Will Biden be another one term president?

**Frownland** · 12-13-2021, 09:13 AM

MLKJ would decry that kind of status quo moderacy.

Trollheart · 12-13-2021, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubber soul

You sound like we should be acting like one of those banana republics. Punishing the other side for being the other side has only resulted in revenge wars upon revenge wars. Yes, those involved in the insurrection should be brought to justice, but we also need to show mercy. Yes, the high profile offenders should do some real time, hopefully with some of the people they despise the most, but maybe the average dupe who got drawn into the mess should get a break. Maybe I'm being naive, but, maybe if we can all realize none of us are inherently evil (well, most of us, anyway), we can find a way to the light at the end of the tunnel.

I mean there has to be a reason why Martin Luther King prevailed in history and Adolf Hitler didn't, right?

I vehemently do not agree. Yes you can have moderation but the time comes when you need to bring the hammer down. All this wishy-washy "on your way don't be a bad boy/girl again" is bull****. So what's the lesson learned? Take up arms, break into a center of government and try to depose the lawfully elected administration and... what? We'll ask you to think about being more respectful next time? Banana republic or not, there's a lot to be said for a show of force and a don't **** with us attitude when you come up against blank hatred and mindless, continuing violence like this. What was it Gandalf said? "The burned hand teaches best. After that, advice about fire goes to the heart." Think this would be the reaction in Russia?

rubber soul · 12-13-2021, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

I vehemently do not agree. Yes you can have moderation but the time comes when you need to bring the hammer down. All this wishy-washy "on your way don't be a bad boy/girl again" is bull****. So what's the lesson learned? Take up arms, break into a center of government and try to depose the lawfully elected administration and... what? We'll ask you to think about being more respectful next time? Banana republic or not, there's a lot to be said for a show of force and a don't **** with us attitude when you come up against blank hatred and mindless, continuing violence like this. What was it Gandalf said? "The burned hand teaches best. After that, advice about fire goes to the heart." Think this would be the reaction in Russia?

And look what a history of violence has done for them.

Trollheart · 12-13-2021, 02:21 PM

All I'm saying is sometimes the teacher needs to do more than smile and say "now kids" to quiet down the class. Make an example. One, two, three maybe proper decent BIG sentences. Send some of these ****s who "think they did nothing wrong" down to show them, and the sheep that followed them, that they did. Put the ****ing boot in. Doesn't have to become a police state but MAKE A ****ING EXAMPLE. Your problem seems to be the same as those in power: afraid to really lay down the law for fear of being called fascists, when you KNOW the other side will do exactly this if they get into power. Is it better to be respected or feared? Good question.

FYI, a history of violence? Revolution certainly (didn't the US have something similar?) but what do you think are the chances of armed insurrectionists storming the Kremlin and then bragging about it on social media? I'm not saying they do everything right, but sometimes you have to admit they know when to push back hard. America, under Biden, does not, or fears to, and the Right exploit that for all it's worth.

Answer me this: do you think the current response (if you can call it that) is any sort of deterrent towards this happening again? Answers on a bloodstained postcard...

rubber soul · 12-13-2021, 03:28 PM

Okay, answer me this. Let's say Biden does get medieval on all the Trumpsters. How do you think they'll react? Do you think they'll just sit there and say "Gee, Mr. President, I'm sorry."? No, I think it will just put us one step closer to the second American Civil War.

I live forty miles from Washington and I can tell you first hand, the problem isn't Biden or Harris or even Trump. The problem is us. If I were a European, I wouldn't trust an American any farther than I could throw him. We've taken our "democracy" for granted that I don't think we even know what it means anymore. We demand instant gratification from our leaders and when we don't get it, we demand someone else. We're not a patient people. If someone says he will put us back to work, we expect to get a job the day after his inauguration. We're not a people that thinks in the long term. It's a big reason why we have to deal with global warming today for example, because we didn't want to make the sacrifices when we were warned twenty years ago.

Anyhow, there are only two ways to stop the madness and either of them are going to end in a lot of deaths. One is your solution, beget violence with violence and get your revenge. I think world history has shown that it isn't all it's cracked up to me. I mean like, how's the weather in Israel or Iran where and eye for an eye is very vogue?

