because the music is pretty good, and has a great vocal melody. __________________ I've moved to a new address

01-19-2006, 06:42 PM	#17 (permalink)
Muzak Geek Music Addict Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Wake Forest, NC Posts: 87	I personally don't mind politics in music at all.. There are a lot of people (myself included) who listen for the music first, lyrics second. Just because I don't agree with everything Zach De la Rocha says (and I don't), doesn't mean that I don't think RATM make (er… made) great music. I believe that music (or most art, for that matter) doesn't really dictate peoples' basic values or political thinking - It just reinforces it. If you agree with someone's lyrics, you're probably going to think the music is good… even if it really isn't; And if you don't agree with someone's lyrics, you may think the music sucks… even if it doesn't. Or, you may be like myself, and not really care all that much… as long as it sounds good to you. __________________ Up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, Start… Just because we use cheats, doesn't mean we're not smart.

01-19-2006, 06:51 PM	#19 (permalink)
mosesandtherubberducky butt say x Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: so i read the question as "Where YOU live" which was kinda funny instead of "Where you live" Posts: 1,649	^ At Loloapalooza they came out bare ass naked and stood there for 15 minutes or so protesting the mothers for censorship orginzation with guitar feeding back the whole time. Then they played. __________________ Can I have a youtube video for a sig? There's a thing that says "Wrap [YOUTUBE] tags around selected text"

01-19-2006, 07:08 PM	#20 (permalink)
Muzak Geek Music Addict Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Wake Forest, NC Posts: 87	I do prefer it when a band/artist articulates their political (or anti-political) views in an effective manner; Which is just one of the many reasons why I think Radiohead's "Hail to the Thief" was a great album - They were able to make an indirect political statement without directly spelling it out, and without letting it overpower their music… especially evident in a song like "2 + 2 = 5" __________________ Up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, Start… Just because we use cheats, doesn't mean we're not smart.

01-19-2006, 12:05 AM	#14 (permalink)
jazzfromhell SHAKE! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: On the A train. Posts: 205	In my opinion, songs can be as political as they want, blatantly or otherwise, but the key is to offer a solution to the problems they're talking about. Green Day can talk about how much Bush sucks all day and into the night, but it's not as if Billy Joe Armstrong would know what to do if we put him in the white house. And who would he suggest putting in there, anyway? Kerry? Why? That's the biggest problem I have with politically influenced music, people not knowing what they're talking about, and not offering any solutions. On a side note, another "political" musician who annoys the ** out of me is John Mellencamp. If you guys like his music, fine, but he's always seemed like a really bland, untalented Springsteen rip-off to me. These days, he's apparently a big symbol for pro-democratic, anti-Bush rock music. He started pulling all this political bull at the Bridge School Benefit (if you don't know what it is, it's a concert Neil Young does to benefit a school his wife made for kids with cerebral palsy), not even close to being the right time or place. On top of that, the messages in his songs were no better than Green Day's, just a bunch of "Hey man, Bush is a mean, stupid old redneck" junk. ** that, worst act of the evening (to put that in perspective, Good Charlotte performed that night), and completely broke the mood. Sorry for the Mellencamp rant, I felt like it fit. Big3, I agree that it's cool to see musicians approaching politics from a different perspective. One example (sort of) is John Coltrane's "Alabama", which he wrote as a companion piece to MLK's eulogy for the girls killed in Alabama, back in the 60's. It doesn't have any lyrics, but it's interesting how the mood of the music fits perfectly with the subject matter.

01-19-2006, 12:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
jazzfromhell SHAKE! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: On the A train. Posts: 205	Yeah, those are valid examples of well-handled political songwriting. In fact, that's probably the best kind, because instead of telling people what to think, they're (at least, the Mellencamp song, from what you're saying) presenting the situation and evidence, and allowing people to come to their own conclusions. Which is great, in a modern age when kids' minds are getting programmed by parents/tv/bands/whatever, at way to early of an age. Like I said, what I've got issues with are people not knowing what they're talking about, and just mindless, aimless hatred/whining that doesn't lead to any way out of the situation. I also agree that it's completely fine to like a political song for reasons other than the political arguments.

01-19-2006, 06:47 PM	#18 (permalink)
~~bungalow~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Hot-lanta Posts: 3,140	Thank you for bringing this thread back. I agree, many times if I hear a song, and I think that the lyrics are wack, I will probably think to myself "This song really sucks" This may not be true, but, lyrics are a very important part of a song. As I have said before, I really can't stand all of the "war is ghey blah blah" politics that wannabe punk bands spew all over the place. Political messages should be done tastefully and intelligently. BYOB, was a terrible song in my opinion. I really don't think that SOAD articualted their point well at all. RATM on the other hand can get their point across effectively and have the spine to stand up for things that may not be too popular to stand up for.