Science!

DwnWthVwls · 04-11-2019, 07:39 PM

so i dont have free will to decide elbows or shells?

DwnWthVwls · 04-11-2019, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dharma & Greg

It's not a question of intelligence, but I'm stymied about how I'm not getting through. People just be so attached to being people that they can't admit the sky's blue. I mean I think the reason I'm so ready to accept it is that I'm so depersonalized that thinking that I'm nothing isn't much of a stretch. People with real self-esteem are naturally going to be harder to convince.

So are skeptics when you cant justify your belief with evidence. Every other example on OHs list has evidence.

OccultHawk · 04-11-2019, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls

so i dont have free will to decide elbows or shells?

Of course not

**Frownland** · 04-11-2019, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dharma & Greg

Alright let's take this post you made in the Free Will thread.

In order for an action to be cancelled it must either be mathematically predictable, which cancels out free will, or it must be decided essentially by a random number generator, which also cancels out free will because then no decision is being made. You're simply a victim of literal chaos. You're a ship adrift on an ocean with no engine, no oars, no sail, no rudder, and the ocean isn't even an ocean because the movement of water is defined by math so it's nothing more than an abstract nothingness where anything and everything are possible. There is no middle ground where free will is allowed to exist.

Well if it's complex and seemingly frivolous then clearly no math is involved.

I will concede that our brains are predictably wired to make decisions.

DwnWthVwls · 04-11-2019, 07:48 PM

Cool. Now demonstrate why.

**Frownland** · 04-11-2019, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls

Cool. Now demonstrate why.

Our neurons interact in a certain manner to effect bodily processes when a range of processes are available.

The Batlord · 04-11-2019, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

You “accept” it because it’s clear and obvious.

Well yeah but it's so clear and obvious because I don't have overriding concerns about preserving a nebulous concept of my humanity. I've cast it aside cause I never had it and all I'm left with is performing empty actions as a human construct that have little emotional value to me in any sense of an important human narrative. Accepting that I'm an automaton doesn't challenge my sense of worth cause I have an atrophied sense of worth. I'm simply "lucky" in that my natural view happens to be the most obviously logical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls

So are skeptics when you cant justify your belief with evidence. Every other example on OHs list has evidence.

You're not being a skeptic when you cling to emotional needs to see yourself as having agency. It's a pretty simple idea: without proof of free will the default should be to assume it doesn't exist.

The Batlord · 04-11-2019, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

I will concede that our brains are predictably wired to make decisions.

You concede to half-logic.

**Frownland** · 04-11-2019, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dharma & Greg

Accepting that I'm an automaton doesn't challenge my sense of worth cause I have an atrophied sense of worth

Since we're playing the straw man game, you only believe in that because you don't want to accept responsibility for your actions.

My issue with determinism isn't based on its implications, it's based on its unfalsifiability and reliance on fallacies.

DwnWthVwls · 04-11-2019, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dharma & Greg

You're not being a skeptic when you cling to emotional needs to see yourself as having agency. It's a pretty simple idea: without proof of free will the default should be to assume it doesn't exist.

Whats the default position when someone claims it doesnt exist and hasnt met their burden of proof?

I havent made a claim about either and Im not convinced of either claim as they have both failed in demonstrating their validity.