Britain over Syria: your thoughts?

Trollheart · 12-03-2015, 08:55 PM

My main question though has not been addressed. I never expected the vote to go any other way, yet I'd still say this is hypocritical of the Tories given their lambasting of Labour over Iraq but anyway.... how is this going to make Britain safer? How can he even make that claim? When Britain went to war against Germany, Churchill didn't sugarcoat it: he said it would be tough, dark days, nothing to offer you but blood and tears etc. Yet Cameron is telling his people that Britain will be safer now that they have joined in the bombing of Syria. Where's the logic in that? Where's the proof?

Nameless · 12-04-2015, 12:16 AM

Stopping ISIS from growing in influence will probably make some places somewhat safer. Not many people seem to respect the fact that ISIS like, controls territory, they collect taxes, direct traffic, have kind of an economy, stuff like that. It's exactly like fighting a country right now. There are actual places to bomb for reasons outside of "they might be in that cave".

Trollheart · 12-04-2015, 06:19 AM

Yes,but they have already admitted that this offensive will NOT stop IS. Maybe had he said "it's the first step in making Britain safer", possibly. But what he said is, to me, very disingenuous and is obviously calculated to tell his people yes we're doing the right thing and you'll be safer because of it, while there is no empirical evidence to back that up.

Back to WWII: Churchill could have said this, as if Britain had not gone to war with its allies behind it, the Nazis would have (and did) swarmed across Europe and eventually reached Britain. Yes, that might happen at some point in the future with ISIS, but by then EVERYONE would be at war with them and nobody could be said to be safe(r).

I think it was the wrong thing to say. I know he doesn't want to panic anyone, but a more honest (oh stop it, you're killing me!) declaration would have been "We may be risking our safety but this is the right thing to do, and in the long run, if we achieve our objectives, we will be safer."

RoxyRollah · 12-04-2015, 06:26 AM

At some point tho if all over the world ppl are fed up with your radical Muslim antics and **** starting you are gonns get some very powerful enemies....My country well our commander and chief is a pussy but I support my European brethren...Why havent we hit the red button yet?

Chula Vista · 12-04-2015, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoxyRollah

My country well our commander and chief is a pussy.

Quote:

The list of senior terrorists killed during the Obama presidency is fairly extensive.

There’s Osama bin Laden , of course, killed in May.

Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula (AQAP) leader Anwar al-Awlaki as of today.

Earlier this month officials confirmed that al Qaeda’s chief of Pakistan operations, Abu Hafs al-Shahri , was killed in Waziristan, Pakistan.

In August, ‘Atiyah ‘Abd al-Rahman , the deputy leader of al Qaeda was killed.

In June, one of the group’s most dangerous commanders, Ilyas Kashmiri, was killed in Pakistan. In Yemen that same month, AQAP senior operatives Ammar al-Wa’ili, Abu Ali al-Harithi, and Ali Saleh Farhan were killed. In Somalia, Al-Qa’ida in East Africa (AQEA) senior leader Harun Fazul was killed.

Administration officials also herald the recent U.S./Pakistani joint arrest of Younis al-Mauritani in Quetta.

Going back to August 2009, Tehrik e-Taliban Pakistan leader Baitullah Mahsud was killed in Pakistan.

In September of that month, Jemayah Islamiya operational planner Noordin Muhammad Top was killed in Indonesia, and AQEA planner Saleh Ali Saleh Nabhan was killed in Somalia.

Then in December 2009 in Pakistan, al Qaeda operational commanders Saleh al-Somali and ‘Abdallah Sa’id were killed.

In February 2010, in Pakistan, Taliban deputy and military commander Abdul Ghani Beradar was captured; Haqqani network commander Muhammad Haqqani was killed; and Lashkar-e Jhangvi leader Qari Zafar was killed.

