2020 US Election Thread

[Lucem Ferre]

Originally Posted by Anteater

Eh, nobody held a gun to her head over at The Daily Beast when she gave that interview. She could have said whatever she wanted and they would have happily published it.

Gag order. Do you not know what a gag order is?

[The Batlord]

He probably stroked her an extra check in the divorce to sign an NDA or something and now she can be sued for honesty.

[Lucem Ferre]

It was possibly genuine and she's just downplaying what happened. I doubt that, personally, but still.

[Anteater]

Originally Posted by Lucem Ferre

It was possibly genuine and she's just downplaying what happened. I doubt that, personally, but still.

Or maybe oranges can't be grapists.

[Lisnaholic]

Originally Posted by Exo

I had a dude text me and ask if I was supporting the Democratic party this election. I told him flat out that Biden is a creep and I'm reluctantly voting for him because of how incompetent and unstable our current Prez is. He understood. Even the democrats are like "Well, sh*t, I guess we're stuck with the creepy old guy instead of Warren or Sanders." too.

This seems like a sensible policy to me. Biden is not a saint, but an election is about who to vote for, not who to venerate.

A vote for Biden is going to help stop Trump, who has, among his achievements and policies:-
- been impeached for trying to trade favours with Ukraine
- denied climate change and pulled out of the only global accord to address the problem
- seperated kids from their parents without the documentation/system to reunite them
- corrupted the DOJ by "activating Bill Barr"
- corrupted the CDC, tampering with stats and drawing on maps to promote his unscientific ideas

It's a long list, but ends with that small matter of lying about covid, abdicating from leading a federal response and causing the death of thousands of Americans. Is that any longer in dispute? He's caused the death of literally thousands of US citizens.

Given those circumstances, I find it difficult to understand a policy of not voting to block Trump. As one anti-Trumper puts it, given how contentious the election results are likely to be, the Dem vote needs to be "to big to rig" or the US may find itself with another 4 years under Trump.

[Lucem Ferre]

Originally Posted by Anteater

Or maybe oranges can't be grapists.

He is a peach though.

[OccultHawk]

the US may find itself with another 4 years under Trump

*Looks at Biden. Feels the lost dreams of a living wage being the minimum wage, Medicare for All, serious attempts to provide people with real food and housing, prison reform, status quo immigration policy reform, back to war foreign policy, no serious new green deal, same ole gun bs, and shrugs*

[Lisnaholic]

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

*Looks at Biden. Feels the lost dreams of a living wage being the minimum wage, Medicare for All, serious attempts to provide people with real food and housing, prison reform, status quo immigration policy reform, back to war foreign policy, no serious new green deal, same ole gun bs, and shrugs*

Of course I'm an outsider to US politics and my knowledge of past administrations is pretty scant, though I do remember Obama making a bitter speech about how his gun control bill had been defeated in the Senate. The Obama/Biden admin had its hands tied by GOP control of House and Senate, didn't it?

The path of progress is awash with lost dreams, but I don't see the situation in the US as hopeless. What I see are the Dems, believing in science, racial inclusiveness and climate change as a real threat.

What I see from the GOP is a very real slide towards autocracy. They have already declared that their only policy plank is to support Trump in whatever he chooses to do, and what he chooses to do is:-
i) declare in advance that his victory is the only election result he will accept as valid.
ii) turn government departments like the DOJ, CDC etc into tools that promote his agenda rather than fulfill the trust of the American people.
iii) appoint a guy intent on hobbling the USPS so that, again, it serves his agenda of voter repression rather than serving the American people

It's hardly an exaggeration to say that American democracy is being dismantled before our eyes. The institutions that tax dollars pay for are less and less serving as checks and balances; one by one they are being co-opted to keep one man in power.

Four years ago, Trump lost the popular vote and maybe that's why, on the streets, there have been environmental protests hoping for a party that, at a minimum, ackowledges that there is a rising problem of extreme weather events. Those BLM protesters were also hoping to see some kind of change and would presumably welcome a bit of black representation in the person of Kamala Harris as vice pres - surely an improvement on the odious Mike Pence.

Even if we can't believe in the full-on dreams of the environmentalists and BLMers, for their sakes, isn't it worth voting to help those dreams survive, to make a Dem victory "to big to rig" ? If I was an American, I think I'd vote Dem, if only for the satisfaction of sticking it to Mike Pence and seeing the last of his sanctimonious, hypocritical, fawning face leering behind Trump at every news briefing.

[Lisnaholic]

Here's another consideration: Trump, Barr and others are very adept at spinning an ambivalent result into a victory: Mueller's confusing conclusion becomes exhonoration; the Senate acquittal invalidates the House impeachment. My guess is that, as the incumbent Pres, Trump will soon be declaring all non-votes to be tacit approval of his four years so far. I wouldn't be surprised if, in the post-election propaganda war, Trump discretely adds non-votes into his popular-vote tally, to bolster his case for a mandate. Non-voters may end up like Trump's historically large inauguration crowd: invisible, and yet somehow lending their support.

[OccultHawk]

A vision isn’t nothing and the Biden camp has a much better vision. Unfortunately, I believe their path will also lead the other way. Trumpism is a quick bottoming out and it’s true there’s no guarantee of ever seeing light again. But Bidenism is an entrenched slow and steady train to the same old same old except environmentalism which is fast tracking itself into disaster and Biden will continue to enable the profiteers, even as he maybe even believes the different tune he’s singing. And that old school Americana doesn’t advertise its insanity like Trump does. It flies under the radar, perhaps making it even more insidious.

Where you and I will probably never meet is at my staunch and dogmatic stance that civil rights and sane environmental policies are impossible under capitalism. We will lose playing whack a mole with social, environmental, and economic justice. There’s no centrist position to work with. Destroy the planet in twenty years instead of ten? Maybe I’m insane not to take the extra decade but it’s just too much blood on my hands. I’m very reluctant to be a part of a problem. Even if it’s a lesser one.