White Shaming

WWWP · 05-21-2018, 04:14 PM

Unless the owner of the franchise instructed the manager to follow black customers, or follows every black person, then it's not systemic and therefore not racism, but rather prejudiced behavior.

The second hypothetical doesn't even make sense nor does it illustrate your own point lol.

And how are you going to bring truth into a battle of semantics.

~~MicShazam~~ · 05-21-2018, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls

Again, no. You dont have any information.

Suppose I told you the manager wasn't even following the guy but was instead blocking the aisles at the end of the night and ran into them a few times? Or that the store follows random people as part of a pre-emptive security plan? Both scenarios happen in real life.

And for the second case, the family is 100% Ugandian(?) and would like to continue the trend. It's nothing more than selfish parenting and pride.

The correct answer is always I DONT KNOW, unless you know. You don't get to stumble into a scenario with 0 context or information and make assumptions about truth.

Well, strictly speaking, if I'm to take your scenario that literally, yeah. But what's the point? I might have missed the origins of this particular exercise and therefore also what it is you're getting at.

So let me modify what I said before and say that both scenarios look a hell of a lot like racist motivations are at play, but it could be some other weird reason. Like the black guy who walks into a store happens to also wear a t-shirt saying "shoplifting is fun!".

grindy · 05-21-2018, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolverinewolfweiselpigeon

Unless the owner of the franchise instructed the manager to follow black customers, or follows every black person, then it's not systemic and therefore not racism, but rather prejudiced behavior.

The second hypothetical doesn't even make sense nor does it illustrate your own point lol.

And how are you going to bring truth into a battle of semantics.

Are there similar semantic constructs around sexism and homophobia as well?

~~MicShazam~~ · 05-21-2018, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolverinewolfweiselpigeon

then it's not systemic and therefore not racism,

****, I didn't realize you really meant it. Why even have the phrase "systemic racism" then, if all racism is systemic by default.

DwnWthVwls · 05-21-2018, 04:21 PM

First, off there are no semantics here...

You claimed: "You don't think you could identify racism or prejudice without someone spelling out their intentions? That's silly."

I gave you scenarios, and you proceeded to identify each persons intention (which is a truth claim). The point of my questioning was to demonstrate that it's not simple to distinguish between racism and prejudice. I don't know what line of reasoning you have to think otherwise. You could try explaining instead of simply disagreeing.

and racism doesn't need to be systemic to exist.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolverinewolfweiselpigeon

The second hypothetical doesn't even make sense nor does it illustrate your own point lol.

It demonstrates an action which may appear to be racist or prejudice could be completely innocent. That's pretty much exactly my point, you don't know.

~~MicShazam~~ · 05-21-2018, 04:22 PM

Ah, now I get what this whole thing is about. Yeah, you'd have to know on what basis someone is judged to be able to recognize it as, for example, racism.

WWWP · 05-21-2018, 04:24 PM

Because the commonly understood definition of racism is outdated and wrong, and implies that racism goes in all directions. While prejudice is a symptom of racism, it's not the same thing so it's important to make that distinction.

~~MicShazam~~ · 05-21-2018, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolverinewolfweiselpigeon

Because the commonly understood definition of racism is outdated and wrong, and implies that racism goes in all directions. While prejudice is a symptom of racism, it's not the same thing so it's important to make that distinction.

Racism does absolutely go in all directions. Depending on when and where; some directions more than others.

DwnWthVwls · 05-21-2018, 04:26 PM

Racism does go in all directions. I'd like to hear your reasoning otherwise.

How does a black person hating a white person because they are white not count as racism?

Editted: to be less jerky.

WWWP · 05-21-2018, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grindy

Are there similar semantic constructs around sexism and homophobia as well?

Not that I can think of, but there are certainly misunderstandings within those topics not unlike the racism vs prejudice issue. F.ex concepts of privilege.

05-21-2018, 04:22 PM	#456 (permalink)
~~MicShazam~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Aalborg Posts: 7,634	Ah, now I get what this whole thing is about. Yeah, you'd have to know on what basis someone is judged to be able to recognize it as, for example, racism.