In March 2010, al Qaeda operative Hussein al-Yemeni was killed in Pakistan, while senior Jemayah Islamiya operative Dulmatin - accused of being the mastermind behind the 2002 Bali bombings – was killed during a raid in Indonesia.

In April 2010, al Qaeda in Iraq leaders Abu Ayyub al-Masri and Abu Omar al-Baghdadi were killed.

In May, al Qaeda’s number three commander, Sheik Saeed al-Masri was killed.

In June 2010 in Pakistan, al Qaeda commander Hamza al-Jawfi was killed.

Remember when Rudy Giuliani warned that electing Barack Obama would mean that the U.S. played defense, not offense, against the terrorists?

If this is defense, what does offense look like?

-Jake Tapper

He may be reluctant to get a bunch of young kids killed in ground combat but he's been more than focused on chopping off the major limbs. Again, how do you go to war against an ideology that's spread across the planet like a virus?

Mr. Charlie · 12-04-2015, 01:08 PM

Trollheart · 12-04-2015, 01:24 PM

Steve Earle! Hermano!

Chula Vista · 12-04-2015, 01:29 PM

Ya, very poignant stuff. Rich man's war indeed.

Forward he cried from the rear
and the front rank died
And the General sat, as the lines on the map
moved from side to side

The Batlord · 12-04-2015, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoxyRollah

At some point tho if all over the world ppl are fed up with your radical Muslim antics and **** starting you are gonns get some very powerful enemies....My country well our commander and chief is a pussy but I support my European brethren...Why havent we hit the red button yet?

"The red button"?

Chula Vista · 12-04-2015, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

"The red button"?

Period?

12-03-2015, 08:55 PM	#21 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	My main question though has not been addressed. I never expected the vote to go any other way, yet I'd still say this is hypocritical of the Tories given their lambasting of Labour over Iraq but anyway.... how is this going to make Britain safer? How can he even make that claim? When Britain went to war against Germany, Churchill didn't sugarcoat it: he said it would be tough, dark days, nothing to offer you but blood and tears etc. Yet Cameron is telling his people that Britain will be safer now that they have joined in the bombing of Syria. Where's the logic in that? Where's the proof? __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

12-04-2015, 06:19 AM	#23 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	Yes,but they have already admitted that this offensive will NOT stop IS. Maybe had he said "it's the first step in making Britain safer", possibly. But what he said is, to me, very disingenuous and is obviously calculated to tell his people yes we're doing the right thing and you'll be safer because of it, while there is no empirical evidence to back that up. Back to WWII: Churchill could have said this, as if Britain had not gone to war with its allies behind it, the Nazis would have (and did) swarmed across Europe and eventually reached Britain. Yes, that might happen at some point in the future with ISIS, but by then EVERYONE would be at war with them and nobody could be said to be safe(r). I think it was the wrong thing to say. I know he doesn't want to panic anyone, but a more honest (oh stop it, you're killing me!) declaration would have been "We may be risking our safety but this is the right thing to do, and in the long run, if we achieve our objectives, we will be safer." __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

12-04-2015, 01:24 PM	#27 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,992	Steve Earle! Hermano! __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

12-04-2015, 01:29 PM	#28 (permalink)
Chula Vista Toasted Poster Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: SoCal by way of Boston Posts: 11,332	Ya, very poignant stuff. Rich man's war indeed. Forward he cried from the rear and the front rank died And the General sat, as the lines on the map moved from side to side __________________ “The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.”

12-04-2015, 12:16 AM	#22 (permalink)
Nameless Fat girls in yoga pants Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 152	Stopping ISIS from growing in influence will probably make some places somewhat safer. Not many people seem to respect the fact that ISIS like, controls territory, they collect taxes, direct traffic, have kind of an economy, stuff like that. It's exactly like fighting a country right now. There are actual places to bomb for reasons outside of "they might be in that cave".

12-04-2015, 01:08 PM	#26 (permalink)
Mr. Charlie Shoo Thoughts Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: These Mountains Posts: 2,308