The other way is the way of passive resistance. Yes, that too will end in a lot of deaths, but the hope here being that it shocks the world enough that the oppressors will be shrunk down to size. That has worked in India and even in the United States during the civil rights movement. If I have to go down, that's the way I'd prefer to go. To fight with love, not hate.

Anyway, I'm rambling. I guess what I'm trying to say is yes, we need to have justice but it can't be clouded by hate. Otherwise, we're just as low as the mob that stormed the Capitol.

**Frownland** · 12-13-2021, 03:35 PM

Ja let's approach American fascism with centrist half-measures that largely benefit the aggressors. That's worked pretty well so far.

rubber soul · 12-13-2021, 03:55 PM

Or we can start World War III and destroy everyone. I'm sure that will satisfy everybody.

The Batlord · 12-13-2021, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubber soul

Okay, answer me this. Let's say Biden does get medieval on all the Trumpsters. How do you think they'll react? Do you think they'll just sit there and say "Gee, Mr. President, I'm sorry."? No, I think it will just put us one step closer to the second American Civil War.

I live forty miles from Washington and I can tell you first hand, the problem isn't Biden or Harris or even Trump. The problem is us. If I were a European, I wouldn't trust an American any farther than I could throw him. We've taken our "democracy" for granted that I don't think we even know what it means anymore. We demand instant gratification from our leaders and when we don't get it, we demand someone else. We're not a patient people. If someone says he will put us back to work, we expect to get a job the day after his inauguration. We're not a people that thinks in the long term. It's a big reason why we have to deal with global warming today for example, because we didn't want to make the sacrifices when we were warned twenty years ago.

Anyhow, there are only two ways to stop the madness and either of them are going to end in a lot of deaths. One is your solution, beget violence with violence and get your revenge. I think world history has shown that it isn't all it's cracked up to me. I mean like, how's the weather in Israel or Iran where and eye for an eye is very vogue?

The other way is the way of passive resistance. Yes, that too will end in a lot of deaths, but the hope here being that it shocks the world enough that the oppressors will be shrunk down to size. That has worked in India and even in the United States during the civil rights movement. If I have to go down, that's the way I'd prefer to go. To fight with love, not hate.

Anyway, I'm rambling. I guess what I'm trying to say is yes, we need to have justice but it can't be clouded by hate. Otherwise, we're just as low as the mob that stormed the Capitol.

This is brain dead nonsense. The problem with America isn't our corrupt, imperialist structures, it's that Americans are a naughty people. And the bit about passive resistance just makes it sound like you got all your ideas about how to act from the people who benefit from you being passive. All you colonized peoples who took up arms to throw the British, French, Americans, etc out of their countries were acting like savages and you should have just gone on a hunger strike.

Jan 6 wasn't wrong cause it's wrong to do violence, it was wrong cause of the reasons they did it. Nancy Pelosi should get ****ing zip tied. Just not by malding fascists.

rubber soul · 12-13-2021, 04:01 PM

So that means you and Frown are going to take up arms and go fight the bad guys up in rural Michigan, right?

Anyway, it isn't that we're a naughty people (though some of us are, I'm sure

). It's that we're a selfish people that tend to put our own needs over the needs of others. It's the byproduct of being the richest country in the world. I said before that we're basically an oligarchy that can easily make the majority of Americans believe anything they want us to believe.

Anyway, I'm not any better than you guys. I'm just an armchair liberal spouting off on my computer.

But you guys are a lot younger and you're going to have to figure out the best way to stop the right wing madness. Maybe there will have to be a violent revolution; I'm hoping it won't come to that. I'm hoping there can be a way to get along with each other while squelching the voices of hate at the same time. That won't be easy.

But an old man can dream.

Trollheart · 12-13-2021, 04:05 PM

What the hell is wrong with you? I'm not talking full-on fasicsm, blood in the streets, abandoning the rule of law, but Biden has gone in the opposite direction. How many who took part in the insurrection attempt have got more than a year in jail? How many have got anything close to a year? You don't have to start ****ing World War III (panicky rhetoric there) to properly punish offenders against the law. It was sedition. It was treason. It was an armed uprising orchestrated by the Right and by neo-Nazi groups. And the solution is just to let them cool their heels for a few weeks/months and then set them free? Everyone? Nobody is going to serve any sort of proper time?

