John Wilkes Booth

it's more mainstream than you might think

maybe not among american muslims, but certainly on a global scale. i mean look at the laws in saudi arabia for starters.

can you be more specific? which islamic extremists in particular are you saying are more politically motivated, and to what end?
the basic tenets of the religion are arguably the most repressive and barbaric manifestation of abrahamic religon to date...

so it's prejudiced to point that out? cause he's white and they're brown? would you raise the same objection if a white person criticized christianity in the same way? or if a non-white former muslim criticized islam in such a way? is it only that he happens to be the wrong race to criticize islam?

The Batlord

Back up there, Sonny Jim. You're not debating Sansa. If I think Sam Harris is prejudiced, I'd like to think my lack of giving a **** about much of anything would give me the benefit of the doubt that I'm not just being PC. It's been forever and a day since I read any Sam Harris, so I can't point out specific points that he made, just a vibe that's more emotionally antagonistic than seems consistent for him.

__________________

Frownland

That's more cultural, really. What about Indonesia? They have the highest number of Muslims out of any country in the world and they don't have Shariah implanted within their laws except for cases regarding marriage among Muslims (these religious juries can't judge non-Muslims in these cases). That's not to mention the mass amount of sects within Islam itself or even within the Sunni, Shia, or Sufi, many of which have conflicting viewpoints on how to determine which fatwas should be accepted. However, pretty much across the board, these sects denounce the killing of innocent people and some more specifically denounce terrorism.

Would you happen to have any stats for the globalism that you describe? 1.2 billion people is quite a massive group to generalize.

Well, 9/11 comes to mind.

__________________

Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Guybrush

I saw this in my facebook feed one day. Apparently, in the province of Aceh in Indonesia, sharia law practices have been increasing and their laws govern and punish both muslims and non-muslims.

Sharia Showdown | Current Affairs | Dateline | SBS

__________________
Something Completely Different

John Wilkes Booth

i'll respond to you guys more fully when i get off work in 12-13 hours from now, but for now

batlord: nah, no benefit of the doubt. you're just saying he's prejudiced for calling islam out specifically without going beyond that. so it sounds like a sansa-esque accusation, though you might not be sansa.

frownland: try reading the looming tower. or google sayyid qutb. long story short, you're wrong about 9/11 / osama and his band of bearded misfits.

The Batlord

And you sound like you're supporting him for criticizing Islam simply because you agree with the general premise of criticizing Islam.

__________________

Oriphiel

Too soon...

Oh, poor old Sonny Jim.

__________________
----------------------
|---Mic's Albums---|
----------------------
-----------------------------
|---Deafbox Industries---|
-----------------------------

John Wilkes Booth

I do. But mostly I agree with his sentiment that liberals and atheists tend to stick to this dogmatic talking point that all religions are equally dangerous, and that western liberals have a tendency to tread much more lightly with Islam than they do with Christianity out of fear of coming across as bigoted. I think that's part of why he deals with Islam so roughly.

Tbh I don't agree completely with his views on Islam. I think he exaggerates the threat and glosses over some of the nuances when dealing with the motivations of extremists. I just have sat and watched the islamaphobia term cast at any one who criticizes Islam for years now and it's left a sour taste on my mouth.

The Batlord

So basically we saw the same ****ing things, you *******. Like I said, it's not so much the rhetoric that I necessarily disagree with. It's the tone. Of course, it could be like you say, that he's just drawing attention to Islam, but then that kind of makes him like Rush Limbaugh banging the drum against the liberal threat.

__________________

Chula Vista

Pretty Much.

My sister goes to bed each night praying to her God. It makes her feel good. It helps her through her day. I believe in her God.

__________________

“The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well,
on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away
and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.”