The Environmental Watchdog MasterThread

Mindy · 08-17-2019, 12:34 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpODZvJxXZo

Quote:

CNBC
Published on Aug 17, 2019

In Chandler, Arizona, a suburb of Phoenix, Waymo's fleet of 600 minivans shuttling people from place to place. Ordering one feels almost exactly like calling a Lyft or Uber, except for one thing: the vans drive themselves. Alphabet's Waymo has been testing self-driving vehicles in Arizona since 2017 and we got a look at what it's like.

Alphabet’s self-driving car company Waymo has built the world’s smartest vehicles with access to the world’s best artificial intelligence, but there’s one barrier that it might have underestimated: people.

In the last few months, the company has gained regulatory approvals, improved its driving systems using Alphabet’a AI assets and partnered with other auto manufacturers. Its cars have driven more miles than any other company’s.

But the community closest to Waymo’s main testing grounds in Phoenix, Arizona, said that the human element remains complicated, from hiring more drivers and support staff to working with city officials and emergency response staff.

CNBC visited Phoenix to check out Waymo’s progress earlier this month, weeks after the company launched its first actual business, Waymo One, a commercial robotaxi service in the Phoenix area. Meanwhile, competitors like Uber, Tesla and General Motors subsidiary Cruise are all planning their own self-driving car technology in a market estimated to garner $556.67 billion by 2026.

id try it if it didnt go over like 35 mph

OccultHawk · 08-17-2019, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

The Trump Admin continues to roll out its policy of trashing the planet for a quick buck and letting our grandchildren suffer the consequences. From today's BBC news:-

^ The real damage is in the legislation, although almost equally nauseating is the way the policy is dressed up as the reverse. In this case, "less legislation is going to mean better protection". This is comparable to another argument the Republicans favour, "We can only reduce gun violence by increasing the number of guns available."

If this all goes down how the Orange Monkey and His Rich Losers want it to Florida is going to lose lots of wildlife forever.

Lisnaholic · 08-18-2019, 09:24 AM

> Thnks fr the info, DwnWthVwls!

> That city of Waymo vehicles is just so Science Fiction, Mindlessness. I never expected The Jetsons to become a reality in Phoenix Arizona. I have to say, though, my first thought was: "And how many employment opportunities have been wiped out?"

> And in today's news, the first glacier in Iceland to be officially declared dead:-

Quote:

Iceland's Okjokull glacier commemorated with plaque

The plaque commemorates Okjokull, which once sat atop Ok volcano - "jokull" is Icelandic for glacier. Mourners are gathering in Iceland to commemorate the loss of Okjokull, which has died at the age of about 700.

The glacier was officially declared dead in 2014 when it was no longer thick enough to move. What once was glacier has been reduced to a small patch of ice atop a volcano.

Nice detail on the plaque: the last line about parts per million of CO2.

Mindy · 08-18-2019, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

> Thnks fr the info, DwnWthVwls!

> That city of Waymo vehicles is just so Science Fiction, Mindlessness. I never expected The Jetsons to become a reality in Phoenix Arizona. I have to say, though, my first thought was: "And how many employment opportunities have been wiped out?"

> And in today's news, the first glacier in Iceland to be officially declared dead:-

Nice detail on the plaque: the last line about parts per million of CO2.

