They or Them pronouns

Mindy · 01-13-2018, 04:18 PM

~~Cuthbert~~ · 01-13-2018, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindfulness

They have an interesting hairline.

WWWP · 01-13-2018, 04:20 PM

Trollheart · 01-13-2018, 04:21 PM

It's just polite. And yes, it's used all the time. "John said he was going to pick up his friend, they live over beyond the railway station" etc.

You simply can't call someone "it". It refers to objects, which is why sometimes objects that mean a lot to certain people get personalised, like ships being called "she". Think about how you would like it if someone called you "it". I think the only acceptable time for using that is when there's a newborn baby being discussed and nobody knows what sex it is: "She had a baby. What did she have? I don't know, but at least it's healthy and well."

Oriphiel · 01-13-2018, 04:43 PM

Here's another example, Blank:

Mindfulness and I had heard the rumors of The Occulthawk, the shadowed archer that had struck down any travelers foolish enough to venture too close to the Glades of Elphenor. An ageless, sexless being shrouded in formless MicShazam-Scale armor, they had long since carved their way into legend. Yet, it wasn't until the dreaded assassin appeared before our caravan that we truly believed the stories. And by then, it was far too late.

Gliding effortlessly through the treetops, peering at us through the worn bandages across their face, the sound of a bow string snapped out as the OccultHawk stalked us, dodging our barrage of magicks with a flash of amusement in their eyes. In spite of all the hours we had spent training under the masters of Lisnahol, we were little more than deer in the eyes of the hunter.

The first arrow sank heavily into Mindfulness's chest, piercing him precisely between the plates of his armor. "Damn," he muttered breathlessly as he tumbled from his Aloysian mare, the poison on the arrowtip already infecting him through his bloodstream.

As the sound of another arrow being let loose cracked through the forest, I pulled up the strongest ward that I could muster, halting the projectile merely an inch from my face. Though I had never quite been able to create a proper ward back in the temple, it seemed that the heat of true combat had forced the proficiency out of me.

Casting the arrow aside, I fired a bolt of searing light at The OccultHawk. Though at first the light bounced harmlessly off of a treetop near the assassin, causing them to let out a dry and sexless laugh, the bolt soon revealed its true purpose in a blinding explosion, taking hold of the archer's bow and casting it away.

Though effective, the spell had drained me of power. Having lost their main weapon, The OccultHawk looked down at me for a moment, appraising me. I don't doubt that they could have finished me then, simply falling from the treetops with daggers steeled, landing before me and cutting me down with an effort quite routine to such an experienced killer. And yet, they faltered. Perhaps out of caution, fearing my magicks, though I wouldn't presume to be so bold as to say that such a fear was warranted. My mind raced as our eyes locked.

The silence of the lifeless forest was broken by a wet sound, a sort of gurgling, as my comrade struggled in vain to return to his feet, blood flowing freely from his mouth. As I glanced at him, he looked back at me with the eyes of a man who knew that death was not long to become his acquaintance. With bloody teeth, he gave me a weak smile. "They got me," he laughed, as if he could hardly believe his rotten luck. He looked down at the arrow protruding from him, almost in admiration. "Good shot," he said, looking back at me and smiling once more. "Damn good..." He fell back to the ground, his eyes quickly losing their light.

GunmouthGrace · 01-13-2018, 05:01 PM

.

Lisnaholic · 01-13-2018, 05:15 PM

Yep, especially in conversation, we use They/Them/Their even when we are refering to only one person. Here's a couple more examples of how we do it:-

"Someone left their cellphone on the table." It's clearly one person but we never say "his or her cellphone" and we even more neverly say "its cellphone."

Person A: "Hey, there's a person at the door who wants to speak to you!"
Person B: "Whoever it is, can you tell them to wait. I'm just finishing a post on MB."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______

Another option, which is becoming less and less politically correct, is to just assume that it's a man:-

"I don't know who designed this building, but he did a good job."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________

Some of the examples posted seem to be mixing up another use of "They", which is when, grammatically, we need a subject for a verb, but we don't know or don't really care who the subject is. We say it without even thinking about whether it's a single or plural subject, e.g:-

"Hey! They've mended the hole in the road!" (If we think about it, probably plural.)
"I went to the shop and they gave me the wrong change." (If we think about it, probably single.)

Isbjørn · 01-13-2018, 05:18 PM

"They/them" as a singular, third-person, gender neutral pronoun is grammatically acceptable and has been in use for centuries

Oriphiel · 01-13-2018, 05:19 PM

Hey Blank, do you want some more examples?

Machine · 01-13-2018, 05:23 PM

They or them is only used in the singular when the subject is unknown or unidentified, to say they or them with an identified subject is retarded and there's honestly no need.

