Political Discussions for "Adults"

Lucem Ferre · 08-09-2019, 06:31 AM

Cause he's not going to outright say it.

DwnWthVwls · 08-09-2019, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

I saw that interview. Saying that make up plays on some obvious biological and sexual cues isn't telling men they are entitled to rape women. I agree it wasn't his best quote and he should know people are going to read into anything he says beyond what he means but I think your interpretation lacks the same kind of nuance you're accusing me of lacking. You just take the worst possible interpretation and run with it.

Which is what interviews like that are really designed to do... Which is why they took an hour of footage and edited it down to 7 minutes.

Not entitled to rape but it was a lame attempt to justify sexual harassment, catcalling, etc

What is it that you think he means?

OccultHawk · 08-09-2019, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

I saw that interview. Saying that make up plays on some obvious biological and sexual cues isn't telling men they are entitled to rape women. I agree it wasn't his best quote and he should know people are going to read into anything he says beyond what he means but I think your interpretation lacks the same kind of nuance you're accusing me of lacking. You just take the worst possible interpretation and run with it.

Which is what interviews like that are really designed to do... Which is why they took an hour of footage and edited it down to 7 minutes.

Can you dig up the link?

Anteater · 08-09-2019, 07:00 AM

My problem with Peterson is that cultural Marxism doesn't really mean anything. It's a weird umbrella term he throws everything and the kitchen sink under when what he's really railing against is intersectionality.

~~jwb~~ · 08-09-2019, 07:01 AM

@Lucem I've heard him talk specifically about incels and he's said the opposite. That it's a man's own fault if women don't find them attractive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls

Not entitled to rape but it was a lame attempt to justify sexual harassment, catcalling, etc

What is it that you think he means?

I don't think he was defending any of that. He was basically trying to inject some nuance into the discussion over what is acceptable forms of sexuality in the workplace. You can accuse him of being a prude, but not of advocating any sort of harassment.

~~jwb~~ · 08-09-2019, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

Can you dig up the link?

I'm at work... Maybe later. I think it was a Vox interview

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anteater

My problem with Peterson is that cultural Marxism doesn't really mean anything. It's a weird umbrella term he throws everything and the kitchen sink under when what he's really railing against is intersectionality.

Zizek called him out on that in their debate. It was the only strong moment Zizek had in the debate. Other than that he completely failed to defend Communism.

DwnWthVwls · 08-09-2019, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

@Lucem I've heard him talk specifically about incels and he's said the opposite. That it's a man's own fault if women don't find them attractive.

I don't think he was defending any of that. He was basically trying to inject some nuance into the discussion over what is acceptable forms of sexuality in the workplace. You can accuse him of being a prude, but not of advocating any sort of harassment.

Possibly. Its been a while maybe im missremembering. I dont see how you can take a paoition against makeup though if that was his point. I didnt say he was advocating harassment i said he was justifying it (with his hyper prude position) and that incels could very easily use his speech to advocate for harassment.

**Frownland** · 08-09-2019, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

I've never heard him say anything pro incel or along the lines of men being owed women's attention or bodies

Enforced monogamy (even if he thinks it should be enforced by culture and not the gubmnet) as a way to control women's reproductive rights ("to protect the babies, you see") definitely reeks of male entitlement to women's bodies.

But let's say that none of these examples check the box, why do you think he attracts so many incels?

~~jwb~~ · 08-09-2019, 01:25 PM

Enforced monogamy just means monogamy as the cultural norm vs polygamy. You could easily argue women tended to have less rights in most polygamous societies.

I haven't seen any stats on him with incels. I know the self help angle largely appeals to young men who are struggling in one shape or fashion. tbh I've not read his book or anything and was mostly into the biblical lectures.

**Frownland** · 08-09-2019, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

Enforced monogamy just means monogamy as the cultural norm vs polygamy. You could easily argue women tended to have less rights in most polygamous societies.

I'm aware. One of his two key justifications for enforced monogamy is controlling women's reproduction, which is the incelly angle that I was pointing out.

Quote:

I haven't seen any stats on him with incels. I know the self help angle largely appeals to young men who are struggling in one shape or fashion. tbh I've not read his book or anything and was mostly into the biblical lectures.

So just the self help angle?

I see him in the same light as the dude who wrote The Bell Curve. They take some form of evidence to draw hasty conclusions to support what they already believe. Then they hide behind the fact that they never directly saying anything racist/sexist/etc., they're just telling everyone the FAXTS and that anyone criticizing their interpretation are criticizing the facts themselves.

But ja he's a solid biblical historian I'll give him that. Definitely the most interesting material he's put out.

08-09-2019, 01:25 PM	#2599 (permalink)
~~jwb~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 4,403	Enforced monogamy just means monogamy as the cultural norm vs polygamy. You could easily argue women tended to have less rights in most polygamous societies. I haven't seen any stats on him with incels. I know the self help angle largely appeals to young men who are struggling in one shape or fashion. tbh I've not read his book or anything and was mostly into the biblical lectures.