Political Discussions for "Adults"

TheBig3 · 07-28-2020, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

^That's exactly where I was going with that question. He somehow 'won the party' without having real power but being president would've been worthless? That's the confusion.

If you don't see that, I don't know if I can explain it to you. Without Bernie you don't have the Squad, you have no Green New Deal, and you don't have a resurgence of rust belt democrats who probably feel like you do about the Democratic Party.

The only thing Sanders hasn't been influential on is healthcare (which I have mixed feelings on) and when the impeachment happened and for what (which I'm glad his wing lost).

~~jwb~~ · 07-28-2020, 07:28 PM

You're misunderstanding me. I do see the influence. That was exactly the kind of thing I was referring to as symbolism which you dismissed as something we should get past and then went on to explain how important it was.

That's why my question was "by what mechanism" do you think he's changed the party. Which was basically just campaigning, disseminating ideas and sparking discussions.

Also, he has absolutely been influential on healthcare.

TheBig3 · 07-28-2020, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

You're misunderstanding me. I do see the influence. That was exactly the kind of thing I was referring to as symbolism which you dismissed as something we should get past and then went on to explain how important it was

I understood what you said to mean "winning the white house." Still, I wouldn't call what we're both talking about to be "symbolic." It's real legislative power.

**Frownland** · 07-28-2020, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBig3

jwb hasn't

Yes, but We, the Pragmatic Adults, surely we have had enough of this symbolism, yes? For we recognize after Obama that the presidency does not actually matter, which is why We could not have possibly elected Bernie into the office and have decided that Biden is the only Rational Choice. We, the Pragmatic Adults, who see through the Logical inconsistencies of these unfaithful Team players, surely we are not swayed by such insidious calls to action such as voting with so-called conscience and consistency, yes?

Astonished, I am, at the audacity of those who do not see what is clearly the Rational Choice like We, the Pragmatic Adults do. Do they not understand the contradictions of their philosophy despite We, the Pragmatic Adults explaining to them that they do not understand their own position? Curious, I say, and I think it is a fair basis to wholly dismiss them, for We know that they do not vote.

TheBig3 · 07-28-2020, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Yes, but We, the Pragmatic Adults, surely we have had enough of this symbolism, yes? For we recognize after Obama that the presidency does not actually matter, which is why We could not have possibly elected Bernie into the office and have decided that Biden is the only Rational Choice. We, the Pragmatic Adults, who see through the Logical inconsistencies of these unfaithful Team players, surely we are not swayed by such insidious calls to action such as voting with so-called conscience and consistency, yes?

Astonished, I am, at the audacity of those who do not see what is clearly the Rational Choice like We, the Pragmatic Adults do. Do they not understand the contradictions of their philosophy despite We, the Pragmatic Adults explaining to them that they don't understand their own position? Curious, I say, and I think it is a fair basis to wholly dismiss them, for We know that they do not vote.

Totally

~~jwb~~ · 07-28-2020, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBig3

I understood what you said to mean "winning the white house." Still, I wouldn't call what we're both talking about to be "symbolic." It's real legislative power.

what legislative power did he use to exert this influence you speak of?

Obviously the entire point of symbolism is to shift the scope of the discussion enough to translate to real legislative power eventually.

TheBig3 · 07-28-2020, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwb

what legislative power did he use to exert this influence you speak of?

Obviously the entire point of symbolism is to shift the scope of the discussion enough to translate to real legislative power eventually.

oh ffs, I tell ya what. You guys are all right, and I'm wrong. I hope you sleep well.

The Batlord · 07-28-2020, 07:50 PM

Look at the Mature Pragmatist leaving the internet arguing to the Immature Rabble. Performative losing at its best.

TheBig3 · 07-28-2020, 07:52 PM

You're welcome

**Frownland** · 07-28-2020, 07:54 PM

TheBig3: *slew of bad faith questions and astonishment that clearly exposes a bias*
jwb: *posts opinion and a follow up question, also pretty bad faith*
TheBig3: *gasp* How do you sleep at night?

07-28-2020, 07:54 PM	#7090 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	TheBig3: slew of bad faith questions and astonishment that clearly exposes a bias jwb: posts opinion and a follow up question, also pretty bad faith TheBig3: gasp How do you sleep at night? __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x

07-28-2020, 07:28 PM	#7082 (permalink)
~~jwb~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 4,403	You're misunderstanding me. I do see the influence. That was exactly the kind of thing I was referring to as symbolism which you dismissed as something we should get past and then went on to explain how important it was. That's why my question was "by what mechanism" do you think he's changed the party. Which was basically just campaigning, disseminating ideas and sparking discussions. Also, he has absolutely been influential on healthcare.

07-28-2020, 07:52 PM	#7089 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	You're welcome