Republicans may respect little, but strength is one thing they do respect. Sure, if the Dems come on strong they'll whine and moan and use it to try to take back the senate and the House, and they'll NEVER respect the other party. But do you think the lion in the jungle got his reputation by pushing over antelopes or whatever the **** gently? Do you think any enemy or opponent takes the other side seriously if they don't do anything serious? You have to take a stand, say "you broke the law and now you're going to pay". That doesn't bring civilisation or democracy crashing down; in fact, NOT doing it is going to contribute more to its fall than putting the boot in.

You're making a case that there's only two options: go soft and maintain some sort of peace or go hard and kick off a war. There's a middle ground where you show your enemies - and let's be clear, these people are the enemies of your democracy - that they can't **** with you, that you're not afraid to deal with them. In not doing so, you lose any credibility, respect, or, dammit , fear you might have had among them. You show you're weak and indecisive, scared of blowback and they will **** you as soon as they get the chance. They won't thank you for being nice to them, they'll just call you a pussy.

Not a lion.

View Poll Results: Will Biden win in 2024?
Yes	5	38.46%
No, he will lose in the general election	1	7.69%
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12-13-2021, 09:13 AM	#41 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	MLKJ would decry that kind of status quo moderacy. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x

12-13-2021, 02:21 PM	#44 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	All I'm saying is sometimes the teacher needs to do more than smile and say "now kids" to quiet down the class. Make an example. One, two, three maybe proper decent BIG sentences. Send some of these **s who "think they did nothing wrong" down to show them, and the sheep that followed them, that they did. Put the ing boot in. Doesn't have to become a police state but MAKE A *ING EXAMPLE. Your problem seems to be the same as those in power: afraid to really lay down the law for fear of being called fascists, when you KNOW the other side will do exactly this if they get into power. Is it better to be respected or feared? Good question. FYI, a history of violence? Revolution certainly (didn't the US have something similar?) but what do you think are the chances of armed insurrectionists storming the Kremlin and then bragging about it on social media? I'm not saying they do everything right, but sometimes you have to admit they know when to push back hard. America, under Biden, does not, or fears to, and the Right exploit that for all it's worth. Answer me this: do you think the current response (if you can call it that) is any sort of deterrent towards this happening again? Answers on a bloodstained postcard... __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018*

12-13-2021, 03:35 PM	#46 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	Ja let's approach American fascism with centrist half-measures that largely benefit the aggressors. That's worked pretty well so far. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x

12-13-2021, 04:05 PM	#50 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	What the hell is wrong with you? I'm not talking full-on fasicsm, blood in the streets, abandoning the rule of law, but Biden has gone in the opposite direction. How many who took part in the insurrection attempt have got more than a year in jail? How many have got anything close to a year? You don't have to start **ing World War III (panicky rhetoric there) to properly punish offenders against the law. It was sedition. It was treason. It was an armed uprising orchestrated by the Right and by neo-Nazi groups. And the solution is just to let them cool their heels for a few weeks/months and then set them free? Everyone? Nobody is going to serve any sort of proper time? Republicans may respect little, but strength is one thing they do respect. Sure, if the Dems come on strong they'll whine and moan and use it to try to take back the senate and the House, and they'll NEVER respect the other party. But do you think the lion in the jungle got his reputation by pushing over antelopes or whatever the gently? Do you think any enemy or opponent takes the other side seriously if they don't do anything serious? You have to take a stand, say "you broke the law and now you're going to pay". That doesn't bring civilisation or democracy crashing down; in fact, NOT doing it is going to contribute more to its fall than putting the boot in. You're making a case that there's only two options: go soft and maintain some sort of peace or go hard and kick off a war. There's a middle ground where you show your enemies - and let's be clear, these people are the enemies of your democracy - that they can't with you, that you're not afraid to deal with them. In not doing so, you lose any credibility, respect, or, dammit , fear you might have had among them. You show you're weak and indecisive, scared of blowback and they will ** you as soon as they get the chance. They won't thank you for being nice to them, they'll just call you a pussy. Not a lion. __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018