Yeah bad for humans, I agree.... wish the best for you Lisnaholic

RL Clown · 08-19-2019, 11:56 AM

The issue is this: human beings are always going to want more and more. Human beings are always going to want better technology year after year... This is definitely the founding base of capitalism. This explains why cars keep on getting more and more high-tech and this explains why cell phones keep on advancing... But there is always a constant battle between technology and nature... All of these advancements come at the price of the planet. The more human beings take, the more they pollute,,, From an economic and marketing standpoint, everything looks very logical and everything looks good... Capitalism = Consumption = Productivity = Ownership = Increase in Revenue = Profit. But from an ecological/biological/natural standpoint, human beings are releasing so much sh*t into the environment. Now, I'm Mr. Sunshine (I try to look at things from an optimistic point of view...) I keep on telling myself that things will improve in the long run. But are things really improving?? The storms are becoming more and more extreme. Year after year, some places are becoming hotter and hotter and some places are becoming colder and colder. On the media, I've seen significant increases in tidal waves. If my math is wrong, please correct my math but I've heard that over the course of only five years, the average temperature of this planet has increased by 30 F... Now, I know what you're thinking... "30 F isn't much." 30 F isn't much but over the course of the years, with the smog effect and with the greenhouse gas effect, an increase by 30 F can be very, very DANGEROUS for this planet! This planet is in danger with several red flags! The big question is this: How do we make everyone happy? There's always a constant battle between economy and ecology... How do we continue to advance in technology and, at the same time, satisfy the demands of Mother Nature? I know what you're thinking... Reduce, reuse, recycle, But that's just not good enough... I think that at this point, Earth has been damaged beyond recovery... I don't have the answers... I'm a very philosophical type of guy but even I don't have the answers. Finally there's one important thing to note: The battle between nature and technology is kinda like the battle between good and evil. There will always be good in this world but there will always be evil in this world. too.

P.S.: Interestingly enough, nature can exist without technology. But technology cannot exist without nature. But if technology did not exist, then I would have to say good bye to my precious video games.

Lisnaholic · 08-19-2019, 07:23 PM

I think you are right to be concerned, RL Clown. Some of the points you raise have already been discussed at some length in this thread. If you have the patience, you could go back to pages 8 to 15, which are pretty on-topic by MB standards.

In answer to some specific things you said:-

> "But are things really improving??" Globally, no, they are not. By examining air bubbles locked in Antarctic ice, scientists have plotted methane levels going back ten thousand years:-

The bad news is that global temp follows in lockstep with methane levels, although it takes a few years to kick in. That's where I think we are right now, in that brief time lag between methane spike and temp spike.

> Not a big deal, but I would doubt your math tbh: 30°F is way to big a figure!!

> How do we make everyone happy? I doubt that's possible (or in fact ever has been in human history). To me, that's not the Big Question. The big question now is about limiting damage and surviving. Go back to those pages I mentioned and there'll be some suggestions there I'm sure. My own basic recs would be:-
- avoid buying stuff you don't need
- move away from coastal areas if you have that option
- on climate change, trust the scientists, not the politicians
- vote Trump out of office; his policies are making a bad scenario worse

OccultHawk · 08-19-2019, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

> Thnks fr the info, DwnWthVwls!

> That city of Waymo vehicles is just so Science Fiction, Mindlessness. I never expected The Jetsons to become a reality in Phoenix Arizona. I have to say, though, my first thought was: "And how many employment opportunities have been wiped out?"

> And in today's news, the first glacier in Iceland to be officially declared dead:-

Nice detail on the plaque: the last line about parts per million of CO2.

Makes my eyes tear up.

Lisnaholic · 08-20-2019, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

Makes my eyes tear up.

^ Sorry that it upset you, OH. These days that seems to be the price of awareness.

Unfortunately, Trump's EPA is doing its best to keep its eyes firmly closed: this quote from Wikipedia really needs an asterisk attached:-

Quote:

The global warming controversy concerns the public debate over whether global warming is occurring, how much has occurred in modern times, what has caused it, what its effects will be, whether any action should be taken to curb it, and if so what that action should be. In the scientific literature, there is a strong consensus that global surface temperatures have increased in recent decades and that the trend is caused by human-induced emissions of greenhouse gases. No scientific body of national or international standing disagrees with this view,* though a few organizations with members in extractive industries hold non-committal positions. Disputes over the key scientific facts of global warming are more prevalent in the media than in the scientific literature, where such issues are treated as resolved, and such disputes are more prevalent in the United States than globally.

* except the EPA, in this move which is a blatant travesty of scientific method:-

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

Trump's EPA has started to scrub climate change data from its website - LA Times

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________

A personal turning point for me was about a week ago when I had a dream based on environmental anxiety. The anxiety came from the the methane-level graph below:-

The graph turns up in this doc which I've already mentioned:-

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

Don't expect to learn much from this trailer, but if you watch the full documentary, (recently added to Netflix), you can learn a lot about the hard science behind climate history, and the really scary prognosis for planet earth:-

And the most chilling moment comes when the methane graph is overlaid with a temp rise graph with the clear message: we've got the one spike, so now expect the other.

