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Originally Posted by Anteater
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As Jansz said, civilisation is where man became civilised, not where he originated. Islam had writing and maths as far as I remember reading way before the West did. Their science was streets ahead of ours. Iraq has in fact been referred to many times as literally that: "the cradle of civilsation".
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Originally Posted by Rjinn
I find "advancement of society" a little vague. What advancements do you necessarily mean and what does that exactly prove?
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Science, tech, maths, literature, engineering, medicine ... you know. Advancements.
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Originally Posted by riseagainstrocks
It's almost like a full century of European colonial powers invading, supporting unpopular regimes, geographically reapportioning, siphoning resources, and then leaving due to military and political exhaustion after World War II had a negative effect on the internal development of places with few natural resource advantages and a several thousand year history of tribal culture.
Seriously, what are you hoping to get from your question? For Janszoon, elphenor, Rjinn, and myself to say "you got us, they're only good at blowing themselves up and stoning women to death - those damn Muslims"?
I'm not sure how many different ways there are to say 'fundamentalism is a bad thing, people who kill for their god are unstable, and when it appears to be a culturally approved act there is usually a larger explanation, which in the case of the Middle East and Islam, the genesis of today's unrest is the political history of a region not allowed to develop free of outside influence.'
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Remember that all I'm doing here is pointing out why Ant's meme does in fact make sense. Whether you agree with it or not, the point is that it does make a good case for Islam having deliberately held back advances. After all, they refuse to allow women to be educated, don't they? So they retard fifty percent of their population/adherents. How many women in the West can you name who made massively important discoveries and "advanced society"? I'm not saying the West didn't play its part in keeping Islam down, but they're basically advocating remaining in the Dark Ages with their religious beliefs, no?
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