OccultHawk

Roger that red skin

OccultHawk

https://berniesanders.com/issues/tax-extreme-wealth/

jwb

Pelosi reminds me a lot of the mom from arrested development

The Batlord

Can't unsee it now.

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Anteater

It's such a waste of everyone's time. The Ukrainian president said he wasn't pressured to take any kind of action. The Democrats have all these different targets they could chase (his tax returns, financial conflicts of interest, etc.) and they choose to hitch their horse to a Ukrainian wagon that isn't going anywhere.

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Frownland

Well if a politician said that nothing illegal happened then that puts the kibosh on this situation.

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Anteater

In this particular case, yes. Because their whole bitchfest is that Trump "pressured' another world leader against his will into investigating the Bidens and that there was some kind of quid pro quo. The Ukrainian president has no reason to take Trump's side if that's actually the case.

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jwb

he suspended aid to the Ukraine a few days before calling and asking them to try to dig up dirt on a political rival. He moved the tapes to a classified server that is meant for info sensitive for national security reasons - which this is not. Now he's issuing thinly veiled death threats to the whistleblower and people in his own administration that cooperate. He acts more like a mafia don than a prez.

Biden and his son are dirty in the Ukraine too though. But you're insane to think this isn't worthy of impeachment.

Anteater

It's small potatoes in a sense because there's a few things in the way, including a long historical "tradition" of Presidents "negotiating" in ways with a lot of latitude that would give us pause if we were to judge them in today's "faster than realtime" media environment where everyone knows everything that's going on and leaks happen faster than the Millennium Falcon jumping to lightspeed.

In other words, there's a "precedent" to this stuff and it ain't pretty. Also, a few other things to keep in mind-

1. Clinton signed some kind of treaty with Ukraine way back when that gives the POTUS pretty wide ranging powers in regards to mutual investigations of "corruption" (which is pretty vague, but it is law).

2. Republicans screamed bloody murder when Obama told Putin's people he could "be more flexible after the 2012 election" in regards to messing around with sanctions and other things, which was viewed at the time as a more literal quid pro quo and a touchy situation because of Obama's support of arming other European countries with NATO missile systems that could be turned towards Russia. Democrats defended him even when quite a few Republicans called for him to be impeached over the matter. Nothing ended up happening.

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Frownland

Not even the quid he gets?

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.