RL Clown · 08-20-2019, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

My own basic recs would be:-
- avoid buying stuff you don't need
- move away from coastal areas if you have that option
- on climate change, trust the scientists, not the politicians
- vote Trump out of office; his policies are making a bad scenario worse

I agree with all of your points except the one about Donald Trump... People should not point the finger at Mr. Trump. If I'm not mistaken, Donald Trump mentioned something about clean coal. On a side note, I think that some industries really do get it (they understand the importance of environmental conservation.) But then again, some big billion dollar corporations really don't get it (they continue to pollute the environment as if it were a gigantic toilet bowl.) It is sad.

OccultHawk · 08-20-2019, 10:07 PM

Quote:

People should not point the finger at Mr. Trump

True. They should point AK’s at him instead.

08-19-2019, 07:23 PM	#496 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	I think you are right to be concerned, RL Clown. Some of the points you raise have already been discussed at some length in this thread. If you have the patience, you could go back to pages 8 to 15, which are pretty on-topic by MB standards. In answer to some specific things you said:- > "But are things really improving??" Globally, no, they are not. By examining air bubbles locked in Antarctic ice, scientists have plotted methane levels going back ten thousand years:- The bad news is that global temp follows in lockstep with methane levels, although it takes a few years to kick in. That's where I think we are right now, in that brief time lag between methane spike and temp spike. > Not a big deal, but I would doubt your math tbh: 30°F is way to big a figure!! > How do we make everyone happy? I doubt that's possible (or in fact ever has been in human history). To me, that's not the Big Question. The big question now is about limiting damage and surviving. Go back to those pages I mentioned and there'll be some suggestions there I'm sure. My own basic recs would be:- - avoid buying stuff you don't need - move away from coastal areas if you have that option - on climate change, trust the scientists, not the politicians - vote Trump out of office; his policies are making a bad scenario worse __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953

08-19-2019, 11:56 AM	#495 (permalink)
RL Clown Music Addict Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 182	The issue is this: human beings are always going to want more and more. Human beings are always going to want better technology year after year... This is definitely the founding base of capitalism. This explains why cars keep on getting more and more high-tech and this explains why cell phones keep on advancing... But there is always a constant battle between technology and nature... All of these advancements come at the price of the planet. The more human beings take, the more they pollute,,, From an economic and marketing standpoint, everything looks very logical and everything looks good... Capitalism = Consumption = Productivity = Ownership = Increase in Revenue = Profit. But from an ecological/biological/natural standpoint, human beings are releasing so much sht into the environment. Now, I'm Mr. Sunshine (I try to look at things from an optimistic point of view...) I keep on telling myself that things will improve in the long run. But are things really improving?? The storms are becoming more and more extreme. Year after year, some places are becoming hotter and hotter and some places are becoming colder and colder. On the media, I've seen significant increases in tidal waves. If my math is wrong, please correct my math but I've heard that over the course of only five years, the average temperature of this planet has increased by 30 F... Now, I know what you're thinking... "30 F isn't much." 30 F isn't much but over the course of the years, with the smog effect and with the greenhouse gas effect, an increase by 30 F can be very, very DANGEROUS for this planet! This planet is in danger with several red flags! The big question is this: How do we make everyone happy?* There's always a constant battle between economy and ecology... How do we continue to advance in technology and, at the same time, satisfy the demands of Mother Nature? I know what you're thinking... Reduce, reuse, recycle, But that's just not good enough... I think that at this point, Earth has been damaged beyond recovery... I don't have the answers... I'm a very philosophical type of guy but even I don't have the answers. Finally there's one important thing to note: The battle between nature and technology is kinda like the battle between good and evil. There will always be good in this world but there will always be evil in this world. too. P.S.: Interestingly enough, nature can exist without technology. But technology cannot exist without nature. But if technology did not exist, then I would have to say good bye to my precious video games.