01-13-2018, 04:18 PM	#11 (permalink)
Mindy ask me about cosmology Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Milky Way Galaxy Posts: 9,045	__________________ https://www.instagram.com/shhons_meme_agency

01-13-2018, 04:21 PM	#14 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,994	It's just polite. And yes, it's used all the time. "John said he was going to pick up his friend, they live over beyond the railway station" etc. You simply can't call someone "it". It refers to objects, which is why sometimes objects that mean a lot to certain people get personalised, like ships being called "she". Think about how you would like it if someone called you "it". I think the only acceptable time for using that is when there's a newborn baby being discussed and nobody knows what sex it is: "She had a baby. What did she have? I don't know, but at least it's healthy and well." __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

01-13-2018, 04:43 PM	#15 (permalink)
Oriphiel Ask me how! Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: The States Posts: 5,354	Here's another example, Blank: Mindfulness and I had heard the rumors of The Occulthawk, the shadowed archer that had struck down any travelers foolish enough to venture too close to the Glades of Elphenor. An ageless, sexless being shrouded in formless MicShazam-Scale armor, they had long since carved their way into legend. Yet, it wasn't until the dreaded assassin appeared before our caravan that we truly believed the stories. And by then, it was far too late. Gliding effortlessly through the treetops, peering at us through the worn bandages across their face, the sound of a bow string snapped out as the OccultHawk stalked us, dodging our barrage of magicks with a flash of amusement in their eyes. In spite of all the hours we had spent training under the masters of Lisnahol, we were little more than deer in the eyes of the hunter. The first arrow sank heavily into Mindfulness's chest, piercing him precisely between the plates of his armor. "Damn," he muttered breathlessly as he tumbled from his Aloysian mare, the poison on the arrowtip already infecting him through his bloodstream. As the sound of another arrow being let loose cracked through the forest, I pulled up the strongest ward that I could muster, halting the projectile merely an inch from my face. Though I had never quite been able to create a proper ward back in the temple, it seemed that the heat of true combat had forced the proficiency out of me. Casting the arrow aside, I fired a bolt of searing light at The OccultHawk. Though at first the light bounced harmlessly off of a treetop near the assassin, causing them to let out a dry and sexless laugh, the bolt soon revealed its true purpose in a blinding explosion, taking hold of the archer's bow and casting it away. Though effective, the spell had drained me of power. Having lost their main weapon, The OccultHawk looked down at me for a moment, appraising me. I don't doubt that they could have finished me then, simply falling from the treetops with daggers steeled, landing before me and cutting me down with an effort quite routine to such an experienced killer. And yet, they faltered. Perhaps out of caution, fearing my magicks, though I wouldn't presume to be so bold as to say that such a fear was warranted. My mind raced as our eyes locked. The silence of the lifeless forest was broken by a wet sound, a sort of gurgling, as my comrade struggled in vain to return to his feet, blood flowing freely from his mouth. As I glanced at him, he looked back at me with the eyes of a man who knew that death was not long to become his acquaintance. With bloody teeth, he gave me a weak smile. "They got me," he laughed, as if he could hardly believe his rotten luck. He looked down at the arrow protruding from him, almost in admiration. "Good shot," he said, looking back at me and smiling once more. "Damn good..." He fell back to the ground, his eyes quickly losing their light. __________________ ---------------------- \|---Mic's Albums---\| ---------------------- ----------------------------- \|---Deafbox Industries---\| -----------------------------

01-13-2018, 05:01 PM	#16 (permalink)
GunmouthGrace blah Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Earth Posts: 327	. Last edited by GunmouthGrace; 07-19-2022 at 08:23 PM.

01-13-2018, 05:15 PM	#17 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	Yep, especially in conversation, we use They/Them/Their even when we are refering to only one person. Here's a couple more examples of how we do it:- "Someone left their cellphone on the table." It's clearly one person but we never say "his or her cellphone" and we even more neverly say "its cellphone." Person A: "Hey, there's a person at the door who wants to speak to you!" Person B: "Whoever it is, can you tell them to wait. I'm just finishing a post on MB." __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______ Another option, which is becoming less and less politically correct, is to just assume that it's a man:- "I don't know who designed this building, but he did a good job." __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________ Some of the examples posted seem to be mixing up another use of "They", which is when, grammatically, we need a subject for a verb, but we don't know or don't really care who the subject is. We say it without even thinking about whether it's a single or plural subject, e.g:- "Hey! They've mended the hole in the road!" (If we think about it, probably plural.) "I went to the shop and they gave me the wrong change." (If we think about it, probably single.) __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953 Last edited by Lisnaholic; 01-13-2018 at 05:40 PM.

01-13-2018, 05:18 PM	#18 (permalink)
Isbjørn cooler commie than elph Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: In a hole, help Posts: 2,811	"They/them" as a singular, third-person, gender neutral pronoun is grammatically acceptable and has been in use for centuries __________________ fast(ml) Hear me play the guitar Look, mom! I got a journal

01-13-2018, 05:19 PM	#19 (permalink)
Oriphiel Ask me how! Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: The States Posts: 5,354	Hey Blank, do you want some more examples? __________________ ---------------------- \|---Mic's Albums---\| ---------------------- ----------------------------- \|---Deafbox Industries---\| -----------------------------

01-13-2018, 05:23 PM	#20 (permalink)
Machine moon lake inc. Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Detroit Posts: 2,125	They or them is only used in the singular when the subject is unknown or unidentified, to say they or them with an identified subject is retarded and there's honestly no need. __________________ boost my ego listen to me stroke my delay pedal ever wanted to hear death grips songs... but they're acoustic? me neither.